wdyt -- religious symbols at school

[rosesandpetals]

s/o of the politics thread AG started. What  do you think of teachers wearing t-shirts with religious sayings and bible verses on them on casual days?

It happens at my school. Though to be  fair, the shirt in question had all fancy, decorative fonts and I don't think most people realized what it said. I was trying to imagine the reaction if I wore a "In the beginning, man created God" t-shirt.

[andrewsgal]

I don't like it not one bit. I wouldn't say anything but it irritates me.

[Deleted]

NOPE. Don't like it but wouldn't say anything.

[penguingrrl]

I would not be happy. A public school teacher's religion and politics should never be public knowledge beyond maybe saying they celebrate Hannukah or Christmas in conversation.

[Deleted]

I would not be okay with that at all. Just like it probably wouldn't be welcome for someone to wear a shirt with atheist or humanist sentiments on it, it's not ok to wear something with any kind of religious tone to it. It doesn't belong at a public school. Personal religious opinions stay at home.

[rosesandpetals]

Glad I'm not alone in not liking it. I didn't say anything but I was surprised. I really shouldn't be, it seems like religion is everywhere around here.

[lala]

A Tshirt as described does cross then line, I think.

But I don't know that you can say religion stays at home 100%. Because that would forbid wearing yarmulkes, hijabs, etc. what about a cross necklace or Star of David necklace?

I really don't know the answer to that, I'm just wondering aloud.

[momin2013]

Feb 6, 2016 19:21:08 GMT -5 lala said:

A Tshirt as described does cross then line, I think.

But I don't know that you can say religion stays at home 100%. Because that would forbid wearing yarmulkes, hijabs, etc. what about a cross necklace or Star of David necklace?

I really don't know the answer to that, I'm just wondering aloud.

I wonder the same thing. I mean, people wear other religious symbols like cross necklaces, etc. all the time. It sort of seems like a slippery slope, like wearing a cross necklace is o.k., but a t-shirt with a bible verse is not? Is is just because there are actual words involved?

I guess I've always been of the mind that people should be free to express themselves (including their religion), as long as they're not harming others.

[rosesandpetals]

I think the difference is, the message is more overt -- it says "he died for your sins", not "I believe in a man who died for my sins."

Although I am a grumpy bitch and I don't think cross necklaces/jewelry are appropriate either. Your religion requiring you to wear a hijab is different than you choosing to wear a cross necklace IMO. I wouldn't have a problem with a  christian teacher having ashes on their forehead on ash wednesday, for example.

[lattelady5]

I don't think it's an issue unless it's disruptive. A barely legible bible verse on a shirt isn't anything offensive or bothersome. I think it should be true of any religion or humanism (as mentioned earlier) though.

[vettymama]

Feb 6, 2016 23:04:13 GMT -5 lattelady5 said:

I don't think it's an issue unless it's disruptive. A barely legible bible verse on a shirt isn't anything offensive or bothersome. I think it should be true of any religion or humanism (as mentioned earlier) though.

I'm here. I think actual spoken words regarding religion and politics is much more of an issue.

[rosesandpetals]

I guess I don't see what legibility has to do with it. It is about what it says not how easy it is to read... if it said "fuck you" in barely-legible print, that wouldn't make it any better?

I have a hard time believing anyone would be okay with a teacher wearing a shirt that said, "God isn't real." /shrug

[lattelady5]

Feb 6, 2016 23:47:55 GMT -5 rosesandpetals said:

I guess I don't see what legibility has to do with it. It is about what it says not how easy it is to read... if it said "fuck you" in barely-legible print, that wouldn't make it any better?

I have a hard time believing anyone would be okay with a teacher wearing a shirt that said, "God isn't real." /shrug

Well, no. An F you should would be disruptive.

A shirt with "Love is patient, Love is kind..." Or something like that surely isn't that bothersome.

[rosesandpetals]

Feb 7, 2016 0:03:26 GMT -5 lattelady5 said:

Feb 6, 2016 23:47:55 GMT -5 rosesandpetals said:

I guess I don't see what legibility has to do with it. It is about what it says not how easy it is to read... if it said "fuck you" in barely-legible print, that wouldn't make it any better?

I have a hard time believing anyone would be okay with a teacher wearing a shirt that said, "God isn't real." /shrug

Well, no. An F you should would be disruptive.

A shirt with "Love is patient, Love is kind..." Or something like that surely isn't that bothersome.

Not if you're christian and you want your kid around it 24/7. FTR, it said stuff like, "He died for our sins", "He is risen", "Jesus is lord", etc. So  not offensive stuff but it is just promoting religious ideas like they're fact. And I think it would be disruptive for a student who wasn't raised with religion. I know I wouldn't appreciate people in positions of authority telling DD (directly or no) that jesus died for her, just like I don't tell other people's kids that god isn't real. It isn't professional.

[lala]

Well it's probably not very professional to wear any screen print t-shirt except for the school ones, even on casual friday. But for me screen print t-shirts are gym or pajama attire, so I know I'm the odd one out there.

Like I said above, I do agree the t-shirt seems too much. I just still wonder where the line is.

[nowa]

Shit... I was going to say hell no but then Lala made a good point. My gut is still hell no because words to me signal that the person/teacher is trying to tell people about her religion. A symbol like a cross or a hijab or whatever isn't telling someone that they too should wear those things. A shirt that says Jesus is God or something is like actually telling my kid, Jesus is God and no. I don't believe that and I don't want you passively teaching that to my kid either.

[nowa]

Obviously the issue here is that it's a teacher. I wouldn't care if a student wore that shirt. But a teacher is in a place of authority.

[vettymama]

Totally agree, a teacher wearing any screen print shirt is terrible. No matter what's on it. Except school attire.

[nicolewi]

It wouldn't bother me. I don't really know where the line is and whether it's "right," but in the name of tolerance I think it's okay. Parents could always explain that Teacher believes XYZ, even if that is different from what the student's family believes. I agree that this then applies to any religion.

The district may need a policy on this. Maybe they could decide what's allowable, i.e. yes to cross or Star of David necklaces, but no to shirts promoting any certain faith. Wearing a shirt is to a personal expression that is much different than actively preaching to the kids. I do think there's a difference between a scrolly Bible verse, and a crucifixion image.

[rosesandpetals]

Feb 7, 2016 7:44:53 GMT -5 lala said:

Well it's probably not very professional to wear any screen print t-shirt except for the school ones, even on casual friday. But for me screen print t-shirts are gym or pajama attire, so I know I'm the odd one out there.

Like I said above, I do agree the t-shirt seems too much. I just still wonder where the line is.

Lol, it's funny because this person wears stuff I don't think is appropriate all the time... leggings as pants, sneakers 3 - 4 days/week, etc. That's a totally different issue. I think the administration is picking their battles and/or biding time.

Also, her students are older.I'm sure they've been exposed to other religions and had that conversation with their family, so I'm sure that changes things a little, though it would still bother me if it were my kid.

[NandaB]

well I would have a huge issue with the "he dies for you" part, especially if my child could read it because we recently lost a loved one and it was hard enough to explain death to my 4 yr old with out explaining that one.

[rosesandpetals]

Feb 7, 2016 17:54:25 GMT -5 NandaB said:

well I would have a huge issue with the "he dies for you" part, especially if my child could read it because we recently lost a loved one and it was hard enough to explain death to my 4 yr old with out explaining that one.

For sure. But she is 5th grade so it is a little different.