S/o difficult family members

[sunflower17]

I’m dealing with issues with my mom and posted on hamster thread yesterday.
Background excerpt from my post: I’ve had a recent falling out with my mother who has different issues (controlling, manipulative, rude, martyr complex) and I’m struggling with what to do about our relationship. She always makes me feel guilty. She is awful to H and on my birthday right before thanksgiving I told her it was inappropriate and we had a huge fight. She left my house (She lives a 4 hr drive from us) and she slammed the door in DDs face while Dd was waving bye to her. My daughter is 22 months and I’m expecting my second daughter in 6-7 weeks. She has since sent passive aggressive texts along the lines of “you must want your daughter to forget about me” “ you are going to be responsible if I have a stroke” (she's never had a stroke or similar health issues).

Then this happened and I’m wondering how you’d address this:
Yesterday she sent a rude text that I must want my daughter to forget her. I responded that she could FaceTime if she wanted (I probably shouldn’t have offered). She said no because my (22 month old) Dd is too busy playing instead of talking to her 🙄.
So on Facebook this morning, my mother posted a picture of my daughter pretending to be on the phone that she had from a few weeks prior to our argument. She posted it and captioned “Grandma, I’m trying to call you”.
It is extremely stressful for my 32 week pregnant self to deal with her passive aggressive shit on social media and her involving my innocent baby.
I don’t want to engage on FB, but feel enraged by this and need tips on WWYD.

[countthestars]

I would report the photo - if you click on "other" once you report, you can choose Sharing Private Images.

[boiler717]

Oh gosh I am so sorry. This is very reminiscent of my MIL before my son was born. She was very manipulative, loved to show how wronged she was by us on social media, used the birth of my son as an opportunity to create problems and issues. The health “scares” and everything else is so similar.
What ended up happening is my husband drew a firm boundary for what would happen on the day of my sons birth. She tried to violate it and threw a fit when he did not give in. She chose not to come visit when asked (basically we asked for no visitors the day he was born, he as born at 4:15 and we got to our room after 8 pm; they live 3 hours away so it was not an extended period of time and anyone was welcome the next morning). She spent the next 3 months complaining on social media that we wouldn’t drive our son to her in the middle of winter.
My husband decided to just be done. He went to therapy and learned a lot about the manipulation he experienced growing up and how it’s effected him to this day. He wanted to the cycle to be done. He did EMDR therapy for PTSD — he never had physical abuse, but it helped with the emotional abuse. It’s been very helpful.
We found the book Understanding the Borderline Mother extremely helpful (my husbands therapist couldn’t diagnosis MIL since she doesn’t see her, but felt like it would be helpful and on-point, which it was). I’d highly recommend reading due to so many similarities.
I’m still not sure what the future looks like as it’s in my husbands hands, but we haven’t seen her in 4y and I think the last time they spoke was 3.5y ago.

[mrssandro]

I am sorry you are going through this.

I had something similar happen with my mom. It took a year or so to mend it and it's still a little like walking on eggshells. I am happy to report that she finally started therapy again and we are making some progress on rebuilding our relationship. It's hard to offer advice but I will say that you can't let her get to you. I know this is hard because it really does hurt when your parent is acting out but you need to set healthy boundaries from the toxicity. I had a period where I completely un followed my mom because I didn't want to see her passive aggressive comments. I did a lot of ignoring and venting to my husband but never trying to begin conversations with her because it would lead back to the same shit.

[sunflower17]

boiler717, thank you for sharing. I will look into that book. My mother was here for the birth of dd1 and made it all about her needs and I do not want her here for the upcoming birth of dd2.

[Patsy Baloney]

I'd stop giving her the chance to be a passive aggressive asshole.

The problem with having a controlling, manipulative, rude, martyr in your life is that you start to believe your actions can somehow bring them happiness. It can't. She wants you to jump when she says jump. Nothing you do will be enough for a person who deals in guilt. I'm sorry to say it, but she's probably loving that she has you stressed out and at a loss for how to "make things right" with her when she's the one that started the mess by being a jerk to your H. The behavior you describe toward your daughter is ghastly. What an awful woman.

It's complicated by the fact that a mom shouldn't treat her kid and grandchildren like that. That really sucks and I'm sorry she did that and that it's a long pattern of behavior.

The best bet, from this armchair counselor, is to set up firm boundaries. Stop giving her ins to get to you. No more giving the mouse the cookie. Tell her the type of communication you want with her, and if she cannot honor that, stop communicating with her. Block her number, social media profiles, etc., if you have to. These are uncomfortable conversations to have and hard things to do, but you need to protect yourself and your family. Hopefully, she will recognize what a heinous asshole she's being and be compliant with your wishes and your relationship can move forward from there.

[sunflower17]

Dec 11, 2019 12:12:50 GMT -5 mrssandro said:

I am sorry you are going through this.

I had something similar happen with my mom. It took a year or so to mend it and it's still a little like walking on eggshells. I am happy to report that she finally started therapy again and we are making some progress on rebuilding our relationship. It's hard to offer advice but I will say that you can't let her get to you. I know this is hard because it really does hurt when your parent is acting out but you need to set healthy boundaries from the toxicity. I had a period where I completely un followed my mom because I didn't want to see her passive aggressive comments. I did a lot of ignoring and venting to my husband but never trying to begin conversations with her because it would lead back to the same shit.

I have asked my mother to go to therapy and she acted like that was the most vile thing in the world and said it’s for crazy people.
She would benefit sooooo much from therapy. She has had some close losses (both parents and 2 husbands —30 years apart) and never properly grieved or addressed either husband and instead jumped to new men immediately within weeks while threatening to commit suicide if she had to remain alone. This does not, however, give her the right to act a fool.

[redheadbaker]

Sounds like something my MIL would do. No real advice, just my sympathies. We cut her off, not for this type of behavior specifically, but it was one on a long list of reasons.

[mrssandro]

Dec 11, 2019 12:20:32 GMT -5 sunflower17 said:

Dec 11, 2019 12:12:50 GMT -5 mrssandro said:

I have asked my mother to go to therapy and she acted like that was the most vile thing in the world and said it’s for crazy people.
She would benefit sooooo much from therapy. She has had some close losses (both parents and 2 husbands —30 years apart) and never properly grieved or addressed either husband and instead jumped to new men immediately within weeks while threatening to commit suicide if she had to remain alone. This does not, however, give her the right to act a fool.

I am not even sure who encouraged her to go back to therapy. Likely her close friends. But my mom lost her mom about 10 years ago now and I do think part of her grieving about that and all the guilt that her mother did to her she is realizing she was basically repeating it with me and this was damaging our relationship. I highly recommend therapy for you as well. I have been debating about returning myself but at the moment since she has calmed down a lot I haven't needed it. But I just want to not to do what she has done to my all my life to my DD's. I want to stop this cycle. 

Set the boundaries. I wrote a long letter to her that I took many months on explaining my stance. I did have a good friend review it before I sent it. I think it really hurt her to read it but I feel like this may have also may have been the push into therapy. But also realize that she may never change and the boundaries may need to be permanent. She has to want to change herself and you can't just keep letting her back in. 

Anyways. I am so sorry you are going through especially with the PG hormones. This is not a good way to feel during the holidays. Sendings hugs. 

[ECB]

first, ditto Patsy Baloney 100%.  There is no way you can make her happy.  Which is what you have to remind yourself- you are NOT RESPONSIBLE for her happiness.  Or her reactions or unhappiness either!!  

You need to decide what boundaries YOU need to draw for YOU and YOUR family.  You don't need her buy in/ permission.  BUT- be prepared, she won't be happy and she'll pull out all the stops to make you feel bad.  Let her.  Let her be mad - YOU can't control that.  Her emotions are her emotions. 

Focus on  you, your child, your DH - what makes you all happy, what will make your life easier.  Both short term and long term.  You don't owe her access to your life.  You really don't.  

As for the picture, I agree- report it.  And then I'd also tell her directly "Do not post pictures of my child.  If yo udo that again, you will not be able to see her.  This is YOUR choice". (IF you're willing to draw that line!!)  Of course she won't see it that way, but... again, you can't control her reactions. 

[covergirl82]

sunflower17 , I agree with reporting it. If it were me, I wouldn't want a bat-sh!t crazy person posting that kind of stuff, especially if it involved my children. Also have a conversation with your H to talk about how you want to address this (if he could help with addressing it with your mom). Could he talk with your mom to try and prevent you from having that stressful conversation?

Also, I'm sorry. My MIL is also what I'm guessing is Borderline Personality Disorder as well (this is my guess from my undergrad degree in Psychology). Lies, manipulates, seeks attention, impulsive, always the victim... Purports herself to be this wonderful Christian, but does not have one ounce of forgiveness...she loves to talk about how much her two exHs wronged her, how terrible her mother was, etc. Unfortunately, she lives close by, but we try to limit our time with her. Usually we try to keep it to birthdays and holidays, and a few times she might help us out with child care when we're in a pinch and there is absolutely no one else who can help (and thankfully we're close to not needing child care anymore), but she likes to come to DS's sports games (and he basically plays sports all year), so the games she comes to I just have to pray she doesn't say something rude (she has no filter) or embarrassing. Thankfully DH is not close with her relationship-wise, so he's fine with the limited amount of time we spend with her.

[ECB]

Dec 11, 2019 12:32:59 GMT -5 mrssandro said:

Set the boundaries. I wrote a long letter to her that I took many months on explaining my stance. I did have a good friend review it before I sent it. I think it really hurt her to read it but I feel like this may have also may have been the push into therapy. But also realize that she may never change and the boundaries may need to be permanent. She has to want to change herself and you can't just keep letting her back in. 

Everyone has to do what works for them - I don't judge that.  But in setting boundaries - it's really not about telling the other person about the "why".  you can, of course.  But chances are it's only going to make them more upset, be more angry, more passive aggressive.

Just as an example- if OP wants to say "no visitors the day of the birth", that's the boundary.  The "why" really doesn't matter.  She can take a lot of time, energy and emotion and try to tell her mom that because she made it all about herself last time, she's not welcome this time.  But... to what end?  

Now, some boundaries might call for SOME explanation - but I think the simpler the better.  "Mom - I told you that if you did X, you wouldn't be invited to Y", vs a long drawn out "when you did X, it really upset me because of ABC.  And (whatever other information/reaction/emotions/ that could be added) blah blah blah, you're not welcome this time" that will really only end up with the same result - pissed off mom.  But short and simple requires less energy and emotion than the long version.  

Just food for thought. 

[sunflower17]

Dec 11, 2019 12:38:03 GMT -5 covergirl82 said:

sunflower17 , I agree with reporting it. If it were me, I wouldn't want a bat-sh!t crazy person posting that kind of stuff, especially if it involved my children. Also have a conversation with your H to talk about how you want to address this (if he could help with addressing it with your mom). Could he talk with your mom to try and prevent you from having that stressful conversation?

Also, I'm sorry. My MIL is also what I'm guessing is Borderline Personality Disorder as well (this is my guess from my undergrad degree in Psychology). Lies, manipulates, seeks attention, impulsive, always the victim... Purports herself to be this wonderful Christian, but does not have one ounce of forgiveness...she loves to talk about how much her two exHs wronged her, how terrible her mother was, etc. Unfortunately, she lives close by, but we try to limit our time with her. Usually we try to keep it to birthdays and holidays, and a few times she might help us out with child care when we're in a pinch and there is absolutely no one else who can help (and thankfully we're close to not needing child care anymore), but she likes to come to DS's sports games (and he basically plays sports all year), so the games she comes to I just have to pray she doesn't say something rude (she has no filter) or embarrassing. Thankfully DH is not close with her relationship-wise, so he's fine with the limited amount of time we spend with her.

H will not engage at this point. He is pretty stubborn and direct and has “eaten shit” (his exact words) from her for a long time and refuses to continue. If he says anything to her it will not be nice at all. He says it’s up to me whether or not I want to continue a relationship with her, but he will no longer visit her home and will limit interaction if she visits our home.
H is not on social media so I texted him about what she did, but he rarely checks his phone when he’s at work. I’m considering reporting it.

[sapphireblue]

Dec 11, 2019 12:38:03 GMT -5 covergirl82 said:

sunflower17 , I agree with reporting it. If it were me, I wouldn't want a bat-sh!t crazy person posting that kind of stuff, especially if it involved my children. Also have a conversation with your H to talk about how you want to address this (if he could help with addressing it with your mom). Could he talk with your mom to try and prevent you from having that stressful conversation?

I agree with all of this advice but I would be very cautious about your H talking to your mom. It sounds like they already don't get along and I don't think it is fair to put him in this position. The in-law always loses in these exchanges, I feel!

[sunflower17]

Dec 11, 2019 13:49:21 GMT -5 sapphireblue said:

Dec 11, 2019 12:38:03 GMT -5 covergirl82 said:

sunflower17 , I agree with reporting it. If it were me, I wouldn't want a bat-sh!t crazy person posting that kind of stuff, especially if it involved my children. Also have a conversation with your H to talk about how you want to address this (if he could help with addressing it with your mom). Could he talk with your mom to try and prevent you from having that stressful conversation?

I agree with all of this advice but I would be very cautious about your H talking to your mom. It sounds like they already don't get along and I don't think it is fair to put him in this position. The in-law always loses in these exchanges, I feel!

Agree. They do not get along and it’s not his place. I have a long 35+ years of experience with her shit.

[joy]

I think the easiest and most productive path forward is to recognize that she will not be reasoned/talked to out of this behavior. Don’t tell her off or otherwise explain your side. It is fruitless.

Do not reward her shit behavior. Her feelings are hers and her choices. They are not yours. You have no ownership over her reactions.

My therapist told me - if she wants to have a temper tantrum then let her. If she isolates herself then let her. She’s an adult.

Easier said than done, I know.

[wanderingback]

Dec 11, 2019 12:15:55 GMT -5 Patsy Baloney said:

I'd stop giving her the chance to be a passive aggressive asshole.

The problem with having a controlling, manipulative, rude, martyr in your life is that you start to believe your actions can somehow bring them happiness. It can't. She wants you to jump when she says jump. Nothing you do will be enough for a person who deals in guilt. I'm sorry to say it, but she's probably loving that she has you stressed out and at a loss for how to "make things right" with her when she's the one that started the mess by being a jerk to your H. The behavior you describe toward your daughter is ghastly. What an awful woman.

It's complicated by the fact that a mom shouldn't treat her kid and grandchildren like that. That really sucks and I'm sorry she did that and that it's a long pattern of behavior.

The best bet, from this armchair counselor, is to set up firm boundaries. Stop giving her ins to get to you. No more giving the mouse the cookie. Tell her the type of communication you want with her, and if she cannot honor that, stop communicating with her. Block her number, social media profiles, etc., if you have to. These are uncomfortable conversations to have and hard things to do, but you need to protect yourself and your family. Hopefully, she will recognize what a heinous asshole she's being and be compliant with your wishes and your relationship can move forward from there.

Yeah this.
My mom is great, I love her a lot. But she was getting ridiculous in her comments about wanting me to have a child. I told her directly several times to stop talking to me about it. She did it again a couple of weeks ago I told her point blank that if she brought it up again that I was going to stop talking to her....and I mean it. I probably wouldn’t stop talking to her the rest of my life, but I certainly would stop for a time period so she gets the point that I’m serious.

Just because someone is a parent, we’re all adults now, doesn’t mean they can just do or say whatever they want without consequences. I might be cold-hearted, but I don’t care if you’re my mom, if you’re crossing borders then I’m not going to put up with it.

[dochas]

I think pregnancy is stressful enough, and you can't fix this mess in any way over the next 8 weeks. Snooze her on Facebook so you can't see her stuff. When she texts you tell her that you will not be engaging in passive aggressive social media wars, or arguing over text message. I would tell her she's welcome to call your daughter and text you if she can have polite communication through both means, but that you will disconnect the call if she steps out of line with daughter and will not be responding to any messages that are out of line. Then follow through each and every time. Do not keep reading through past messages and posts which will just feed your anger.

[Gato]

I would take a “mom break” for the next six months. Do not engage, and block every way she might contact you. She really doesn’t deserve your energy. Focus on you and your family as you welcome a new member.

[shopgirl07]

Also, block her on social media. It doesn’t have to be forever but it serves absolutely no purpose right now.