Books in School

[grover]

Are there any books that you feel should not be found (due to violence) in a middle/high school classroom or whole school library? SO, books the student can check out to read independently, NOT used as curriculum.

This was this weeks discussion post in my grad class, and I was surprised at some of the replies.

[AJL]

Shades of Grey trilogy because it is probably one of the worst written series of all time. The writing is so fucking terrible!

But in all seriousness, I think at the high school level, nothing should be censored. At the elementary and middle school level, I think a good librarian would be able to curate a collection based on the interests of his or her school. While I don't think a school library should have every book available, I do think that a librarian should be allowed to recommend books based on students' interests and direct them to where they can get that book.

I'm curious as to what your classmates said.

[revjen]

I'm curious too. Because some of the books that people try to ban/censor are ridiculous.

[booknerd]

What were their replies?

My parents never banned or censored any of the books I read growing up, and I really enjoyed that freedom to read whatever I was interested in. If anything made me uncomfortable or was too difficult to comprehend, I'd just ask them about it. No big deal.

I don't think high school libraries should censor books. I do think middle schools should though, based on maturity level at least. There are some books I read that now make me judge my parents a little for letting me read them in middle school.

[dorothyinAus]

I don't know of any specific titles, because I don't generally read graphic depictions of violence or sex, but I can see the argument for age-appropriateness in the library selections.  I would err on the side of exclusion rather than inclusion for most questionable books for a school library.  It's impossible to know the maturity level of everyone, so it's better to keep potentially questionable material out.  It also means there will be fewer parental complaints.  And that's important.

I can also see taking a rather broad view when defining pornography, or anything that approaches it, for the purposes of a school library.  I don't agree with individual censorship -- that's an issue for parents and students to work out -- but there are public libraries and bookstores for books not available or appropriate for school libraries.

[ThirdandLong]

I feel there is a world of difference between the level of maturity of a middle school kid and a high school kid. That's such a broad range - 11 to 17. So much growing up between those years. If I maintained a middle school library, Yes, I would censor their reading material to be more age appropriate. To me, 11/12/13... they're still kids.

Somewhat related, I wrote a note to the librarian at my son's school, expressing my displeasure that he at 7 years old was able to check out a book on zombies. This was not a scooby doo cartoonish book. This was a Walking Dead type, realistic makeups book that included a section on voodoo, and my 5 year old daughter screamed and burst into tears as soon as he pulled it out of his backpack because the cover photo was horrifying. There were nightmares, as well.  Look! I get that we have to censor this in our home, and we DO. But he had clearly viewed the book at school, and he's naive and doesn't know better until we have a conversation about it.

[litskispeciality]

I'm not familiar with what's in Middle School libraries anymore, but I guess I lean more toward if it gets them to read it's good. I *could* see something like the Hunger Games being a bit too mature for maybe a 6th -7th grader, but they're fast and gets them to read 3 books. As other posts have said, parents can sensor with the best judgement if appropriate.

I'd be curious to see what was suggested to sensor.

[Nonny]

As a general rule, I'm against any form of censorship of books in libraries, but I'm also realistic and recognize that any given library (particularly a small library, such as one at a school) can't be all encompassing of everything. For something like a school where there is a known age range I think it's reasonable to check the age ranges of books and steer the book collection towards that age rage, with some leeway for readers at the extreme edges of the spectrum.  I wouldn't expect an elementary school library to be stocking Stephen King, just as I wouldn't expect picture books in a high school library.

The Hunger Games is actually an interesting example here, because I would expect to find the trilogy in an elementary school library for the 6th graders, as well as at the high school library.  That could of course mean 4th graders picking it up, it's certainly something I would have done, and my parents wouldn't have cared because they never restricted what I read.   But it wouldn't be OK in my mind for another 4th graders parents to throw a fit about it and keep all the other kids from reading it because they didn't want their preshus to have access - that's something they need to handle at home.

[grover]

Basically all of the replies said that the following books are not appropriate for a middle school (6-9) classroom:
Hunger Games
Mockingjay
Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
A child called it
Monument 14
Infinite Sea (BOok 2 of Fifth Wave trilogy)
Brothers Grimm
Absolutely True Diary of a Part-Time Indian
The Kite Runner
Give a Boy a Gun (Todd Strasser)
My Brother Sam is Dead
Lord of the Flies
Breathing Underwater
The Bluest Eye


Also they said that Goosebumps series was imappropriate for 4th graders.

[Nonny]

Jun 30, 2016 18:35:06 GMT -5 grover said:

Basically all of the replies said that the following books are not appropriate for a middle school (6-9) classroom:
Hunger Games
Mockingjay
Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince
A child called it
Monument 14
Infinite Sea (BOok 2 of Fifth Wave trilogy)
Brothers Grimm
Absolutely True Diary of a Part-Time Indian
The Kite Runner
Give a Boy a Gun (Todd Strasser)
My Brother Sam is Dead
Lord of the Flies
Breathing Underwater
The Bluest Eye


Also they said that Goosebumps series was imappropriate for 4th graders.

I've only read 5 of those myself, but I'm at least vaguely familiar with most of them, and the only one on that list giving me slight pause is A Child Called It. Isn't that a memoir of questionable authenticity about severe child abuse?  That seems like an odd choice for middle school library for research or pleasure reading purposes, but everything else seems fine.  Also, I didn't realize The Kite Runner was considered YA.

Goosebumps series might be inappropriate for easily scared 4th graders, but they are horror comedy!  They are fun! 

I'm curious about the ages of the people in your class, and your general geographic region. Are these deeply religious people who see Harry Potter and think "ZOMG! WITCHCRAFt! DEBILWORSHIP!" but have never actually read the books? (I know people like this; I was staying with some friends at a family beach house and they had a book laying around arguing about how HP promoted Satan, and whoever had written it clearly had never read any HP at all.)

Your classmates and I wouldn't get along very well.

[secretlyevil]

No, each person is unique and should have full acces school. It should also be parents call. However, parents should not have a say on the library's material as a whole just what their child can read.

[secretlyevil]

The Kite Runner was rough for me to read as an adult. I still believe it's up to parents to decide what their child can read.

[grover]

Jun 30, 2016 19:29:02 GMT -5 Nonny said:

Jun 30, 2016 18:35:06 GMT -5 grover said:

I've only read 5 of those myself, but I'm at least vaguely familiar with most of them, and the only one on that list giving me slight pause is A Child Called It. Isn't that a memoir of questionable authenticity about severe child abuse?  That seems like an odd choice for middle school library for research or pleasure reading purposes, but everything else seems fine.  Also, I didn't realize The Kite Runner was considered YA.

Goosebumps series might be inappropriate for easily scared 4th graders, but they are horror comedy!  They are fun! 

I'm curious about the ages of the people in your class, and your general geographic region. Are these deeply religious people who see Harry Potter and think "ZOMG! WITCHCRAFt! DEBILWORSHIP!" but have never actually read the books? (I know people like this; I was staying with some friends at a family beach house and they had a book laying around arguing about how HP promoted Satan, and whoever had written it clearly had never read any HP at all.)

Your classmates and I wouldn't get along very well.

I feel like the odd man out in my class.  It's a Chicago burbs university, technically a Catholic University.  I feel that my department covers ourselves by having parent permission to check out from our library, and generally don't offer the more mature books to all students- just the ones we know have interest/can handle the mature content. We had a few parents say anything but Stephen King/Harry Potter was okay, and the student respected that.  We also give a heads up if for example, the character refers to rape (like in Speak or Lovely Bones) so the student knows it before starting it, and can choose not to read it. We also tell students to abandon books if they don't like them for whatever reason, including if they are uncomfortable with the content.

Here's reasoning for Harry Potter- "One book that I feel is too violent to be included is Harry Potter and the Half-blood Prince. I feel it is too questionable to include at this level but would be better enjoyed by older students and adults. I know that this is probably a controversial stand, but I feel this is a book series that is better left to parents to decide if their son/daughter should read it."

Reasoning for Hunger Games- 
-" It is possible that many will disagree with my choice, as the series is very popular (as well as a hit movie), but I thought the series was too adult for middle school students. The usual Hunger Games violence of bombings, murders, executions. Katniss' friend Finnick has his head bitten off by a pack of lizard mutations. Although Collins is a very artful writer (and the story ends with the main character getting married and raising a family in peace), the sheer number of violent deaths and acts within the entire series was enough to turn me away. Also, I did not like the fact that teenagers were forced to engage in this level of graphic violence; yes, we all hear of teens engaging in gang related activities that result in horrible outcomes, but I believe this is the exception, not the norm. I also believe that the themes in the story are also presented in an adult fashion. The stories themselves are fascinating and explore the ideology of revolution and totalitarianism, however, the level of deaths ,( like Finnick) are sometimes too gruesome and I find it detracting to the rest of the story."
-" I’m okay with students reading this book on their own time, but I don’t think dystopian fiction is a good topic to teach to a group a adolescents who are already concerned with their ever changing world. When I was young, I read a book called Amnesia Moon by Jonathon Lethem and it stuck with me. I think its more important to plant seeds of hope rather than seeds of fear in our students."

[aurora]

I'm generally opposed to book censorship, but I also would not expect a middle school library to have a full collection of adult books for logistical and budgetary reasons.

I think HP is very respectful in its treatment of death and absolutely should be available to middle schoolers. I know I would have read it if it had been published when I was 12-13.

In the Hunger Games, the most horrifying part to me is the premise that kids must kill kids, not the actual violence described. I can definitely see why parents would want to weigh in on when their children are old enough to read this series.

[anastasia517]

Jul 1, 2016 8:58:16 GMT -5 aurora said:

I'm generally opposed to book censorship, but I also would not expect a middle school library to have a full collection of adult books for logistical and budgetary reasons.

I think HP is very respectful in its treatment of death and absolutely should be available to middle schoolers. I know I would have read it if it had been published when I was 12-13.

In the Hunger Games, the most horrifying part to me is the premise that kids must kill kids, not the actual violence described. I can definitely see why parents would want to weigh in on when their children are old enough to read this series.

I was 11 when OOTP came out and 13 for HBP. My sister would have been 10/12. We read them when they came out, as did most people I knew.

When I student taught middle school, nearly all the 12 & 13 year olds had read The Hunger Games.

And add me to the list of people who had a hard time with The Kite Runner. We read that in class in Grade 12 (so 17).  Lord of the Flies, on the other hand, was one of the more popular required reading books from what I remember in Grade 10.

[GilliC]

Jun 30, 2016 20:05:57 GMT -5 grover said:

I feel like the odd man out in my class.  It's a Chicago burbs university, technically a Catholic University.  I feel that my department covers ourselves by having parent permission to check out from our library, and generally don't offer the more mature books to all students- just the ones we know have interest/can handle the mature content. We had a few parents say anything but Stephen King/Harry Potter was okay, and the student respected that.  We also give a heads up if for example, the character refers to rape (like in Speak or Lovely Bones) so the student knows it before starting it, and can choose not to read it. We also tell students to abandon books if they don't like them for whatever reason, including if they are uncomfortable with the content.

Here's reasoning for Harry Potter- "One book that I feel is too violent to be included is Harry Potter and the Half-blood Prince. I feel it is too questionable to include at this level but would be better enjoyed by older students and adults. I know that this is probably a controversial stand, but I feel this is a book series that is better left to parents to decide if their son/daughter should read it."

Reasoning for Hunger Games- 
-" It is possible that many will disagree with my choice, as the series is very popular (as well as a hit movie), but I thought the series was too adult for middle school students. The usual Hunger Games violence of bombings, murders, executions. Katniss' friend Finnick has his head bitten off by a pack of lizard mutations. Although Collins is a very artful writer (and the story ends with the main character getting married and raising a family in peace), the sheer number of violent deaths and acts within the entire series was enough to turn me away. Also, I did not like the fact that teenagers were forced to engage in this level of graphic violence; yes, we all hear of teens engaging in gang related activities that result in horrible outcomes, but I believe this is the exception, not the norm. I also believe that the themes in the story are also presented in an adult fashion. The stories themselves are fascinating and explore the ideology of revolution and totalitarianism, however, the level of deaths ,( like Finnick) are sometimes too gruesome and I find it detracting to the rest of the story."
-" I’m okay with students reading this book on their own time, but I don’t think dystopian fiction is a good topic to teach to a group a adolescents who are already concerned with their ever changing world. When I was young, I read a book called Amnesia Moon by Jonathon Lethem and it stuck with me. I think its more important to plant seeds of hope rather than seeds of fear in our students."

I understand the desire to "plant seeds of hope" but I think it's short-sighted. I think it's an important age to remind them that they shouldn't always go along with the status quo when they feel something is unjust.

While some dystopian fiction is dystopian just for the sake of it, some titles are valuable teaching moments. Hopefully this person is okay with titles like The Wave and Animal Farm, where the reader is given a view of just how easily society can start to unravel into dystopian or fascist ideas. (Especially in the current world political stage.)

[berrysweet]

I have mixed feelings about book censorship in schools. My mom was a librarian, and growing up I was always allowed to read whatever I wanted. I enjoyed that freedom, and felt really grown up that she let me make those choices for myself.

That said, some time ago when schools moved over to the AR program, her elementary school (K-5) had to stock books from Kindergarten level through 10th grade level to accommodate different reading levels, and she was given a bunch of books by the district that satisfied the rerequirements and that she was supposed to include into her library. She and I both hate the AR program for a number of reasons, but one of the things that drove her crazy was that the books she was given by the district were totally inappropriate for elementary students. No joke, she was given The Pelican Brief to stock in her elementary library.

So, my gut is that I'm against censorship of books, but on the other hand I would not be pleased to find that my elementary student was reading The Pelican Brief either. I feel like there must be some middle ground.