High school extracurriculars and college acceptance

[sunshineandpinot]

This is a slight spin off from last month's AP course thread, which I found absolutely fascinating and I really appreciated those of you "in the know" weighing in. I loved hearing the different perspectives from all over the country. 
I have a high school freshman and she's trying to navigate high school classes, sports, and extracurriculars. It's making my head spin and we're a few years away.
I know the goal of an application is to tell a story. But my gosh, I started following limmytalks and what it takes to get into an Ivy. 
That's not our goal but my dd is bright and has NYU aspirations (too bad for her she doesn't have a NYU bank account!!)

What role do you think sports play in college acceptance? (not planning on playing in college.) My dd is sporty and is becoming sportier- she did 3 sports this year, two being varsity. Plus a club sport. That doesn't leave a ton of time for clubs, especially leadership positions. She is in a club or two and she does volunteer almost 100 hr a year. But most of her time out side of school is in sports. Could that be a disadvantage? (I'm trying to remember she's just a freshman and has some time for leadership roles!) 

I really don't want to make this about her; I'd love this thread to be an open discussion on extracurriculars and college acceptance. What are colleges looking for by way of extracurriculars? Is the goal to still be well-rounded or is that a thing of the past? This has all changed SO much since I went through a hundred years ago. 

[W.T.Faulkner]

Focus on what she enjoys. If she enjoys playing 3 sports, then that's great! Being a captain on one of those teams down the line is a leadership position. Hopefully, in later HS years, she'll be inducted into an academic honor society or two, and that will count as an extracurricular activity as well.

I am emphatically against trying to craft a HS experience with college admissions the primary focus (although it's certainly a consideration). Joy and learning come first, and then she can build a great college application based on her experiences.

Edit to add: The most selective colleges build their classes from the applications they receive during that year, so a student with the same credentials could be admitted one year and not the next based on the applicant pool.

Edit again:  Sports can be a wonderful pathway to a college. If she's interested in playing any of those sports at the college level, even at D3, she can start contacting coaches at colleges of interest in her junior year and see where it takes her. 

[Jalapeñomel]

Variety...colleges like to see kids with a variety of interests, especially if they aren't trying to play in college.

If your kid likes playing sports, let them play, who cares about college admissions. She will get into college.

[jinkies]

I have no idea, but have a HS sophomore and am interested in this discussion.

He plays one sport (and is SUPER into it) and is very involved in civil air patrol. Other than that, he has worked since his 14th birthday. That's pretty much all he has time for.

I do think that he'll qualify for NHS after this year. But he isn't involved in anything else through school. CAP is very leadership focused and he's done a lot through their program, so I'm hoping that will carry him.

I also watch Limmy talks and I honestly have no idea how kids find the time for all that. A big part of why DS didn't continue school sports in HS was because the time commitment was completely all consuming. I'm dumbfounded by applications where the kids play multiple varsity sports, are in 800 extracurriculars, start their own nonprofit, and cure cancer on the side, on top of 15 AP classes and a 1600 SAT.

Like, how?

I will say this... DS has a kid in his CAP squadron who is advancing quickly through the ranks, but is not actually engaged in the group at all. She looks impressive on paper, but it seems pretty clear that it's just something she's doing for a college resume vs actually doing because she's interested and engaged. In terms of college applications, does that matter? Probably not. But DS has no interest in joining things just to boost his potential college applications.

He is also not Ivy-bound, so hopefully doesn't matter.

I'm in another parent group where parents sometimes share their kids HS stats and the schools that accept them/merit offered. It's much more realistic then Limmy and makes me feel better!

[gummybear]

So I will preface this by saying that we aren’t really setting our sights on any particular college/Ivy/selective etc.

DD participates in 2 sports. She’s average at best so her focus is team comraderie (sp?) - welcoming the newer members and being friendly to the younger girls. Both (any, really) sports command a lot of time so it IS hard to be involved in other activities, esp as a leader. She tried to fill nooks and crannies with things of interest - she’s submitted to be published in the literary magazine, volunteering for community period tutoring, applying to be an “ambassador” (so, giving tours and presenting to prospective students etc). She’s taking a service trip to Tennessee this summer. Like I said, she doesn’t have any particular aspirations but she knows she needs to be well-rounded. Taking advantage of opportunities that don’t require all-in - as do sports (and theater, and academic clubs).

[penguingrrl]

My oldest is a junior now and I have entirely let them take the lead. They are in two varsity sports (marching band and swimming) because they enjoy them. They also are in science league because they love science and do a few other extra curriculars for fun ( school jazz band, a youth orchestra, a multi-county honors band, and they volunteer in a jazz band that exists to fundraise for the VFW and two honors societies). They also have a part time job as a cashier at the local grocery store. They’re super busy, but being busy has actually been great for their time management because they’re prone to procrastination on the days they are done with school at 2:30 and have no other commitments.

None of what they’re doing is purely for college resume, though. They do these things because they enjoy them and if they didn’t they would stop.

A lot of schools we’ve toured so far (including an Ivy) have said that they are trying to consider part time jobs or babysitting siblings as highly as extracurriculars because they recognize the amount of privilege inherent in being involved in extracurriculars and don’t want to discount students who need to contribute at home and can’t do as much as a result.

[devonpow]

We just did a round of college tours (Michigan, northwesters, U of Illinois, Purdue). At every info session, plus according to our high school counselors, extra curriculars and sports are the last thing they look at. The most important thing are your grades and what classes you take (so taking the highest level available). (If you are a D1 player/being recruited etc then sports are obviously more important)

For extra curricular they really look for them to A) for your passion (like, DS1 is applying for political science - having extra curriculars that show interest in that subject in some way), or show growth/responsibility (being an elected leader m, moving up in ranks in some way etc). Some schools like Jesuit colleges (Boston college etc) want to see volunteering since it’s such a focus on their mission statements etc). Also, just having a job is a great extra curricular that shows responsibility and focus etc

So I would sweat them too much. Just doing what they like and are interested in is what is important

[candreco]

DD is a freshman this year, and we're kind of operating under the assumption that there's a school out there for everyone who wants one. Her activities right now are tech theatre through school and Girl Scouts outside of it, and her grades so far make it likely she'll qualify for NHS when the time comes. Definitely not pushing her to join more clubs, any sports, or whatever just for the sake of college applications.

She is planning to pursue an IB diploma her junior/senior years, and is choosing classes to feed into that for next year. She was already leaning towards that, and learning that IB grads from her school have an almost 100% acceptance rate at the school she's wanted to go to since she was about 7 solidified her decision. Lucky for all of us it's a public, in-state school that still aligns really well with her interests.

Fingers crossed that what makes her happy is what they're looking for in students. We actually just signed up for an info session and tour over spring break so we can start that conversation- since she's been interested in this school for so long, I think we need to find out sooner than later whether or not it really is a good fit for her.

ETA: I think I mentioned this in the AP class thread too, but DD's guidance counselor is a former admissions counselor, and told DD that demonstrating ongoing interest in a school is going to help too.  Especially now that the common app makes it easy to apply to a lot of schools in one go, admissions committees are looking to accept students that they're reasonably confident will actually attend.  

[gummybear]

penguingrrl that is really reassuring to hear. DD has worked since 8th grade. It is not completely out of necessity (although we have always stressed the importance of her financial contribution to things like socializing, hair appointments, shopping for wants, driving etc.) but also bc she LIKES it. While she loves her school, it's a very vanilla, middle/upper class experience which is not really her cup of tea as far as getting variety. She loves that she has friends from all walks of life, different schools, different aspirations in life. This winter, she forgo (forgone? forwent? ) winter track to work more. It's nice to hear that they will consider stuff outside of school. IMO I've always thought a teenager who works is a more well-rounded person. But I'd say that's 50/50 here with a lot of kids not working, ever, so they concentrate on sports, academics or just enjoying life before the utter despair of adulthood sets in.

[W.T.Faulkner]

I just looked up this LimmyTalks person. He is a current Duke student with a TikTok who's never worked in college admissions.

I'd be wary of people like this.

[penguingrrl]

Feb 27, 2024 12:50:21 GMT -5 gummybear said:

penguingrrl that is really reassuring to hear. DD has worked since 8th grade. It is not completely out of necessity (although we have always stressed the importance of her financial contribution to things like socializing, hair appointments, shopping for wants, driving etc.) but also bc she LIKES it. While she loves her school, it's a very vanilla, middle/upper class experience which is not really her cup of tea as far as getting variety. She loves that she has friends from all walks of life, different schools, different aspirations in life. This winter, she forgo (forgone? forwent? ) winter track to work more. It's nice to hear that they will consider stuff outside of school. IMO I've always thought a teenager who works is a more well-rounded person. But I'd say that's 50/50 here with a lot of kids not working, ever, so they concentrate on sports, academics or just enjoying life before the utter despair of adulthood sets in.

Columbia and Hopkins both said that they want to see well rounded students, and that they consider work or caring for siblings just as valuable in terms of life experiences and building responsibility as clubs and sports and they also recognize the elitism of kids having access to those opportunities. They want to see a kid who is growing and developing, building independence, etc. but that there also isn’t a single path (i.e. needs to be varsity athlete, needs to do club sports, etc) that they look for in developing that. Columbia in particular likes to see work experience in a typical entry level job because it’s a different skill set that school-based success. My kid started working as soon as anyone would hire them and is saving to help with car insurance when they turn 17, etc. 

[jamaicam]

Disclaimer - I am a LONG way from my kids reaching this stage but I find it interesting! I have been seeing a lot of stuff recently about colleges looing for a kid's 'spike' - aka a special area of interest. So rather than doing a lot of everything, specializing a bit more in one area. So for example, a kid who likes to swim; then working as a lifeguard; then fundraising or teaching less privileged kids as their volunteering; then being captain of their swim team. And then wanting to study sports physiotherapy

I have no idea how much that relates to what is really out there versus just instagram talks!!

[candreco]

Feb 27, 2024 12:55:22 GMT -5 W.T.Faulkner said:

I just looked up this LimmyTalks person. He is a current Duke student with a TikTok who's never worked in college admissions.

I'd be wary of people like this.

Someone please insert the "She doesn't even go here!" gif for this guy....

[eb777888]

I'm not looking for David to twist himself into a pretzel to get into a particular college. We're being pretty laid back about it, but staying informed. We're all attending the college meeting next week his school is providing, then we do college tours through his school in early April (he's in 9th.) We encourage David to do what he loves- which right now is Band, Robotics and outside of school does the Young Men's Service League, which is a four year program that starts in 9th grade. He's made academic honors every quarter and is in Honors classes. I think that's a lot to manage and he's doing really well, but I don't encourage him to pile on more in the name of COLLEGE ACCEPTANCE. I'm in the, "I know he'll get accepted to a college" camp and leaving it at that. He does not have Ivy League aspirations.

[marvine]

My DS is a freshman in college this year, so we went through this last year. He works and had leadership experience there. He played soccer all 4 years. I think his GPA was a 3.2. He found a school that admitted him and he's happy and thriving. So while it all seems so crazy now, there is a school for everyone.

Our valedictorian gave her talk about how pushing herself to get all A's and do all the things affected her in a not so great way. It affected friendships, her mental health and sometimes her physical health. And if she had to go back and do it again - she'd have taken time to just be a kid and enjoy life and HS and not put so much pressure on herself. It was really powerful to hear her give that speech.

[meanie]

Sports help if she plans to play in college and would have a spot on the team, otherwise it is just another thing to list to show that she is well-rounded. If she can get a leadership position in whatever club/sport/activity she enjoys then that is even better.

If it puts your mind at ease, I got into a good college with a program I wanted and had little else going on outside of school. No sports, maybe a club or two. Average GPA and SATs. There are SO many colleges and programs out there that are great. I was able to break into those leadership roles while in college and that helped me get a job after, I think part of that was that there was less competition - my college didn't have an active student newspaper so I restarted it and was the editor, I don't think I could have broken into that role at someplace like NYU.

If she really has her heart set on a certain school I would have her meet with an admissions counselor now for an informational interview. I did this at a few schools and they helped me navigate what I needed to do before applying and how to connect what I was already involved in to what they would be looking for.

[somersault72]

Feb 27, 2024 13:03:20 GMT -5 marvine said:

My DS is a freshman in college this year, so we went through this last year. He works and had leadership experience there. He played soccer all 4 years. I think his GPA was a 3.2. He found a school that admitted him and he's happy and thriving. So while it all seems so crazy now, there is a school for everyone.

Our valedictorian gave her talk about how pushing herself to get all A's and do all the things affected her in a not so great way. It affected friendships, her mental health and sometimes her physical health. And if she had to go back and do it again - she'd have taken time to just be a kid and enjoy life and HS and not put so much pressure on herself. It was really powerful to hear her give that speech.

Thank you for this. Sometimes I get a little nervous thinking about college, but honestly DS will be fine. His grades are good, he's got loads of extra curriculars and he's not on the Ivy track or anything.

[kitchenreno]

Feb 27, 2024 12:56:42 GMT -5 jamaicam said:

Disclaimer - I am a LONG way from my kids reaching this stage but I find it interesting! I have been seeing a lot of stuff recently about colleges looing for a kid's 'spike' - aka a special area of interest. So rather than doing a lot of everything, specializing a bit more in one area. So for example, a kid who likes to swim; then working as a lifeguard; then fundraising or teaching less privileged kids as their volunteering; then being captain of their swim team. And then wanting to study sports physiotherapy

I have no idea how much that relates to what is really out there versus just instagram talks!!

I've heard something similar - that colleges now aren't looking for well rounded but instead "pointy" kids - kids who excel in one specific area.  Overall the college wants a well rounded class of kids, but they can achieve that by taking a whole bunch of "pointy" kids with different interests/skills/talents.  

I don't know if this is true or not but it's an interesting concept.  I certainly wouldn't discourage my child from participating in a variety of activities that meet their interests, but I also wouldn't fret too much if they had one very specific focus/talent that might set them apart from others. 

Honestly it all feels like a big crap shoot at this point.  The best advice I've heard is to not let your kid get fixated on just ONE school.  That's a recipe for disaster

[Jalapeñomel]

Feb 27, 2024 12:42:37 GMT -5 candreco said:

DD is a freshman this year, and we're kind of operating under the assumption that there's a school out there for everyone who wants one. Her activities right now are tech theatre through school and Girl Scouts outside of it, and her grades so far make it likely she'll qualify for NHS when the time comes. Definitely not pushing her to join more clubs, any sports, or whatever just for the sake of college applications.

She is planning to pursue an IB diploma her junior/senior years, and is choosing classes to feed into that for next year. She was already leaning towards that, and learning that IB grads from her school have an almost 100% acceptance rate at the school she's wanted to go to since she was about 7 solidified her decision. Lucky for all of us it's a public, in-state school that still aligns really well with her interests.

Fingers crossed that what makes her happy is what they're looking for in students. We actually just signed up for an info session and tour over spring break so we can start that conversation- since she's been interested in this school for so long, I think we need to find out sooner than later whether or not it really is a good fit for her.

ETA: I think I mentioned this in the AP class thread too, but DD's guidance counselor is a former admissions counselor, and told DD that demonstrating ongoing interest in a school is going to help too.  Especially now that the common app makes it easy to apply to a lot of schools in one go, admissions committees are looking to accept students that they're reasonably confident will actually attend.  

qft

All this handwringing and worry by parents stresses the kids out---then they stress out their friends and counselors and work themselves up that they will never go to college. 

Let them play sports if they like them. Let them do the theater or NHS or whatever it is they like. Please! 

[somersault72]

My kid (sophomore) is in a ton of things, but it's all because he likes doing them. He does varsity XC, jv soccer, marching band, choir, theater, and track. He has a PT job, and occasionally volunteers at a cat shelter. I mean, yes I think those things will look good on a college application, but he's the one who decided to do them and if he didn't enjoy them he wouldn't do them. He hadn't played soccer since he was like 8, and this year he was like "yeah I'm gonna play soccer." Um, OK. I mean he only got to go to like 3 or 4 games because of XC (to be fair, there weren't a lot of JV games to begin with because they weren't expecting to have a JV team) but whatever, he had fun.

[marvine]

Feb 27, 2024 13:08:36 GMT -5 somersault72 said:

Feb 27, 2024 13:03:20 GMT -5 marvine said:

My DS is a freshman in college this year, so we went through this last year. He works and had leadership experience there. He played soccer all 4 years. I think his GPA was a 3.2. He found a school that admitted him and he's happy and thriving. So while it all seems so crazy now, there is a school for everyone.

Our valedictorian gave her talk about how pushing herself to get all A's and do all the things affected her in a not so great way. It affected friendships, her mental health and sometimes her physical health. And if she had to go back and do it again - she'd have taken time to just be a kid and enjoy life and HS and not put so much pressure on herself. It was really powerful to hear her give that speech.

Thank you for this. Sometimes I get a little nervous thinking about college, but honestly DS will be fine. His grades are good, he's got loads of extra curriculars and he's not on the Ivy track or anything.

I joined a FB group last year and there are so many posts that say things like  "my kid only has a 4.2 gpa, 5 extracurriculars, 1560 SAT and 3 sports...are they doomed?"   It was giving me so much anxiety!   After a while, I learned to move past those posts quickly and focus on the ones about normal kids.  I still stressed until we got that accept email - but honestly there are so many schools out there, it really will be okay!   So I'm happy to share to help lessen anxiety about this for other first timers!  

[mrsGreeko]

I have a college freshman, a high school freshman and a middle schooler. My college freshman had a 2.2 GPA, no school extracurriculars, she worked from when she was 15 and babysat before that, and she did horseback riding for fun for a couple years during high school. She is at a state university that has guaranteed admissions for anyone with a 2.0 and above. She didn’t even want to go to college until this past October when she applied impulsively in the middle of the night. She started last month and is thriving. Seriously, there is a school for everyone. Kids should do things that they want to and enjoy because they want to do them and enjoy them, not because they think it might get them into x school. Who is to say that x school is where they will thrive anyway?

My HS freshman has like a 2.0 GPA so far and no extra curriculars at the moment. She volunteered 100+ hours at a puppy rescue in 8th grade and will probably volunteer again this summer. She’s also trying to get a job this summer. She will figure things out and find a place for college too. I’m not worried. Everyone can find a place in the world.

My middle schooler isn’t going to score high grades, but he has an extreme passion (hello ADHD hyperfocus) for fishing of all kinds that will probably help him when it comes time for college.

[Bad Dingo]

Feb 27, 2024 12:55:22 GMT -5 W.T.Faulkner said:

I just looked up this LimmyTalks person. He is a current Duke student with a TikTok who's never worked in college admissions.

I'd be wary of people like this.

I agree, I think his takes are ridiculous and based on what people send him.  I HIGHLY doubt that the kid who was like a 9th generation Dartmouth legacy who went to boarding school in MA is middle class as he stated.  It's all for clicks.

[archiethedragon]

My daughter is a sophomore and she is very concerned with having enough extra curriculars, the right curriculars, multiple sports, good grades, etc. in order to get into college. She knows the acceptance rate of various schools and feels all this pressure about it.

[eb777888]

Feb 27, 2024 13:14:54 GMT -5 marvine said:

Feb 27, 2024 13:08:36 GMT -5 somersault72 said:

Thank you for this. Sometimes I get a little nervous thinking about college, but honestly DS will be fine. His grades are good, he's got loads of extra curriculars and he's not on the Ivy track or anything.

I joined a FB group last year and there are so many posts that say things like  "my kid only has a 4.2 gpa, 5 extracurriculars, 1560 SAT and 3 sports...are they doomed?"   It was giving me so much anxiety!   

I absolutely refuse to give in to this madness. I even see a little of this on these boards. There is no way I'm putting that kind of pressure and stress on my already anxious, high-achieving kid. I feel like this burns them out!

[W.T.Faulkner]

Feb 27, 2024 13:25:30 GMT -5 eb777888 said:

Feb 27, 2024 13:14:54 GMT -5 marvine said:

I joined a FB group last year and there are so many posts that say things like  "my kid only has a 4.2 gpa, 5 extracurriculars, 1560 SAT and 3 sports...are they doomed?"   It was giving me so much anxiety!   

I absolutely refuse to give in to this madness. I even see a little of this on these boards. There is no way I'm putting that kind of pressure and stress on my already anxious, high-achieving kid. I feel like this burns them out!

Can confirm that it does.

Acceptance rates at the most selective colleges in the US are only going down. The total number of applications per year students submitted to colleges increased by 30% between 2019 and 2023, and that's on top of the fact that they DOUBLED between 2002 and 2017. Some of these colleges are getting 100,000+ applications.

At the risk of repeating myself, I can't overstate the importance of helping your kids to not tie their worth to acceptance to these highly selective schools. Of course I want my kids at school to shoot their shot and will support them in creating the strongest application we can, but they're not going to get these four years back, and I don't want them to spend it contorting themselves into what they think Michigan wants to see only to not get into Michigan and then hate their high school experience in the process.

[W.T.Faulkner]

Feb 27, 2024 13:21:52 GMT -5 archiethedragon said:

My daughter is a sophomore and she is very concerned with having enough extra curriculars, the right curriculars, multiple sports, good grades, etc. in order to get into college. She knows the acceptance rate of various schools and feels all this pressure about it.

Can you show her this from a random Internet stranger?

I make all my seniors look at this site, particularly the lists. This retired school counselor researched the backgrounds of professionals at the top of lots of fields (i.e., Mayo Clinic neurologists, Fortune 500 CEOs, nonprofit CEOs, WaPo journalists) and lists the college where they earned their undergraduate degree. Sure, you see some Dartmouths and Princetons and Yales on there, but you also will see Spring Hill College (I had to Google it), Appalachian State University, and Montana State University. 

[1confused1]

All of my friends who currently have kids in college have told me the extra curricular stuff doesn’t really matter. I’m not pushing anything on my kids except for them to keep their grades up.

My son is a junior and my daughter is a freshman.

[formerlyak]

My ds is a senior in high school now. He applied to 14 schools. Most won't let him know until March if he gets in and I am not patient at all so the wait is killing me. But, we have been happily surprised at the results so far. He does not have a 4.0 unweighted (close, but not a 4.0). He does not have over a 1500 SAT (again close, but not quite). He was recommended to all the AP classes his school offers, but declined to enroll in a few with mental health in mind. Smart move on his part.

By taking 4 instead of 6 AP classes, he was able to do things he likes. He has a job he likes. He wants to be a math major and volunteered as an SAT math tutor. He does one sport and is captain this year. He sits on local youth advisory groups that he was appointed to by school leadership. He was nominated and selected to attend Boys State. He's been asked to audition to be a graduation speaker. He has time to go support his friends in their sports matches and go out to dinner after and all that stuff you SHOULD do in high school. He is seen as a leader at his school, but it's not because he runs around doing all the things. It's because he's passionate and happy doing what he chose to do and he has a great attitude, if that makes sense.

There are teachers who ask me why I "didn't make him apply to Ivy League schools." I tell him that is not where he wants to go. He likes big public schools. And Stanford, but he knows no one really gets in to Stanford.

As someone said, there is a school for everyone.

So far he has been admitted to Purdue, Rutgers, UMass, Oregon State and San Jose State. All great public universities. And, with the exception of San Jose State who doesn't accept a list of activities or an essay, I truly believe they all admitted him because of his essay. His essay really embodies who he is and what he will bring to his college. He tells a good story about who he is. He also had an interview with Stanford.

I think schools have gotten wise to the "founded a nonprofit" - a kid can't legally do that in most states, so they are actually co-founders with parents. Or the published research where the kid worked as an intern in a lab and they put the interns' names on the paper at the end. Or the passion project that is all the rage these days, where many rich families pay consultants to help their kid do a passion project. They pay these crazy expensive consultants to navigate the process www.nytimes.com/2019/03/13/us/admissions-cheating-scandal-consultants.html. This makes the essay increasingly important as it is the one place the kid, if they wrote the essay and my friends in admissions say there are obvious tells when a kid didn't write it, can show their genuine self.

[wanderlustmom]

I'm really glad that we let our two kids just do his or her own thing with regards to college admission. Some people get really competitive about it and I try to relax and stay out of it. All of it was so overwhelming anyway, I didn't even want to stress about it. My husband and I knew we had a budget and both kids knew they'd have to pay or take some loans if they chose out of state.

Our oldest is a freshman in college and he fell in love with the state school by us that is well regarded for STEM (Georgia Tech) when he was young. I'm sure the in state tuition was a big draw for him too as he's very practical. He knew it would be hard to get in but wanted the rigor. He's also like my husband and tests well on the ACT and SAT. He's majoring in biochemistry and it's hard but he still has time to work as a sports referee and play intramural sports. He applied to ten schools and managed that all on his own. We didn't even get to read his essay. We asked but he liked to keep it private. He loved playing soccer and did it all four years with club and high school. He didn't volunteer a ton, despite our urging. He enjoyed taking the harder classes but didn't always get an A or get AP credit. The first two years he did try for the top of his class and was happier when he got a B and let that go. It was his internal pressure. He also worked as a math tutor, at a fast food place and was on the math team.

Our younger one (junior in high school) is more of a go getter but she's not choosing a school as hard to get into has her brother. She wants a big school with a big social life. She's involved in lots of activities and likes to volunteer. She thinks it will help her college applications but who really knows? She's stressed about the ACT and SAT since she's not the best tester. She also plays a year round sport because she likes to and doesn't want to play in college. She also saves a lot of time to do friend things which is really important and she works different odd jobs.

Sounds like you are doing so well just trusting that each student will find his or her best place.
ETA: I should have been more specific, I do think playing a sport is good if a child likes the sport and a club is good if a child likes the club.  Probably one of either or two total would be good. I have no ideas for Ivys as my kids didn't apply to those