@ TW -- Anti-abortion maternal fetal medicine ob/gyns

[redheadbaker]

It never crossed my mind before that there are anti-abortion maternal fetal medicine OB GYNs, maybe since I've always lived in mostly liberal areas. 

www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2021/the-lily/antiabortion-doctor-obgyn-care/

[Byron] Calhoun is the only high-risk obstetrician and gynecologist in Charleston, W.Va., with a strong hold over much of the central part of the state. He is also an internationally known antiabortion activist. In treating women with fetal abnormalities or preexisting conditions that could complicate their pregnancies, Calhoun rarely discusses abortion, according to interviews with three former patients and six doctors. His practice highlights a fraught ethical area: When doctors personally oppose abortion, their beliefs can affect the care they provide, leading a patient down a path that could put their health at risk.

Six OB/GYNs who work in the Charleston area, or who have worked there in the past, say they see Calhoun’s open antiabortion advocacy and his medical practice as a conflict with the potential to harm patients, especially in a state short on doctors with his expertise. Four of those doctors — three of whom spoke on the condition of anonymity because they work closely with Calhoun — say they avoid sending certain cases to his office because patients have told them he does not discuss abortion as an option. If they believe a patient with a high-risk pregnancy or fetal anomaly should consider termination, they said, they will try to send her somewhere else.

Three said they also avoid sending Calhoun any patients who need more advanced testing to determine the severity of their anomalies, because they have also heard from patients that he often refuses to perform these tests. In a 2016 lawsuit filed against the Charleston Area Medical Center and West Virginia University, a doctor who trained under Calhoun claimed that Calhoun denied an amniocentesis — the most definitive form of fetal genetic testing — to a patient who requested the procedure. According to the lawsuit, the other tests he performed were not conclusive and “came back past the date for this patient to have an elective abortion," though Calhoun had allegedly assured the patient those results would come quickly.

[wanderingback]

Oh yes, definitely. There are antis that are very strong in Obgyn and family medicine, 2 of the specialties that take care of the majority of reproductive health care and abortion care, and it is HORRIFIC. I literally feel rage when I’m in professional meetings/conferences with them and have to listen to the shit they say.

[Velar Fricative]

There are crazy doctors in all fields, I’ve learned. But I also suspect this was part of the pro-birth movement’s long game besides stacking the courts - getting more and more of their people into the OBGYN field.

[redheadbaker]

I am now more grateful than ever for the compassionate, FACT-BASED care I got at the hospital when my water broke. I wanted with all my heart to believe that there was SOMETHING that could be done to save him. If they had given me false hope .... I don't even want to think about where my brain (already dealing with a depression disorder) would be right now.

[chickadee77]

Yup. I suspect I was dropped by my OB due to my TFMR during my second viable pregnancy. Blessing in disguise because my new doc was amazing.

[pumpkin]

I remember being just out of college and looking for a GP and called a couple that had been recommended to me. One of the offices told me up front that the Dr would not prescribe birth control based on their beliefs and that they always told potential patients this up front.

I can just see in the long run how devastating could be in some circumstances.

[mouse]

I can try and find the details later if anyone’s interested, but there was a wrongful birth suit that made it either high up in appeals or to SCOTUS. Basically the based on their beliefs the ob/gyn had hidden indications that the pregnancy was not progressing normally and had not referred out for further testing. I remember one of the judges either said or implied that your doctor has the right to conceal things about your care if it conflicts with their beliefs. The whole thing is horrifying and I try and ask for pro-choice doctors but since they have the right to lie to me, htf am I supposed to know?

[Jalapeñomel]

Sept 13, 2021 14:39:23 GMT -5 mouse said:

I can try and find the details later if anyone’s interested, but there was a wrongful birth suit that made it either high up in appeals or to SCOTUS. Basically the based on their beliefs the ob/gyn had hidden indications that the pregnancy was not progressing normally and had not referred out for further testing. I remember one of the judges either said or implied that your doctor has the right to conceal things about your care if it conflicts with their beliefs. The whole thing is horrifying and I try and ask for pro-choice doctors but since they have the right to lie to me, htf am I supposed to know?

OMG. Horrifying.

I’ve been seening a MFM for my entire pregnancy, and she’s been nothing but straight forth and honest. I can’t imagine not getting this kind of care.

[basilosaurus]

I assume WV is one of the half of states that either don't have wrongful birth laws or outright forbid then?

I seen to remember national attention being given to Utah. Iirc, that was concerning the constitutionality of banning wrongful birth suits.

[mouse]

Sept 13, 2021 14:39:23 GMT -5 mouse said:

I can try and find the details later if anyone’s interested, but there was a wrongful birth suit that made it either high up in appeals or to SCOTUS. Basically the based on their beliefs the ob/gyn had hidden indications that the pregnancy was not progressing normally and had not referred out for further testing. I remember one of the judges either said or implied that your doctor has the right to conceal things about your care if it conflicts with their beliefs. The whole thing is horrifying and I try and ask for pro-choice doctors but since they have the right to lie to me, htf am I supposed to know?

Okay, what I’m remembering is from around the time of my last pregnancy ~12 years ago. There’s been a bit that’s happened since then (understatement) so I’m having a hard time finding it. I thought this RS rundown of the laws that allow or require physicians to lie to you interesting: www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/how-politicians-force-doctors-to-lie-to-women-123330/

I also want to acknowledge that many advocates for disability rights groups take issue with the concept of wrongful birth. I might not come to the same conclusions, but I can certainly see where they’re coming from and I don’t want to invalidate their POV.

[StrawberryBlondie]

Sept 13, 2021 14:51:43 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

I assume WV is one of the half of states that either don't have wrongful birth laws or outright forbid then?

I seen to remember national attention being given to Utah. Iirc, that was concerning the constitutionality of banning wrongful birth suits.

No, they do. It's section 55-7-29.

[redheadbaker]

Sept 13, 2021 14:39:23 GMT -5 mouse said:

I can try and find the details later if anyone’s interested, but there was a wrongful birth suit that made it either high up in appeals or to SCOTUS. Basically the based on their beliefs the ob/gyn had hidden indications that the pregnancy was not progressing normally and had not referred out for further testing. I remember one of the judges either said or implied that your doctor has the right to conceal things about your care if it conflicts with their beliefs. The whole thing is horrifying and I try and ask for pro-choice doctors but since they have the right to lie to me, htf am I supposed to know?

I do vaguely remember hearing about this. 

[livinitup]

In the 1950s, my grandmother was 47, a mother of 4 and a devote Catholic. She had started early menopause. She was not feeling well, tired, nausea and went to her family doctor. He did not give her a diagnosis but had her coming back for care/checks every few weeks, so she assumed that she had cancer and he did not want to scare her. Until she felt and recognized the fluttering of life around 3/4 months. She realized that she was pregnant and asked her doctor why he didn’t tell her. He said, to this wonderful mother (a doctor who had delivered all of her babies) that he didn’t want her to “do something about it”. As in, get an illegal abortion. She would never and said so. Furious and outraged she gave him hell.

Doctors have been doing this to their female patients forever.

[basilosaurus]

Sept 13, 2021 15:53:42 GMT -5 StrawberryBlondie said:

Sept 13, 2021 14:51:43 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

I assume WV is one of the half of states that either don't have wrongful birth laws or outright forbid then?

I seen to remember national attention being given to Utah. Iirc, that was concerning the constitutionality of banning wrongful birth suits.

No, they do. It's section 55-7-29.

So then why hasn't this asshole sued of it's fairly known he refuses to even do fairly standard tests?

[erbear]

You should not be allowed to opt out of abortions as an ob-gyn (just as a pharmacist should not be able to opt out of filling BCP). It comes with the job.

[wanderingback]

Sept 13, 2021 16:58:33 GMT -5 erbear said:

You should not be allowed to opt out of abortions as an ob-gyn (just as a pharmacist should not be able to opt out of filling BCP). It comes with the job.

I personally think both obgyn and family med should learn abortion care in residency, but I'm fine if you opt out of doing that care afterwards. Not all obgyns do Ob/deliveries and just do gyn. So I'm fine with that. But you cannot give biased information. I'm 100% pro-abortion and know what I would do in certain situations if I were in them, but clearly I don't counsel my patients that way based on my personal beliefs...I give them all options. And if there is care I can't provide them I refer them to the appropriate place. Deep down I don't have a problem if someone is "pro-life" but that should never interfere with your professional care. 

I work with someone who isn't in obgyn, but is in a field that does a lot of reproductive health care and she doesn't actively participate in the abortion care that we provide, but she absolutely does full options counseling for patients who are unsure of what they want to do and tells patients who want that care about it and refers them to me or elsewhere as needed. That is how it should be. 

[erbear]

Sept 13, 2021 18:50:41 GMT -5 wanderingback said:

Sept 13, 2021 16:58:33 GMT -5 erbear said:

You should not be allowed to opt out of abortions as an ob-gyn (just as a pharmacist should not be able to opt out of filling BCP). It comes with the job.

I personally think both obgyn and family med should learn abortion care in residency, but I'm fine if you opt out of doing that care afterwards. Not all obgyns do Ob/deliveries and just do gyn. So I'm fine with that. But you cannot give biased information. I'm 100% pro-abortion and know what I would do in certain situations if I were in them, but clearly I don't counsel my patients that way based on my personal beliefs...I give them all options. And if there is care I can't provide them I refer them to the appropriate place. Deep down I don't have a problem if someone is "pro-life" but that should never interfere with your professional care. 

I work with someone who isn't in obgyn, but is in a field that does a lot of reproductive health care and she doesn't actively participate in the abortion care that we provide, but she absolutely does full options counseling for patients who are unsure of what they want to do and tells patients who want that care about it and refers them to me or elsewhere as needed. That is how it should be. 

Yeah, I see that. I think you should be required to refer that care to someone who is willing to do it. I don’t think you should be able to opt out of the training or counsel patients against the practice.

[sakoro]

A elementary school classmate is a Primary Care doc who refuses to prescribe birth control or refer for abortion. Her practice has “Culture of Life” in the name, but I’m sure there are people who show up having no idea that they don’t provide basic reproductive services. Totally legal unfortunately 😡

[AJL]

Sept 13, 2021 19:00:26 GMT -5 sakoro said:

A elementary school classmate is a Primary Care doc who refuses to prescribe birth control or refer for abortion. Her practice has “Culture of Life” in the name, but I’m sure there are people who show up having no idea that they don’t provide basic reproductive services. Totally legal unfortunately 😡

If I googled the right clinic, they also provide a service called "Abortion Pill Rescue."

[sakoro]

Sept 13, 2021 19:04:45 GMT -5 AJL said:

Sept 13, 2021 19:00:26 GMT -5 sakoro said:

A elementary school classmate is a Primary Care doc who refuses to prescribe birth control or refer for abortion. Her practice has “Culture of Life” in the name, but I’m sure there are people who show up having no idea that they don’t provide basic reproductive services. Totally legal unfortunately 😡

If I googled the right clinic, they also provide a service called "Abortion Pill Rescue."

Sounds about right