The Duggar documentary (Shiny Happy People)

[krystee]

Anyone watch? Did you learn anything new? I am just starting and wondering if it’s worth the time.

[morecowbell]

I just started watching. I haven’t watched any of their TLC shows, but I was so struck by how similar this religious sect is to polygamist cults, Scientology, etc. It’s extraordinary how the human need to be loved and accepted can be manipulated so thoroughly and disgustingly. I feel awful for all those poor children.

[isabel]

I'll probably watch it. I was fascinated by them in the early seasons.

There's a thread going on CEP.

[skidunks]

I watched it this evening and I actually just read Jinger’s book about a week ago. I just cannot wrap my brain around living this way. I am so glad some of the girls have left that way of thinking and hope the rest of them are able to get out of it as well but it just blows my mind that there are people that think this is normal. My heart breaks for all the women out there living in the daily fear of abuse.

[maudefindlay]

Spoiler alerts

Of course Jim Bob and Michelle put out their statement denouncing the documentary. Jim Bob's evil doings will be prominently out there.

Jill shares that on her wedding day Jim Bob told her and Derrick he needed them to sign a contract....but only let them see the signature page. They signed off on 5 more years of their life to TLC....and never got any money.

I always thought that Megan Kelly interview was so bad and yep, Jill wishes she hadn't done it and that yes, she was downplaying the abuse by Josh.

Jill's book comes out in January and she says no more secrets. I think she will be sharing the many ways her parents failed to protect her and her sisters and the lengths they went to to protect Josh.

[livinitup]

I think it’s wild that Jill was an adult, married, and the star of her own show and it didn’t occur to her to get paid.

“What if we didn’t do it? Would they arrest us?”

[basilosaurus]

Jun 3, 2023 8:31:23 GMT -5 livinitup said:

I think it’s wild that Jill was an adult, married, and the star of her own show and it didn’t occur to her to get paid.

“What if we didn’t do it? Would they arrest us?”

If you suffered spiritual, physical, educational abuse, how would you even know it was wrong and further have the strength to speak up? Very abusive cult

[icedcoffee]

I can’t wait to watch!! I just double checked to make sure my sisters prime account is still signed in. LOL. Tonight will be good!

[sofamonkey]

Jun 3, 2023 9:03:23 GMT -5 icedcoffee said:

I can’t wait to watch!! I just double checked to make sure my sisters prime account is still signed in. LOL. Tonight will be good!

It’s very well done, but some is hard to watch. DH didn’t really know about them/their stuff, so it was brand new awful info. He decided he couldn’t watch the rest last night if he wanted to sleep.

[icedcoffee]

Jun 3, 2023 9:09:49 GMT -5 sofamonkey said:

Jun 3, 2023 9:03:23 GMT -5 icedcoffee said:

I can’t wait to watch!! I just double checked to make sure my sisters prime account is still signed in. LOL. Tonight will be good!

It’s very well done, but some is hard to watch. DH didn’t really know about them/their stuff, so it was brand new awful info. He decided he couldn’t watch the rest last night if he wanted to sleep.

[br

I’ve heard it’s a tough watch. Those “parents” make me so mad.

[jinkies]

Just finished the third episode.

Holy shit. I knew a lot of the broad details but not the specifics. Like I knew several of the kids were estranged but the fact that they weren't paid for a show that literally had their name in the title is mind boggling.

And that doesn't even get into all the sexual abuse.

[macmars45]

I'm on the second episode. It's a lot of awful.

[quesyrah]

The clip where Bill Gothard brings the little boy on stage to spank him and then
hugs him while creepy smiling was so hard to watch.

[sandandsea]

My cousins were in the same cult as kids, went to the seminars, did ATI etc, and I’m so thankful my parents didn’t get sucked in. They always made us feel inferior and not good enough heathens and I’m sooooo thankful my mom was strong enough to ignore it. My aunt/uncle eventually moved away from it in the early 2000s as their kids were entering adulthood but I think a lot of damage was already done as they were homeschooled, didn’t go to college, etc. The girls all became SAHMs who homeschool their kids and the boys are in politics (not surprisingly based on the documentary) and sales. Thankfully they didn’t have to endure any physical or sexual abuse as my uncle is actually a good person who was trying to do what was best for his family to protect them as he had an unstable upbringing so exactly what IBLP was looking for. I’m just thankful they got out.


ETA. You know. They always made the institutes seem sooo cool and bragged about getting to go teach in other countries and I felt so jealous at the time. It’s crazy how things turn out.

[fivechickens]

I just finished.

It made me really sad that Jill still didn’t want to talk about what happened with her brother because it seemed she still felt shame about it. I hope that she realizes that she is not to blame. It is probably hard to fully shake the damage these cults cause.

I felt it was really well done documentary. I wonder about the other younger kids (younger than Jill but still adults) and how they are doing. Their parents are awful people.

[katfco]

Jun 3, 2023 14:24:35 GMT -5 fivechickens said:

I just finished.

It made me really sad that Jill still didn’t want to talk about what happened with her brother because it seemed she still felt shame about it. I hope that she realizes that she is not to blame. It is probably hard to fully shake the damage these cults cause.

I felt it was really well done documentary. I wonder about the other younger kids (younger than Jill but still adults) and how they are doing. Their parents are awful people.

While I acknowledge the deep-seated shame and guilt that can exist in these situations, I do think there's a difference between feeling shame and feeling embarrassed. Her worst experience was openly discussed and dissected for the world, and she was forced to brush it off to save the family's status. People discussed details and possibilities everywhere. As an abuse survivor, I don't feel shame for what happened, but I certainly don't want the details discussed on the news. 

[al dente]

How much does it get into the older brother stuff? I read an article when he was arrested that I still sometimes think about and get upset because it was so horrific, so I can't handle a show getting into it.

[katfco]

al dente, there is repeated discussion of that and of sexual abuse and rape by Gothard.

[whiskeytails]

Episode 4 was the craziest for me with the plotting and planning on social media and in politics. Makes sense, but weirdly surprising

[maudefindlay]

I was surprised Bill Gothard was never married, no kids. I figured he had a bunch of them. I guess that is a positive.

[basilosaurus]

Jun 4, 2023 5:52:39 GMT -5 maudefindlay said:

I was surprised Bill Gothard was never married, no kids. I figured he had a bunch of them. I guess that is a positive.

for as much as I knew about these abusive assholes, I was surprised by that. I'm not sure how it escaped my notice. I definitely assumed he had an abused wife while he was grooming victims at journey.

[maudefindlay]

I looked it up and looks like she and her son have 10 year orders of protection against Jim and that in Arkansas these are given in domestic abuse situations.

[fivechickens]

Jun 3, 2023 15:40:34 GMT -5 katfco said:

Jun 3, 2023 14:24:35 GMT -5 fivechickens said:

I just finished.

It made me really sad that Jill still didn’t want to talk about what happened with her brother because it seemed she still felt shame about it. I hope that she realizes that she is not to blame. It is probably hard to fully shake the damage these cults cause.

I felt it was really well done documentary. I wonder about the other younger kids (younger than Jill but still adults) and how they are doing. Their parents are awful people.

While I acknowledge the deep-seated shame and guilt that can exist in these situations, I do think there's a difference between feeling shame and feeling embarrassed. Her worst experience was openly discussed and dissected for the world, and she was forced to brush it off to save the family's status. People discussed details and possibilities everywhere. As an abuse survivor, I don't feel shame for what happened, but I certainly don't want the details discussed on the news.

I understand all of that and was not trying to downplay what happened or imply that she had to talk about it (which I only mention because she said she didn’t want to talk about it). I was speaking to the bolded.

[lightbulbsun]

Jun 3, 2023 18:39:41 GMT -5 al dente said:

How much does it get into the older brother stuff? I read an article when he was arrested that I still sometimes think about and get upset because it was so horrific, so I can't handle a show getting into it.

They don't get into specifics of the abuse, but they definitely talk about it in regards to how it was covered up, and how he was eventually arrested. I was really annoyed that everyone in the doc kept saying child p*rn instead of CSAM.  

[jobae1234]

Jun 2, 2023 23:29:55 GMT -5 skidunks said:

I watched it this evening and I actually just read Jinger’s book about a week ago. I just cannot wrap my brain around living this way. I am so glad some of the girls have left that way of thinking and hope the rest of them are able to get out of it as well but it just blows my mind that there are people that think this is normal. My heart breaks for all the women out there living in the daily fear of abuse.

I’m not religious so the premise of her book didn’t appeal to me. Would non-religious people still like it?

[skidunks]

Jun 5, 2023 13:09:07 GMT -5 jobae1234 said:

Jun 2, 2023 23:29:55 GMT -5 skidunks said:

I watched it this evening and I actually just read Jinger’s book about a week ago. I just cannot wrap my brain around living this way. I am so glad some of the girls have left that way of thinking and hope the rest of them are able to get out of it as well but it just blows my mind that there are people that think this is normal. My heart breaks for all the women out there living in the daily fear of abuse.

I’m not religious so the premise of her book didn’t appeal to me. Would non-religious people still like it?

You know, I think so? I read it fairly quickly because I needed to get it back to the library so I don’t remember some of the details and a lot of it was similar to the documentary. I knew there would be parts of the book that mentioned God (obviously, it’s the Duggars!) I think it was more about Jinger’s personal relationship with God and how it changed from childhood to adulthood. I found it very interesting but I can also see how some maybe wouldn’t care for it. Give it a try, you can always not finish it if you don’t like it!

[msmerymac]

Jun 3, 2023 8:31:23 GMT -5 livinitup said:

I think it’s wild that Jill was an adult, married, and the star of her own show and it didn’t occur to her to get paid.

“What if we didn’t do it? Would they arrest us?”

I've only watched the first episode, so I don't know what they get into, but the Duggars also buy and sell real estate (because, just like the used car lots, they prioritize being your own boss/financially independent). I know Joy Anna and her husband do a lot of house flipping. Anyway, Jim Bob gave Jill and Derick a house to live in for free that was a lot nicer than the houses most of the other kids got to live in, so that was probably the way he "paid" them (because, when you're financially abusive, you can claim you're "taking care" of someone and what do they need their own money for anyway?) as well as a way he kept them under his control for a while. 

[rubytue]

Jun 5, 2023 22:17:39 GMT -5 skidunks said:

Jun 5, 2023 13:09:07 GMT -5 jobae1234 said:

I’m not religious so the premise of her book didn’t appeal to me. Would non-religious people still like it?

You know, I think so? I read it fairly quickly because I needed to get it back to the library so I don’t remember some of the details and a lot of it was similar to the documentary. I knew there would be parts of the book that mentioned God (obviously, it’s the Duggars!) I think it was more about Jinger’s personal relationship with God and how it changed from childhood to adulthood. I found it very interesting but I can also see how some maybe wouldn’t care for it. Give it a try, you can always not finish it if you don’t like it!

I watched an interview with her last night, and she was talking about how she wrote it for those that are questioning how they are raised by don’t want to give up Christ. She refers to is at disentangling, not deconstructing. My take away was that I was not as interested in it as I thought I would be, because I think it’s going to be how you can give up Gotherd and still be a Christian.

[msmerymac]

Jun 4, 2023 6:06:15 GMT -5 maudefindlay said:

I looked it up and looks like she and her son have 10 year orders of protection against Jim and that in Arkansas these are given in domestic abuse situations.

As of April? Interesting. Based on the fact that I think Jill is pregnant in her interviews I'm guessing they shot the Holts' interviews over a year ago. 

[gretchenindisguise]

Jun 6, 2023 9:21:52 GMT -5 msmerymac said:

Jun 4, 2023 6:06:15 GMT -5 maudefindlay said:

I looked it up and looks like she and her son have 10 year orders of protection against Jim and that in Arkansas these are given in domestic abuse situations.

As of April? Interesting. Based on the fact that I think Jill is pregnant in her interviews I'm guessing they shot the Holts' interviews over a year ago. 

Yeah, I was reading an article that they were likely filmed in Spring of 2022. The order of protection was from April 2023. 

Just another example of you don't know what is going on when the cameras turn off. They came across as a united front in their interviews - but a 10 year order of protection says something very different.