The continuing saga of my brother and the lying girlfriend

[ECB]

An update on my brother and his lying girlfriend – past post(s) if you need a refresher pandce.proboards.com/thread/637717/update-on-brother-wife

But summary is that he’s dating a woman who is still married and has 3 kids and seems to really be stringing him along with SO MANY LIES. And there are 3 very distinct areas where what she says can be verified or proven false online. I really think Amy knows she can tell him WHATEVER SHE WANTS and he’ll just believe it.

On the topic of marriage –

She recently said that the divorce papers are on the judges desk for him to review (which in and of itself is NOT how it works!), and she thinks the judge is going to make her and her DH go to a few sessions of counseling. Basically – continues to move the goal post….   But as of this week, she told him that the divorce will be finalized Dec. 11th.

Point 1 of verification – if papers were filed, they would be in the MD Judiciary database. They are not.

On the topic of moving in together –

They live about 1.5 hours apart. She claims she’s going to move in with him, but she needs to sell her house AND buy a smaller house in the same area. Her DDs LOVE their school so they need to stay where they are, and she needs a smaller house where she’ll stay 3 days a week, and then 4 with my brother.

A specific point of her claim is that her house is on the market AND that there is absolutely NO inventory anywhere around where she lives. There isn’t a single other house on the market!!!

Point 2 of verification – a simple search on Redfin proves this to be false on both points! PLENTY of houses on the market, and none are her house.

On the topic of work –

This one… this one is truly the tall tale. She’s an “entertainer/entrepreneur”. She supposedly works at a recording studio and is SUPER busy (i.e. doesn’t have as much time to see my brother as she did before) signing new bands, etc. That alone is suspect.

But then recently, she is claiming that the guy she works for is a financial advisor and she’s going to work with him, also as an FA. She’s already started meeting with clients at night (night – again, can’t see my brother) and signing them up and collecting cash (). She has a list over 50 people long who all want to meet with her and have her be their FA!!! She is just THAT GOOD at her job. (Nevermind all those pesky licenses you need, etc, to actually work in finance)

BUT as of last night, she now also needs to get TOP SECRET GOVERNMENT CLEARANCE because several (SEVERAL) of her new clients are big shots and she needs clearance to see their financials!!

This is where we’ve jumped the shark, I think. She’s just telling him shit to see what he’ll actually believe….

And Point 3 of verification – you can look up online broker status with the state. You’ll be shocked – SHOCKED – to know that she does NOT appear in any database as having any kind of licensure allowing her to be an FA.

We're just baffled by this and by his total blind acceptance and his total lack of ANY curiosity about what she claims. He has her on a pedestal so high, nothing can knock it down. 

[krystee]

What is she getting out of this? That sounds so unnecessarily complicated and exhausting. Does he spend a ton of money on her? Is it just the attention?

Has he met her kids?

[ECB]

Nov 4, 2023 9:47:47 GMT -5 krystee said:

What is she getting out of this? That sounds so unnecessarily complicated and exhausting. Does he spend a ton of money on her? Is it just the attention?

Has he met her kids?

at a base level - she’s doing this for attention. No doubt. He doesn’t have a ton of $$, so I don’t think it’s that. But a couple things around her interest in finance does concern me that she may be angling to get him to “invest” with her. But she’s committed a LOT of time to this for it to be only about scamming him for $$.

He’s met her 3 year old son, he hasn’t met her 11 or 13 yo DDs.

[dancingirl21]

He still thinks this is all legit? Nothing at all is throwing up a red flag?

I can’t remember from the previous post on this, but has anyone in your family voiced their concerns? Obviously if he’s this in the weeds with her he probably won’t believe any of you. Yikes all around.

[mcppalmbeach]

Ugh. I know you’ve said he has his own issues, but I feel bad for your brother because this will crash hard and fast. I also want to know what she’s getting out of this. Is he spending a bunch of money on her? Is she just a lying psychopath?

[ECB]

Nov 4, 2023 9:59:50 GMT -5 dancingirl21 said:

He still thinks this is all legit? Nothing at all is throwing up a red flag?

I can’t remember from the previous post on this, but has anyone in your family voiced their concerns? Obviously if he’s this in the weeds with her he probably won’t believe any of you. Yikes all around.

my stepmother will ask a couple questions to poke a little - but he shuts it down, and she’s also trying to balance things where he’ll keep talking to her. If she pushes too hard, he’ll just avoid her.

[ECB]

Nov 4, 2023 10:05:54 GMT -5 mcppalmbeach said:

Ugh. I know you’ve said he has his own issues, but I feel bad for your brother because this will crash hard and fast. I also want to know what she’s getting out of this. Is he spending a bunch of money on her? Is she just a lying psychopath?

I feel bad too. And I think it’s more that she’s probably a narcissist and wants ATTENTION.

Eventually this will crash and burn.

[joy]

The psychology of Amy is probably a fascinating ride.

[litebright]

Clearance from the government ... to see someone's personal financials ... in order to give them financial advice. hoooboy.

I'm sure it has to be hard to watch someone you care about being taken for this kind of ride, even if it hasn't yet crossed the line into him being financially scammed.

[pumpkin]

I’m sorry you’re having to watch this play out.
I can’t imagine being her and trying to keep all the lies straight.

[cheeseplease]

I always think "I'd be on the phone SO FAST to the (ex)husband! But I am very against drama so probably not. I never see the point of situations like this except scamming for money. Its amazing to me that your brother is just "whatever" to what she says/claims. I call women like this golden p*ssies.

[nsl]

Nov 4, 2023 11:32:46 GMT -5 cheeseplease said:

I always think "I'd be on the phone SO FAST to the (ex)husband! But I am very against drama so probably not. I never see the point of situations like this except scamming for money. Its amazing to me that your brother is just "whatever" to what she says/claims. I call women like this golden p*ssies.

I wonder if there isn't a lot of sunk-cost fallacy thinking happening on his end. He's stuck with her through some ridiculous stories and excuses this long, so it would be humiliating to call her out on these ones now and admit to himself (and everyone else) that he should have seen though her earlier.

[fernweh]

Have you guys met Amy? I’m a little bit wondering if he is just fine sleeping with a married woman but doesn’t want to come across as a scum bag so he is weaving tales for his family so he doesn’t look bad and doesn’t realize what he is saying is verifiable?

[spinnaker5]

Your poor brother: when the house of cards collapses, which is inevitable at some point, I’m sure it will be devastating.

That said, this made me chuckle: entertainer/entrepreneur + meeting clients at night + taking cash + long line of clients wanting to meet? I mean, it’s like she’s begging him to put the pieces together to get to an Occam’s Razor conclusion here (even if that’s not actually what is going on - just saying it’s like she wants him to accuse her of being a pro), and as long as he continues to refuse to do that, she feels justified in continuing to gaslight him.

[cattledogkisses]

Nov 4, 2023 9:47:47 GMT -5 krystee said:

What is she getting out of this? That sounds so unnecessarily complicated and exhausting. Does he spend a ton of money on her? Is it just the attention?

Has he met her kids?

Some people are truly just pathological liars.  I've had dealings with a person like this in my own life.

[ECB]

Nov 4, 2023 11:43:56 GMT -5 fernweh said:

Have you guys met Amy? I’m a little bit wondering if he is just fine sleeping with a married woman but doesn’t want to come across as a scum bag so he is weaving tales for his family so he doesn’t look bad and doesn’t realize what he is saying is verifiable?

My SM did last year.  

He's a sociopath and we've seen MANY times in the past where he creates fantasies about his life and speaks them like they really happened.  He's also OFTEN the hero of the story too.  So- on HIS end, unfortunately I think we're hearing the "truth" as he sees it.  He doesn't think critically, he doesn't ask questions.  And I think he's also desperate to be in a relationship, to be married.  And he's found someone who SAYS they want the same, and they want it with HIM.  SO..... he's going along for the ride.  But it will NEVER end the way he wants it to. 

[ECB]

Nov 4, 2023 11:54:41 GMT -5 spinnaker5 said:

Your poor brother: when the house of cards collapses, which is inevitable at some point, I’m sure it will be devastating.

That said, this made me chuckle: entertainer/entrepreneur + meeting clients at night + taking cash + long line of clients wanting to meet? I mean, it’s like she’s begging him to put the pieces together to get to an Occam’s Razor conclusion here (even if that’s not actually what is going on - just saying it’s like she wants him to accuse her of being a pro), and as long as he continues to refuse to do that, she feels justified in continuing to gaslight him.

Oh, yes.  We laughed at the irony of all these pieces too! 

[wise_rita]

Homegirl has got multiple side dudes in addition to your bro, who himself is in addition to her husband.

Will be interesting to see how this eventually all goes to hell.

[fortnightlily]

Has anyone checked if she has an OnlyFans account?

[livinitup]

There is just so much to say … but then very, very little, too.

She’s going to clean him out.

[cmeon]

It's interesting that you describe your brother as a sociopath. These stories make a lot more sense when framed in that way- just delusions about a relationship that's not going the way he wants it to. That's not to say that she doesn't have her own mental issues- but what you're hearing from your brother probably doesn't deserve to be taken at face value.

[ECB]

Nov 4, 2023 14:44:37 GMT -5 cmeon said:

It's interesting that you describe your brother as a sociopath. These stories make a lot more sense when framed in that way- just delusions about a relationship that's not going the way he wants it to. That's not to say that she doesn't have her own mental issues- but what you're hearing from your brother probably doesn't deserve to be taken at face value.

I don't discount this - at all.  And it is something that my SM I do think about and talk about.  What we've kind of observed, though - usually the first telling of a story that is happening in real time is relatively "the truth".  But he'll start to change the story over time.  Even this week- what he told my SM about how he and Amy met... the story has changed from what he told her a year ago.  Which is why there is actually stuff I haven't mentioned here because to try and explain what the first story was and what the present story is... it's too much!

Oh, and in her being an FA - (from his mouth - )she's told my brother that she is being flown to FL in a private jet to be deposed over the financial records of a guy involved in the "biggest real estate case ever", and her "fee" is enough for her to buy a car.  To the degree of what SHE actually said, to what he's possibly added to it in passing it on?  It's very possible. This particular story is SOOOOOO out there - that I put very little value on it. I could see this story being a fantasy he's cooking up - but I do believe it's based on the basic lie that she's telling him she's an FA who people are lining up to be her client. 

Another example - A couple years ago he started talking to my SM about a race horse he owned.  Huh? What?  RACE HORSE?  He didn't own it any more, but he started talking about "when he owned a race horse".  It's when the stories come in "after the fact" that we fully do think he's making stuff up in his head, or blending his reality with the reality of someone he knows.  There's a whole series of stories around "the year he lived in NYC".  In real time/present time, he NEVER EVER talked about or was actively living in NY.  These stories were all past tense - and we know they are all bull. 

[blondemoment123]

Can someone hook her up with @sameoldstory STBXH.
They're both a piece of work!

[livinitup]

ECB I really like you as a poster. And I fully support you starting a series where you post about the detailed story telling of your brother. Either this relationship or really any shenanigans about him.

I mean you can’t just casually drop that how he met his girlfriend (lie, real, ever changing) is too bizarre to tell!

[7costanza]

I love hearing about stuff like this, is so fascinating to think about why people tell these kind of lies and why others believe them.

My BIL is like Amy to a much lesser extent and my sister seems to buy all his lies. It’s totally baffling to me because they seems so obvious. The latest with them is that someone is trying to scam them by calling all their family members, including me, and pretending to be a collections agency looking for BIL. Meanwhile their cell phones were shut off because they owe $1800 (not their fault of course 🙄) so it seems pretty likely they were actually sent to collections.

[wanderingback]

If your brother is a sociopath how do you know all this stuff is the truth that he’s telling?

I have no doubt that people are liars and "crazy" and make up stuff but is your brother’s version of the truth the actual truth if he is also a sociopath?

[JayhawkGirl]

She sounds like a con artist running a long con on him

[basilosaurus]

Nov 4, 2023 19:45:12 GMT -5 wanderingback said:

If your brother is a sociopath how do you know all this stuff is the truth that he’s telling?

I have no doubt that people are liars and "crazy" and make up stuff but is your brother’s version of the truth the actual truth if he is also a sociopath?

She's said before that they also don't believe him. That the stories initially probably have kernels of truth, but the more they go on the more they get embellished. And if he's only talking in past tense about something they're first hearing about, it's likely only marginally true at best. I think this saga has been going on for a year at least

[mcsangel2]

I think it might be more accurate to call this the saga of the lying brother and his married girlfriend. Especially since it sounds like no one in your family has met the girlfriend more than once.

[wise_rita]

Nov 5, 2023 1:03:52 GMT -5 mcsangel2 said:

I think it might be more accurate to call this the saga of the lying brother and his married girlfriend. Especially since it sounds like no one in your family has met the girlfriend more than once.

Equally as likely the brother is just delusional, and not maliciously lying.