Israel at war after surprise attack

[dulcemariamar]

Woke up to the news this morning but haven’t had much time to follow it.

edition.cnn.com/middleeast/live-news/al-aqsa-storm-militants-infiltrate-israel-after-gaza-rockets-10-07-intl-hnk/index.html

[Velar Fricative]

Yeah the news has been really chaotic so I can only imagine how awful things are there right now.

[estrellita]

My cousin goes there often for her job, I'll have to check in and see where she is right now. Hoping she's far from there 😕

ETA: She is safe, here in the US. Hoping they don't send her there anytime soon. Or even better is for things to cool down but.. that's wishful thinking I'm sure.

[imimahoney]

This is a disaster and will only end with countless dead.

[bronxgirl]

Like the Yom Kippur war of 1973, this was also a sneak attack during a religious holiday. ( Sukkot/ Simchat Torah). This is such a scary and upsetting time.

[goldengirlz]

I am horrified reading the news this morning, and terrified about what’s to come.

I thought this news analysis from The Times covered a lot of the political issues in question now, as a decent starting point:

www.nytimes.com/2023/10/07/world/middleeast/israel-gaza-war-hamas-palestinians.html

My thoughts are with everyone who has loved ones in Israel, Gaza or the West Bank.

[fryjack2]

f*ck Netanyahu and f*ck Hamas. This was not a totally unexpected situation. Its been building. Here's a brief from the UN a couple weeks ago condemning the ongoing expansion of Israeli settlements into areas they are not supposed to be in. Yet continue without consequences and escalate tension in the area.

press.un.org/en/2023/sc15424.doc.htm

Also, Israeli forces attack during Muslim holidays as well, including the attack on the Al-Aqsa mosque during Ramadan prayers in April. I'm not saying either side's attacks are ok, just that neither side is innocent and the media is horrible at being unbiased.

The innocent civilians in Israeli land, and the innocent civilians in the occupied territories who now have had their electricity turned off, access to medical care even further limited, and their lives made worse are in my thoughts.

[AJL]

Oy. My BIL and his family made aliyah in August and they live in Modi'in (literally in the middle between Tel Aviv and Jerusalem). Not surprisingly, we are all very worried right now.

[scm1011]

So awful. One of my best friends is from Jerusalem and her brother is being called to reserve duty. They’re all very scared and bracing for things to get worse.

[tiki]

H has coworkers in Israel. So far most of them have checked in, but they haven't heard from the person in Jerusalem. Another said that he marched in Jerusalem a month ago and signed a pledge not to go if called up, but given the circumstances he finds all that is out the window and he will be reporting for duty on Tuesday.

[imimahoney]

I know most are anti Twitter this reporter is on the ground with up to date information.

x.com/NTarnopolsky?t=tka1odpfJDy_xRYfJH2RBA&s=09

[aurora]

It's hard to know what to say, beyond that war sucks and I'm so sad for everyone who has lost someone.

[basilosaurus]

Or as the headlines read here, Israel declares war on Palestine.

I'm no apologist for Israel and their illegal and aggressive push into the west bank, but it's so striking to see how different reporting is.

[AJL]

Oct 7, 2023 17:59:52 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

Or as the headlines read here, Israel declares war on Palestine.

I'm no apologist for Israel and their illegal and aggressive push into the west bank, but it's so striking to see how different reporting is.

Can I ask where "here" is?

[scm1011]

Oct 7, 2023 17:59:52 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

Or as the headlines read here, Israel declares war on Palestine.

I'm no apologist for Israel and their illegal and aggressive push into the west bank, but it's so striking to see how different reporting is.

I mean this is what it is, yes? All my visit Boston-based Israeli friends see it this way.

[basilosaurus]

Oct 7, 2023 19:19:16 GMT -5 AJL said:

Oct 7, 2023 17:59:52 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

Or as the headlines read here, Israel declares war on Palestine.

I'm no apologist for Israel and their illegal and aggressive push into the west bank, but it's so striking to see how different reporting is.

Can I ask where "here" is?

here is Malaysia, 90% Muslim. You see Palestine flags all over.

I don't really speak Malay but I read local English language news, and it's just shy of outright saying Israel declares war on Islam.

[basilosaurus]

Oct 7, 2023 19:31:39 GMT -5 scm1011 said:

Oct 7, 2023 17:59:52 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

Or as the headlines read here, Israel declares war on Palestine.

I'm no apologist for Israel and their illegal and aggressive push into the west bank, but it's so striking to see how different reporting is.

I mean this is what it is, yes? All my visit Boston-based Israeli friends see it this way.

I don't disagree. Netanyahu was waiting for a convenient reason. But articles here don't even mention the hamas attack that precipitated this statement. Whether the attack was justified cannot even enter the conversation if you don't acknowledge it happened.

This is a country where it's technically illegal to speak or write any Yiddish word. It's really draconian in many many ways.

And yet they, Malay Muslim friends, paradoxically don't care I'm an atheist who liberally sprinkles Yiddish into everyday talk (I'm from s fl and don't even notice I do this). They'll even ask me to teach them words. While being vehemently anti Israel. I still don't get it after over 3 years.

[mcppalmbeach]

Heartbreaking for the suffering of innocent people this will cause. I was reading about the young woman who was taken hostage from the music festival and was videoed being spit upon and paraded around the streets naked. It just makes me ill.

[VillainV]

Oct 8, 2023 7:54:35 GMT -5 mcppalmbeach said:

Heartbreaking for the suffering of innocent people this will cause. I was reading about the young woman who was taken hostage from the music festival and was videoed being spit upon and paraded around the streets naked. It just makes me ill.

I can’t help but think the world could be a much better place if women were in charge of everything.

[StrawberryBlondie]

Oct 7, 2023 17:59:52 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

Or as the headlines read here, Israel declares war on Palestine.

I'm no apologist for Israel and their illegal and aggressive push into the west bank, but it's so striking to see how different reporting is.

This was also the headline in my WaPo news alert this AM.

[ohgillian]

It’s been super telling to see how many people on my FB feed are posting about Israeli deaths who haven’t been doing the same about Palestinians for the last decade+. It’s dismaying to me from my feed that only some deaths matter to a lot of folks.

[goldengirlz]

Oct 8, 2023 9:08:57 GMT -5 StrawberryBlondie said:

Oct 7, 2023 17:59:52 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

Or as the headlines read here, Israel declares war on Palestine.

I'm no apologist for Israel and their illegal and aggressive push into the west bank, but it's so striking to see how different reporting is.

This was also the headline in my WaPo news alert this AM.

I’m really curious, that was the EXACT wording? Not Israel declares war on Hamas? Or just Israel declares war?

I’m surprised because I haven’t seen any English-language Western media saying Israel declared war “on Palestine.” On Hamas, yes. Or they’re calling it the Israel-Gaza conflict.

ETA: I don’t get news alerts from WaPo but their main story categorizes it as a declaration of war on Hamas.

[Saudade]

Oct 8, 2023 9:37:02 GMT -5 goldengirlz said:

Oct 8, 2023 9:08:57 GMT -5 StrawberryBlondie said:

This was also the headline in my WaPo news alert this AM.

I’m really curious, that was the EXACT wording? Not Israel declares war on Hamas? Or just Israel declares war?

I’m not seeing any English-language Western media saying Israel declared war “on Palestine.” On Hamas, yes. Or they’re calling it the Israel-Gaza conflict.

I’m in Spain and all the newspapers are putting “Israel vs Hamas” nothing about Palestine.

[StrawberryBlondie]

Oct 8, 2023 9:37:02 GMT -5 goldengirlz said:

Oct 8, 2023 9:08:57 GMT -5 StrawberryBlondie said:

This was also the headline in my WaPo news alert this AM.

I’m really curious, that was the EXACT wording? Not Israel declares war on Hamas? Or just Israel declares war?

I’m surprised because I haven’t seen any English-language Western media saying Israel declared war “on Palestine.” On Hamas, yes. Or they’re calling it the Israel-Gaza conflict.

I don't remember the exact wording and I cleared the alert a couple hours ago so unfortunately, I can't answer that. I'm pretty sure it said Palestine because I remember being surprised by it but it might have been couched a bit.

[eb777888]

Oct 8, 2023 7:54:35 GMT -5 mcppalmbeach said:

Heartbreaking for the suffering of innocent people this will cause. I was reading about the young woman who was taken hostage from the music festival and was videoed being spit upon and paraded around the streets naked. It just makes me ill.

I just read this story and I'm sick to my stomach. I cannot even imagine. Her poor mother. 

[AJL]

Oct 8, 2023 7:54:35 GMT -5 mcppalmbeach said:

Heartbreaking for the suffering of innocent people this will cause. I was reading about the young woman who was taken hostage from the music festival and was videoed being spit upon and paraded around the streets naked. It just makes me ill.

Her name is Shani Lauk and she is dead. She's German and was attending a music festival. 

[fryjack2]

Oct 8, 2023 9:23:41 GMT -5 ohgillian said:

It’s been super telling to see how many people on my FB feed are posting about Israeli deaths who haven’t been doing the same about Palestinians for the last decade+. It’s dismaying to me from my feed that only some deaths matter to a lot of folks.

There have been more Palestinians killed than Israelis in the conflict over the last few days. Any station you turn on, talks about the horror that Israelis are living right now, the number of Israelis killed, the terror they are feeling over and over. And one line that mentions the number of Palestinians killed-which is more than the number of Israelis. But nothing about the fear Palestinians in Gaza and elsewhere are feeling.

[AJL]

Oct 8, 2023 9:23:41 GMT -5 ohgillian said:

It’s been super telling to see how many people on my FB feed are posting about Israeli deaths who haven’t been doing the same about Palestinians for the last decade+. It’s dismaying to me from my feed that only some deaths matter to a lot of folks.

I'm prepared to be flamed, but I'm still going to say this: 

That may be the case. I am not even close to being an Israel apologist and I'm not much of a Zionist, but I'm not sure why it matters who stands by who right now.

This hits different and I can't exactly explain why. Obviously, whatever I say on the situation is going to be viewed from the lens that I am Jewish and I have a brother in law, sister in law, niece, and nephew living in Israel. We were able to call them yesterday and get confirmation that they are safe right now. Our conversation was interrupted by shelling in the background. I think there are only a few posters on this board who have ever had that experience; to talk to family while in an actively violent situation. 

All deaths should matter to us. The deaths of non-combatants, i.e. civilians, matter. The kidnapping, hostage taking, brutalizing, raping, and murdering of ANYONE -- Palestinian, Israeli, nationals from other countries (who are also being targeted) -- matter. 

This seems different and far more dangerous. Let's be completely honest: if Israel wanted to obliterate Palestinians, it would have. That's not a defense of the country and their actions by any means. It's just a realistic observation. Israel has committed extreme hostilities and atrocities against Palestinians. It's reprehensible. All of that is true. But this feels very, very dangerous and close to a prelude to a world war. Hamas is being backed by Iran. Iran is considerably powerful and this is very dangerous for more than just Israel. 

[aurora]

I agree that this is a very dangerous situation that could have far-reaching impacts. The NYT Morning Briefing mentions disruptions to talks with Saudi Arabia, as well.

For what it's worth, I went back to read the Briefing after this thread and its headline is "After a surprise assault, Israel says it is at war with Gaza" (i.e., neither Hamas nor Palestine).

[Saudade]

I feel like I have to put a ton of disclaimers at the beginning of this so as to not offend anyone. But as a never religious person there are certain intricacies that I will *never* understand.

The news is overwhelmingly focusing on the toll on Israel/Israelis and very little on the Palestinian people. My main news source is NYT and they are doing it as well.

Innocent people are on both sides of this. It’s only going to get worse. I have so many Palestinian friends who are worried about their families (as are Israeli people).