Ugh. I live in the heart of UMC self-congratulatory Coexist feminists. This article rings true. We suck at putting POC first, for a goddamn change. No, it's all about our girls, our bodily safety, and our need for, I don't know, better lighting on the bike path that leads to the wine bar.
Our girls are important, of course, as are safe places to travel. But if we think we and our daughters are being deprived and we feel unsafe, how do you think our neighbors are doing? They should take priority right now, ffs.
Isn't the cookie analogy exactly what this article is about? like the foolishness of it? White women try to tell black women that THEY aren't the enemy, its the white men, or men in general, and that we are all fighting together on the same team.
Except we aren't, and black women know that. White women persist in thinking that if WE (white women) are doing better, then all women are doing better, and black women will benefit but that's obviously not true, and in fact white women act like there if a black woman succeeds, it is to the detriment of the white woman.
I referenced this yesterday, but if there was a dem primary between Harris and Warren, I can guarantee that most white women would vote for Warren because "its her turn" or "she's worked so hard" or something, and not bother to pronounce Kamala correctly. that's not because of white men "taking the cookies" or whatever.
I'm going to defer to all the good points that have already been made because I can't make them any better.
So now I'm just sitting over here, scratching my head and wondering how you thought the response to this was going to go. Like, have you ever READ this board? I'm fascinated (in a sick way) by the thought process that goes into posts like that.
Isn't the cookie analogy exactly what this article is about? like the foolishness of it? White women try to tell black women that THEY aren't the enemy, its the white men, or men in general, and that we are all fighting together on the same team.
Except we aren't, and black women know that. White women persist in thinking that if WE (white women) are doing better, then all women are doing better, and black women will benefit but that's obviously not true, and in fact white women act like there if a black woman succeeds, it is to the detriment of the white woman.
I referenced this yesterday, but if there was a dem primary between Harris and Warren, I can guarantee that most white women would vote for Warren because "its her turn" or "she's worked so hard" or something, and not bother to pronounce Kamala correctly. that's not because of white men "taking the cookies" or whatever.
I'm seriously stuck on the cookies here. white women think that when a black woman stands up and is like, "ummm, hello? we're right here" that they're trying to take your fucking cookie. NOBODY WANTS YOUR COOKIE. It probably has cat hair in it anyway.
i mean, maybe you DO lose your cookie. If actually once everybody is on a level playing field it turns out you just aren't good enough - then yeah, you lose your fucking cookie. How about you trust that you're good enough to earn your own cookie when the game isn't rigged and help everybody fix it instead of bitching? Because any reaction that tries to tell black women to wait their turn, or about rising tides lifting all boats when some people aren't even IN THE FUCKING BOAT is just showing your deep fucking insecurities. Because you're afraid that once you no longer have the leg up of your white skin you won't be good enough. AND ELIZABETH BANKS, YOU MIGHT BE RIGHT. SO GO SHILL FOR FUCKING REALTOR.COM SOME MORE OMG.
@tooshort in my original post I included a lot more about the cookie analogy and expanded on it in a way to show how dumb it was, but then I decided I was giving the analogy too much credit. But I had to leave that line in, lol.
Post by penguingrrl on Jun 22, 2017 8:28:30 GMT -5
This thread took a far too expected turn. White woman need to understand that when inroads are made for white women it still does jack shit for black women. We need to recognize that privilege in order to maybe have a chance at helping to combat it.
I'm going to defer to all the good points that have already been made because I can't make them any better.
So now I'm just sitting over here, scratching my head and wondering how you thought the response to this was going to go. Like, have you ever READ this board? I'm fascinated (in a sick way) by the thought process that goes into posts like that.
Me too. I always take it as a cautionary tale for myself. I can identify what other people are so pointedly missing and gaze in wonderment, but what am I missing that I'm tra la la-ing about in my unexamined ignorance?
Isn't the cookie analogy exactly what this article is about? like the foolishness of it? White women try to tell black women that THEY aren't the enemy, its the white men, or men in general, and that we are all fighting together on the same team.
Except we aren't, and black women know that. White women persist in thinking that if WE (white women) are doing better, then all women are doing better, and black women will benefit but that's obviously not true, and in fact white women act like there if a black woman succeeds, it is to the detriment of the white woman.
I referenced this yesterday, but if there was a dem primary between Harris and Warren, I can guarantee that most white women would vote for Warren because "its her turn" or "she's worked so hard" or something, and not bother to pronounce Kamala correctly. that's not because of white men "taking the cookies" or whatever.
I'm seriously stuck on the cookies here. white women think that when a black woman stands up and is like, "ummm, hello? we're right here" that they're trying to take your fucking cookie. NOBODY WANTS YOUR COOKIE. It probably has cat hair in it anyway.
i mean, maybe you DO lose your cookie. If actually once everybody is on a level playing field it turns out you just aren't good enough - then yeah, you lose your fucking cookie. How about you trust that you're good enough to earn your own cookie when the game isn't rigged and help everybody fix it instead of bitching? Because any reaction that tries to tell black women to wait their turn, or about rising tides lifting all boats when some people aren't even IN THE FUCKING BOAT is just showing your deep fucking insecurities. Because you're afraid that once you no longer have the leg up of your white skin you won't be good enough. AND ELIZABETH BANKS, YOU MIGHT BE RIGHT. SO GO SHILL FOR FUCKING REALTOR.COM SOME MORE OMG.
Now let me go back and see if fumbalina , explained why The Color Purple and Glory are not her media preference.
Not funny, no Disney songs, and not enough action.
look, I'll admit that Cop and a Half is in my top 5 favorite movies, but I will do so with the appropriate amount of shame. This chick was just boldly and blatantly basic, and that's before she even got to the overtly racist part. Hilarious.
The fact that white men are privileged above everyone else doesn't negate the fact that white women follow closely behind.
and are they even behind? I'm not totally sure I believe that entirely, especially when I consider their complicity in upholding the white patriarchy. I guess it all depends on where you sit.
I'm going to defer to all the good points that have already been made because I can't make them any better.
So now I'm just sitting over here, scratching my head and wondering how you thought the response to this was going to go. Like, have you ever READ this board? I'm fascinated (in a sick way) by the thought process that goes into posts like that.
She probably has been here, listening and learning. Except we all know how that goes...in one ear and out the other. It's truly hard to put others needs before your own. That's why I don't think we will ever get to some utopia of equality. Somehow looking out for your fellow woman must be seen as a threat. We love to talk about how black people tear each other down, but we aren't alone. Nobody wants to give someone a boast if it means they will be left on the ground. Black people must always remain beneath white people of this society will crumble/implode. That's why people hate on @kirkette and her unapologetic flyness. I don't see that as a threat, I see it as something that should be celebrated. I will always be here for WOC getting their due.
*I hope you don't mind me mentioning you. I can delete that line if you want @kirkette *
That idea really sinking in - that white people KNOW deep down we don't actually deserve to be running the whole damn joint - that by and large we stole all these cookies - has really made me feel pretty hopeless. Like, I believe that through some long hard work we could get most people to learn to abandon a lot of their racial preconceptions (black people are scary, etc) because you can prove they're false, right? But I do not think we're ever gonna get my fellow suburban white moms to be ok with the idea that their kid is just mediocre. They (we're) all so used to their dumb ass kid being at least in the middle percentiles because all the disadvantaged black and brown kids are filling out the bottom - the idea of junior's true (lack of) abilities shining through is just fucking crushing and they (we) react without even knowing why to make sure it never happens. And then that follows all the way up the chain. Steve DESERVES that manger position dammit!!
And you can't keep somebody down without lies, so the rest of the bullshit will persist to eliminate the cognitive dissonance of knowing you aren't winning this game fair and square and still believing that you deserved it.
I'll keep on keeping on working on my people (eta AND MYSELF because I look at how stupid I was about this a few years ago and how far I've come and wonder what else I'm still fucking up), and I'll damn sure be working on my own kids - but I don't have a ton of hope that we'll see any real change because white people suddenly see the light. They won't voluntarily give up their stolen cookies.
The fact that white men are privileged above everyone else doesn't negate the fact that white women follow closely behind.
and are they even behind? I'm not totally sure I believe that entirely, especially when I consider their complicity in upholding the white patriarchy. I guess it all depends on where you sit.
There might be a ball hair in it. I acknowledge it's difficult for me to judge properly, as a white woman.
The fact that white men are privileged above everyone else doesn't negate the fact that white women follow closely behind.
and are they even behind? I'm not totally sure I believe that entirely, especially when I consider their complicity in upholding the white patriarchy. I guess it all depends on where you sit.
I think only in the limited metric of traditional business success (% hired vs. % C suite promoted). By nearly all other measures, white women measurably receive all the benefits of the white patriarchy we uphold. Hell, on average we're healthier and live longer than white men.
and are they even behind? I'm not totally sure I believe that entirely, especially when I consider their complicity in upholding the white patriarchy. I guess it all depends on where you sit.
I think only in the limited metric of traditional business success (% hired vs. % C suite promoted). By nearly all other measures, white women measurably receive all the benefits of the white patriarchy we uphold. Hell, on average we're healthier and live longer than white men.
that's what I was thinking too. So outside of professional women like the ones on this board, many of these arguments just don't hold up. I'm assuming that's why you have so many white women who don't identify as traditional feminists. They know they have it pretty damn good already.
I think only in the limited metric of traditional business success (% hired vs. % C suite promoted). By nearly all other measures, white women measurably receive all the benefits of the white patriarchy we uphold. Hell, on average we're healthier and live longer than white men.
Seriously, think about it for a moment (and I know you get it more than most, cville). Who is having and rearing all the future generations of entitled white kids? If little (mediocre) Precious is being treated like a king, who's giving him the keys to the kingdom? That's right ... his mama. She's been sitting on her throne of privilidge, this whole time, even if she complains that her crown isn't as big as her husbands. It's like the height of being coddled and spoiled rotten.
Pure foolishness to watch all this play out in real time, from the sidelines.
since my new neighborhood is full of kids my daughter's age who are starting kindergarten, I've been forced to interact with their parents. Let me tell you how petty I am when they stand around fretting about whether their kid is academically ready and what have you. I don't do the reassuring, "you got this, mama!" schtick. I'm like, "yeah, my daughter has been reading for a year, hope little Timmy can catch up at some point." It cracks me up every time. They'll be running for the good schools soon, let me tell you. I can already see it in their eyes.