That pesky cell phone question again

[waverly]

DS (13) has a Gabb phone.  He would like the next step up from that phone in the next year.  When he was 11 he was irresponsible with the iPad and figured out the password and would stay up late playing games.  He learned his lesson and got in trouble.  Other than being on the switch too much he seems better.  We take away the switch during the week, and he plays with friends on the weekends.  He also left his phone outside overnight a couple of times so I was glad he didn't have an iPhone at that time.  He has matured since then.  

DD (10) almost 11 would also like a phone because I would say about 30-50%? of the kids have phones.  They have a group text and she feels left out. She would like a Pinwheel or iPhone rather than a Gabb phone. She didn't like DS's Gabb phone as much.  She throws tantrums when I let her plan on my phone and then tell her to get off.  Her behavior lately hasn't been great, disrespectful and tantrums.  

DS would like them both to have iPhones.  I want them locked down as much as possible.  I think iPhone has gotten better in this regard?  It used to have a lot of work arounds/ loop holes.  Have they been closed yet?

I would thinking DS- iPhone and DD Pinwheel.  Thinking of these as a Christmas present.  DS got his phone for his 12th birthday, and she would get hers at 11.  

Do you agree with DH, iPhones for both?  Or starter phone for DD and iPhone for DS?  I think she would be upset if DS got an iPhone and she got nothing.  We would get used less expensive iPhones.  She has no need for a phone so it is really the jealousy that she has and feeling left out.  Her friends that have phones have had them since 3-4th grade.  If she didn't get it now it would be beginning of middle school which is in 9-10 months.  

[minniemouse]

We did iPhones because I have one, and both my girls had iPads/iPod touches so they were used to the OS. Also, iMessage / FaceTime only works with Apple- and most of their friends use Apple products.
Dd1 got an iPhone at 11, dd2 at age 10. Both had gizmo watches before that. I have screen time locked down. Ask to buy is turned on, so they cannot download anything without it notifying me and requiring me to approve it.
I am lucky in that both are very responsible with their things and follow phone rules. If they weren’t we would just stick with smart watches.
ETA- before getting her own phone Dd2 would constantly ask ti use mine and didn’t like giving it back. A lot of that has to do with the fact she was only one without a phone in the family. Now if I ask her to put hers away she does it without a complaint. She knows it can be taken away if she doesn’t listen- and she really doesn’t want that to happen. Lol.

[macmars45]

Starter phone for your DD. Or nothing until she's 12 and a starter phone then.

You said she's throwing tantrums about having to be done with time on your phone and being disrespectful. Sounds like she's not mature enough for a phone of her own.

[sadie]

We did a watch at 10, then an iphone se at 11. Most of her friends got phones around that time. Behavior is notably worse the addition of a phone, though it's tough to distinguish whether it's phone or age or both that is the problem.

Long story short, I'd do a lite phone for the younger one to test the waters.

[luckystar2]

We waited until 13 for an iPhone. I wouldn’t get your younger child an iPhone just cause of jealousy.

As far as iPhone being better about locking them down…no. I’m frustrated ALL THE TIME with the parental controls. I have screentime set up for my DD’s phone where it has downtime that is supposed to shut everything down at specified times. It randomly will just turn off the settings. I just looked last night and realized it’s all been turned off for who knows how long. When I want to make adjustments to the schedule it will not take. I have to do it like 10x (not an exaggeration) before it will stick. It’s terrible imo. I really need some other parental controls. Im lucky that my dd is not one to stay on her phone all night so it isn’t a huge deal when iPhone’s settings disappear. But I wouldn’t trust the settings to be reliable.

[VillainV]

My 9.5 year old would absolutely not be able to keep track of a phone without losing it. He does have an iPad he can use for chatting with friends, and a Gabb watch when he’s out in the neighborhood, but a phone is a hard no until he can be more responsible with his belongings. Maybe your 10yo is better about this. But I still would be wary about a high-value item until they could prove themselves trustworthy not to lose a phone. For that reason alone I’d go with a less expensive model. Now maybe this could be a used older iPhone or SE model or whatever, or maybe a different brand.

[waverly]

Nov 10, 2023 15:58:49 GMT -5 VillainV said:

My 9.5 year old would absolutely not be able to keep track of a phone without losing it. He does have an iPad he can use for chatting with friends, and a Gabb watch when he’s out in the neighborhood, but a phone is a hard no until he can be more responsible with his belongings. Maybe your 10yo is better about this. But I still would be wary about a high-value item until they could prove themselves trustworthy not to lose a phone. For that reason alone I’d go with a less expensive model. Now maybe this could be a used older iPhone or SE model or whatever, or maybe a different brand.

That is why we got DS the Gabb phone.  It was actually free, but it does cost $35 a month for the service and there is no monitoring of texts, but luckily DS hasn't said anything inappropriate.

The Pinwheel is $200 and can be placed on our plan with $15 a month for monitoring.  

[waverly]

Nov 10, 2023 15:53:42 GMT -5 luckystar2 said:

We waited until 13 for an iPhone. I wouldn’t get your younger child an iPhone just cause of jealousy.

As far as iPhone being better about locking them down…no. I’m frustrated ALL THE TIME with the parental controls. I have screentime set up for my DD’s phone where it has downtime that is supposed to shut everything down at specified times. It randomly will just turn off the settings. I just looked last night and realized it’s all been turned off for who knows how long. When I want to make adjustments to the schedule it will not take. I have to do it like 10x (not an exaggeration) before it will stick. It’s terrible imo. I really need some other parental controls. Im lucky that my dd is not one to stay on her phone all night so it isn’t a huge deal when iPhone’s settings disappear. But I wouldn’t trust the settings to be reliable.

I was hoping it had gotten better.  Bummer.  

[vmars]

We got DS, 9 (he will be 10 next month) and Apple Watch and it’s perfect. We have it very locked down esp during school. We can control who he messages, what apps he can use when, etc. Some kids have phones but I think most have watches. Hes in 4th grade. I also like that it’s always on him and not as easy to lose like a phone.

[mrsGreeko]

Apple’s loopholes have gotten much better. If you set them up right they are really robust. My DD has a friend whose dad keeps setting it up wrong so she can turn screentime off for herself. If you go iPhone for your younger, I’d basically turn everything off, especially Safari, and make it a phone only. It’s easy enough to do this. There are a couple of loopholes still, but it is easy enough to make sure those are closed as a parent too. Things like making sure your kid doesn’t know your iPhone PIN because then they can change certain settings regarding family sharing which allows them to download apps without having to “ask to buy.” Always start off more restrictive because it’s easier to give more than to reel back.

However, I think phones are way worse than we are lead to believe. And also great because it allows for communication and connection. But, I think they’ve done serious damage to my older two kids. We are holding off much longer with the youngest in hopes of mitigating some of that. But also understanding the social implications of it. It all sucks, parenting in this technological age.

[dochas]

I would not reward tantrums with an iPhone. I also wouldn't get a phone to keep her from being jealous. They're different ages and she shouldn't expect to have and do everything he does. And you're never going to have everything your friends have. My son is 13 and got a Samsung watch when we switched phone plans a few months ago. It works on its own without a phone, but it does need to be an add on to a phone line. He has one of our old phones. It's so old it's almost completely useless. It's 4G!! As I'm reminded often enough to make me think he would like to have a newer model! We are going to get him something better for Christmas. I like that he's had this time with it so we can see how it's going. His friends are big into phones and they can't have them out in school. I love that it is not a total disaster in his friend group/grade. If it was a problem in any way I would not entertain the idea of getting him something that would make it worse.

[imimahoney]

My son got a Samsung this summer when he started middle school (6th grade). The Samsung has been great with parental controls. We basically have full control over his phone at all times. It also lives in the livingroom at night so there is no using it in his room while he is supposedly sleeping.

[outnumbered]

My two older kids have iphones. They have had them since the were 13. My youngest (14) has an apple watch SE and no phone. I like that he has a watch because it is attached to him, not in a backpack or laying in the grass, so he always responds to texts.

Your 10 year old should not get a phone. They will be better off without one. My kids hated it, but I held fast that they needed to be 13.

I have never had an issue with apple parental controls. They are set and have never been disabled. I suggest going to the apple store and asking for help with the controls. I disabled the controls on the older two kids since they are at the end of teenagerhood.

[hermione]

I wouldn’t give a kid a phone if they threw tantrums about giving up mine. That’s a recipe for disaster.

My 10yo has an Apple Watch - lets her text with friends and contact us or us contact her. That’s all she needs. I have no plans to get her a phone anytime soon.

[erbear]

I'm a hard no on a 10 year old with a cell phone unless there is an extenuating circumstance (and this is not one -- she can use an iPad for texting and it's less accessible). I would get DS an iPhone - it sounds like he has "proved" his learning from his mistake and he's 13.

[plutosmoon]

DD has a moto phone, she got it at 10. Family link works pretty well for us. I am an android user, so that factored in as well, I found the iPad very frustrating in terms of parent control. I remember calling apple support about app approval and the guy couldn't understand I had no other apple products to approve on, he kept telling me to use my iPhone.

I told her she had to prove she could take care of a phone before I invested in a pricey phone. She is perfectly content with her low priced android. I don't anticipate upgrading it until she is 13 or so.

[abs]

iPhone for your DS but no phone for your DD yet. She will most likely mature a lot before 6th grade and you can reassess then.

[robot]

So, fyi, we had a Pinwheel phone for about 6 months (1.5 yrs ago), and it was terrible. Constant frustration (for me) in terms of various things not working as they should. I never got Life360 to work, even though they claim it should. The GPS tracking that came with it was dysfunctional frequently. Limited apps that can be downloaded, so many bugs. The only nice thing was the ability to view texts on my own device, rather than have to look at hers. But overall, it was a failure for us. I subsequently got my daughter a cheap Android phone instead, and set it up with Google Family Link. It's been so much better. I haven't personally used iPhone for parental controls, but maybe they are similarly better. I'd want to get as cheap a phone as possible for a 10 year old though.

[waverly]

Nov 11, 2023 0:44:27 GMT -5 robot said:

So, fyi, we had a Pinwheel phone for about 6 months (1.5 yrs ago), and it was terrible. Constant frustration (for me) in terms of various things not working as they should. I never got Life360 to work, even though they claim it should. The GPS tracking that came with it was dysfunctional frequently. Limited apps that can be downloaded, so many bugs. The only nice thing was the ability to view texts on my own device, rather than have to look at hers. But overall, it was a failure for us. I subsequently got my daughter a cheap Android phone instead, and set it up with Google Family Link. It's been so much better. I haven't personally used iPhone for parental controls, but maybe they are similarly better. I'd want to get as cheap a phone as possible for a 10 year old though.

Thanks for this. It sounds like I am better off with the free Gabb phone. It works, not wonderfully, but it fulfills the function and we already have it. GPS doesn’t update great but I can figure out that he made it to middle school when biking which is the purpose.

[mcppalmbeach]

Nov 10, 2023 20:10:36 GMT -5 hermione said:

I wouldn’t give a kid a phone if they threw tantrums about giving up mine. That’s a recipe for disaster.

My 10yo has an Apple Watch - lets her text with friends and contact us or us contact her. That’s all she needs. I have no plans to get her a phone anytime soon.

Can I ask you questions about this? My 12yo middle schooler only has an iPad. For a lot of reasons (including mistakes I made with his brother!) I really didn’t want him to have a phone. It has come up a bunch of times that he needs to contact me and so I wanted to get him an Apple Watch. I went to Best Buy and they said the watch has to be tied to a phone. I thought the newer watches could function as a phone as long as you paid for a separate phone line. How do you handle this? My 14yo also wants an Apple Watch. He does have a phone. I don’t need to pay for the phone line for the watch do I?

[InBetweenDays]

I would do the starter phone for your DD.

Our kids each got a Samsung for Christmas of their 6th grade year. I loved the Samsung because H and I have pixels and i found them very easy to lock down.

When the kids wanted iPhones (which if course they did because that's what their friends had) they had to pay for them themselves.

[lilac05]

Nov 11, 2023 8:51:30 GMT -5 mcppalmbeach said:

Nov 10, 2023 20:10:36 GMT -5 hermione said:

I wouldn’t give a kid a phone if they threw tantrums about giving up mine. That’s a recipe for disaster.

My 10yo has an Apple Watch - lets her text with friends and contact us or us contact her. That’s all she needs. I have no plans to get her a phone anytime soon.

Can I ask you questions about this? My 12yo middle schooler only has an iPad. For a lot of reasons (including mistakes I made with his brother!) I really didn’t want him to have a phone. It has come up a bunch of times that he needs to contact me and so I wanted to get him an Apple Watch. I went to Best Buy and they said the watch has to be tied to a phone. I thought the newer watches could function as a phone as long as you paid for a separate phone line. How do you handle this? My 14yo also wants an Apple Watch. He does have a phone. I don’t need to pay for the phone line for the watch do I?

The Apple Watch does not need to be tied to a phone. My almost 13 year old has one and no phone. It’s a bit of a pain sometimes with settings, and I know there has to be a better way…but it works well enough for us. It allows him to connect to some of his friends and to us without all of the other stuff. It’s been a really good solution.

As far as loopholes, one thing I’ve come to accept is that kids will always, ALWAYS find the loopholes…or create them. They are so smart and they all talk, so if one shares their roadblock, chances are that someone else knows their way around it. (Like if there’s no browser, they can sometimes get to one through a Terms & Conditions link that they find somewhere else.) So we plan to rely a little on our control and a lot more on education and openness with them.

We have decided not to give phones/watches as a gift. They will be given a watch/phone to use, but ultimately, it is ours. I don’t feel good about giving them a gift but then giving them all kinds of rules and restrictions about how they can use that gift.

We are holding off on a phone as long as possible. I watch kids go from no phones to phones, and it makes me sad. They go from talking with their friends or finding something to do during down time to having their heads in their phones all the time, and I want to delay that as long as I can.

[Gato]

The 15-year-old inherited my old iPhone last year and has been happy enough with it. Before that, they had a flip phone.

The 11-year-old got an iPod touch (which still exists!) as sort of a starter phone at age 10. She can text and Facetime, but can't call, which she never does anyway. Actually, the 15-year-old doesn't ever call anyone either, like, they actively resist the suggestion that sometimes it would be easier to make a phone call. :S

We restrict the app usage for both of them to two hours a day, and they can't use their phones between 6-9 pm and we take the phones into our room from 10 pm - 8 am. (And school rules prevent them from using them during the day). We also have it set up that gets notified when they download an app, and he needs to approve it first before it's activated. We are pretty strict about what they have, so the oldest only got Instagram this year.

But when the shooting happened in Maine, I was glad they had their phones because their group chats really soothed them while school was cancelled. Now I kind of wish had both had phones during the start of the pandemic.

[mcppalmbeach]

Nov 11, 2023 9:46:20 GMT -5 lilac05 said:

Nov 11, 2023 8:51:30 GMT -5 mcppalmbeach said:

Can I ask you questions about this? My 12yo middle schooler only has an iPad. For a lot of reasons (including mistakes I made with his brother!) I really didn’t want him to have a phone. It has come up a bunch of times that he needs to contact me and so I wanted to get him an Apple Watch. I went to Best Buy and they said the watch has to be tied to a phone. I thought the newer watches could function as a phone as long as you paid for a separate phone line. How do you handle this? My 14yo also wants an Apple Watch. He does have a phone. I don’t need to pay for the phone line for the watch do I?

The Apple Watch does not need to be tied to a phone. My almost 13 year old has one and no phone. It’s a bit of a pain sometimes with settings, and I know there has to be a better way…but it works well enough for us. It allows him to connect to some of his friends and to us without all of the other stuff. It’s been a really good solution.

As far as loopholes, one thing I’ve come to accept is that kids will always, ALWAYS find the loopholes…or create them. They are so smart and they all talk, so if one shares their roadblock, chances are that someone else knows their way around it. (Like if there’s no browser, they can sometimes get to one through a Terms & Conditions link that they find somewhere else.) So we plan to rely a little on our control and a lot more on education and openness with them.

We have decided not to give phones/watches as a gift. They will be given a watch/phone to use, but ultimately, it is ours. I don’t feel good about giving them a gift but then giving them all kinds of rules and restrictions about how they can use that gift.

We are holding off on a phone as long as possible. I watch kids go from no phones to phones, and it makes me sad. They go from talking with their friends or finding something to do during down time to having their heads in their phones all the time, and I want to delay that as long as I can.

Absolutely this. I really don’t want to get my 12yo a phone — not because of seeing or doing anything inappropriate or losing the phone — but because it totally changes interaction. He definitely tends to be obsessive wit his technology and playing. He still has pretty good solutions to boredom - he fishes, he ties flies, he plays basketball, he also drives me crazy lol. When he has his iPad all of that decreases…and something like a phone that’s portable. I fear it will all go away completely. I’ve taken away iPads right now because the kids are refusing to clean up after themselves and he’s started to watch all the marvel movies again. Not that I think that’s like some great educational pursuit, but it’s better than constant you tube and scrolling and gaming.

[ny96]

My 10 year old just got a $20 Trac flip phone, the most basic of phones, and we still had to take it away because we caught him watching YouTube on it. My feeling about this is that a phone at that age should be for one thing, to reach parents, and should not be a present because if it’s a present then there is more of “this belongs to me and you can’t tell me what to do with it”. If he wants to text he can use the ipad, but I don’t trust him with a phone, both because I’m worried he’ll lose it, and because he’ll make poor choices and spend too much time playing with it.

[waverly]

DD’s behavior is so poor right now that DH and I have decided on no phone. Today I cancelled taking her to the book fair and started taking away her prize possessions (squishmallows). We’ll see how it goes because it’s been bad the last month or so, and we’re done. She behaved after both times which shows it is possible.

[ilikedonuts]

We’ve had no issues with downtime settings. We’ve locked down my daughter’s iPhone completely other than being able to text or call us. And during non-downtime she still has app limits and has to get approval from us for more minutes.

I’m more easy breezy than most people on here about age for phones, but we still lock them down.

[hermione]

Nov 11, 2023 8:51:30 GMT -5 mcppalmbeach said:

Nov 10, 2023 20:10:36 GMT -5 hermione said:

I wouldn’t give a kid a phone if they threw tantrums about giving up mine. That’s a recipe for disaster.

My 10yo has an Apple Watch - lets her text with friends and contact us or us contact her. That’s all she needs. I have no plans to get her a phone anytime soon.

Can I ask you questions about this? My 12yo middle schooler only has an iPad. For a lot of reasons (including mistakes I made with his brother!) I really didn’t want him to have a phone. It has come up a bunch of times that he needs to contact me and so I wanted to get him an Apple Watch. I went to Best Buy and they said the watch has to be tied to a phone. I thought the newer watches could function as a phone as long as you paid for a separate phone line. How do you handle this? My 14yo also wants an Apple Watch. He does have a phone. I don’t need to pay for the phone line for the watch do I?

C’s watch has its own phone number. I found Best Buy confusing when getting the watch and had much more luck at the Apple Store. Her watch line is $10/month through AT&T.

[notsopicky]

My kid is 12 and in 7th grade. He's a young 12, birthday in April. He got an Apple Watch at the beginning of the year, to replace his Gizmo watch, so it has its own #. He uses it to text me about after school stuff. That's it. He also has a phone that he can use, but only at home, he does not take it to school. H and I are careful not to call it his phone, we call it the House Phone (we don't have a landline).

Based on the backstory in this post (the tantrums and her age), I would not be giving your daughter a phone at all. Maybe a watch instead? The watch does have to be tied to a iPhone, but use the Family Share (it would tie to a parent's iPhone).

I would get your son an iPhone but as at least 1 PP said, I would not give it as a gift.

[IndiaInk]

Nov 11, 2023 8:51:30 GMT -5 mcppalmbeach said:

Nov 10, 2023 20:10:36 GMT -5 hermione said:

I wouldn’t give a kid a phone if they threw tantrums about giving up mine. That’s a recipe for disaster.

My 10yo has an Apple Watch - lets her text with friends and contact us or us contact her. That’s all she needs. I have no plans to get her a phone anytime soon.

Can I ask you questions about this? My 12yo middle schooler only has an iPad. For a lot of reasons (including mistakes I made with his brother!) I really didn’t want him to have a phone. It has come up a bunch of times that he needs to contact me and so I wanted to get him an Apple Watch. I went to Best Buy and they said the watch has to be tied to a phone. I thought the newer watches could function as a phone as long as you paid for a separate phone line. How do you handle this? My 14yo also wants an Apple Watch. He does have a phone. I don’t need to pay for the phone line for the watch do I?

I've been looking into this and found these resources for how to set up an Apple watch for a family member.  support.apple.com/en-us/HT211768
www.verizon.com/support/knowledge-base-234270/?fbclid=IwAR39cMIzmKkMgKOJBEhp64nwRjLRhEWUDKHDMqJBNJXMr579MVPc5_Afma4