I support the extra weight toward veterans. If you do not like it there is an easy solution. Look for a job in the private sector.
Or here's another solution, perhaps not so easy: serve in the military so you can get the coveted veteran status. I once read a quote about veterans that said "A veteran is someone, who at one point in his/her life wrote a blank check to the U.S. government for any amount up to and including his/her life."
I think that's a big deal. A huge deal, actually. It's not just "they served our country ... yadda yadda."
I'm glad you realize that's a huge insult to trivialize the contributions veterans have made by not supporting the benefits they've earned.
Signed,
Wife, daughter and sister of vets
This post is a little bit over the top.
"The vets get all of the benefits!" = "Join the military" "The state workers get a lot of days off!" = "Work for the government".
where I work, and I work for the Gov't. If there is a vet in the top 3 finalists for the position it will go the the vet; however, the hiring board or person who did the interviews can write up a rationale on why they prefer the non veteran and then HR can decide whether or not to go with the hiring boards recommendation.
I have read the regulation on that for where I work myself.
It isn't easy being a vet and applying for positions where I work, even with the 5 pt preferance that I have, because of deployments and missing so many months at work for training, I was behind alot of my peers when it came to experience, managing programs, technical knowledge with respect to some of the software we use. There were times that I was not selected. Mainly because I did not make the top 3 cut or the selecting official wrote a letter to HR saying he felt that even though I was in the top 3, the #1 person was far more qualified and they got the job. I've also been up against veterans with a 10 pt preferance, guess who wins that one, but I'm not complaining about it, I'd rather see them get it.
Sure there are more ways to serve you country, but if you aren't willing to choose the military don't complian because it was an option open to you. While because of health issues and other reasons some people can't enlist, they and you can look up the regulations for hiring veterans and the preferences given to them and if you weren't selected you can always file a complaint/grievance saying you were the most qualified and ask to see the scores given to the applicants.
There's a part of me that ponders the timing of this post, considering the long weekend we're heading into...
Folks here can probably guess at my stance on this. Not much point in hashing it out.
The timing only has to do with the email I got this morning informing me that, while qualified for XX position, I will not be considered due to the overwhelming amount of veteran applicants. Just frustration after hearing that one too many times.
Or here's another solution, perhaps not so easy: serve in the military so you can get the coveted veteran status.
At least you recognize that the solution is not that easy?
I am not jumping into this debate because I see both sides and think it's a complicated issue. But telling people to join the military is such an insulting oversimplification. My brother tried to enlist and was rejected by the Navy, the Marines, and the Army for a congenital heart defect.
Again, I'm not expressing an opinion one way or the other on the issue of veterans' preference. But there are plenty of reasons that people don't join the military beyond "I don't wanna."
There's a part of me that ponders the timing of this post, considering the long weekend we're heading into...
Folks here can probably guess at my stance on this. Not much point in hashing it out.
The timing only has to do with the email I got this morning informing me that, while qualified for XX position, I will not be considered due to the overwhelming amount of veteran applicants. Just frustration after hearing that one too many times.
They really should word that better. You don't need to know that there were vetran applicants. Just that you are not being considered at this time.
I know H had preferential treatment when he was looking in the private sector before he took a University job. I know they didn't tell other applicants then.
Or when the Dean told him he would get preferential treatment if he applied to med school. Pretty sure they don't tell their waitlisted students.
I support the extra weight toward veterans. If you do not like it there is an easy solution. Look for a job in the private sector.
Or here's another solution, perhaps not so easy: serve in the military so you can get the coveted veteran status.
I once read a quote about veterans that said "A veteran is someone, who at one point in his/her life wrote a blank check to the U.S. government for any amount up to and including his/her life."
Speaking as a wife of a soon to be vet (Thursday! So exited he's coming home), you sound like an ass. You didn't put your life on the line to serve our country. You're just whining that people that actually did something with their lives AND are as qualified as you are getting the job.
Giving someone preference for hiring doesn't (or at least shouldn't) mean that someone who isn't qualified will get the job over someone who is. It just means that if both applicants are equally qualified, the person with preference will get the job because of that boost. If there are too many veteran applicants and that's why you didn't get the job, what they mean is "too many people with the same qualifications as you who also are veterans applied". Not "you're the best candidate but sorry, we can't hire you because unqualified veterans applied".
I have never really thought about this issue before, but I think I support the policy. These are government jobs and veterans could be considered government employees. I think most companies give preference to qualified internal candidates, so why should this be any different? Then add the icing on the cake that these are obviously people who are deeply committed to our country and our government, so much so that they were willing to die for it. I'd rather have someone with that kind of background, too.
What it really comes down to is that it is hard to find an entry level job right now straight out of college and if this wasn't slowing you down, something else would be (like the thousands of people with tons of great work experience who are unemployed right now due to layoffs). I hear your frustration but I think it might be misplaced. Good luck though - I am genuinely sure you'll find something.
You're just whining that people that actually did something with their lives AND are as qualified as you are getting the job.
So those of us who don't opt to join the military haven't done anything with our lives?
This is what really frustrates me about these military debates. I think teachers should get job preference because they have more of a direct impact on the lives of the every day americans. Or how about police or fire? Or maybe someone that joined the peace corps.
I truly wonder if you know how Veteran's Preference works. It's not as if someone can walk in from the street and say "give me this job". They have to have the same qualifications that you do (all those special things that you posted about up there and are so proud of), so if the position requires a security clearance and a certain degree, they have to have those things. If it requires a particular certification, they have to have that too.
I'm kind of appalled that you're so willing to write off the education and experience of thousands of men and women who served this country honorably and are only seeking to find a job just like you are.
Speaking as a wife of a soon to be vet (Thursday! So exited he's coming home), you sound like an ass. You didn't put your life on the line to serve our country. You're just whining that people that actually did something with their lives AND are as qualified as you are getting the job.
ETA: I am rolling my eyes at the "actually did something with their lives" part. I don't have a strong opinion on the advantage either way.
You're just whining that people that actually did something with their lives AND are as qualified as you are getting the job.
So those of us who don't opt to join the military haven't done anything with our lives?
Have you pulled people out of burning buildings? Have you put your own life in the line for others? Have you put a strain on your marriage by being willing to be in another country for years at a time? Have you been put in gas chambers without a gas mask for training? Have you been given Anthrax and Smallpox vaccinations or Malaria pills, just in case?
If I was as qualified as a veteran, and passed up for a job because he served, I wouldn't be a jerk about it. I'd go look for another job.
So those of us who don't opt to join the military haven't done anything with our lives?
Have you pulled people out of burning buildings? Have you put your own life in the line for others? Have you put a strain on your marriage by being willing to be in another country for years at a time? Have you been put in gas chambers without a gas mask for training? Have you been given Anthrax and Smallpox vaccinations or Malaria pills, just in case?
If I was as qualified as a veteran, and passed up for a job because he served, I wouldn't be a jerk about it. I'd go look for another job.
Sure, but that doesn't mean that those of us who didn't do that stuff did nothing. Your post implied that the only way to "do something with your life" is to join the military. Not true.
I have the utmost respect for veterans and don't agree with the OP or the other military hate, but I do think the idea that the military is the only way to do something with your life is laughable. Maybe that's not what you meant by your post?
So those of us who don't opt to join the military haven't done anything with our lives?
Have you pulled people out of burning buildings? Have you put your own life in the line for others? Have you put a strain on your marriage by being willing to be in another country for years at a time? Have you been put in gas chambers without a gas mask for training? Have you been given Anthrax and Smallpox vaccinations or Malaria pills, just in case?
Of course I haven't. I don't think those things are the only determing factors when deciding if I have done anything with my life.
I see how this could be a sensitive topic for you.
So those of us who don't opt to join the military haven't done anything with our lives?
Have you pulled people out of burning buildings? Have you put your own life in the line for others? Have you put a strain on your marriage by being willing to be in another country for years at a time? Have you been put in gas chambers without a gas mask for training? Have you been given Anthrax and Smallpox vaccinations or Malaria pills, just in case?
If I was as qualified as a veteran, and passed up for a job because he served, I wouldn't be a jerk about it. I'd go look for another job.
I took malaria pills! I have also been sprayed with pepper spray does this count for anything?
Have you pulled people out of burning buildings? Have you put your own life in the line for others? Have you put a strain on your marriage by being willing to be in another country for years at a time? Have you been put in gas chambers without a gas mask for training? Have you been given Anthrax and Smallpox vaccinations or Malaria pills, just in case?
If I was as qualified as a veteran, and passed up for a job because he served, I wouldn't be a jerk about it. I'd go look for another job.
Sure, but that doesn't mean that those of us who didn't do that stuff did nothing. Your post implied that the only way to "do something with your life" is to join the military. Not true.
I have the utmost respect for veterans and don't agree with the OP or the other military hate, but I do think the idea that the military is the only way to do something with your life is laughable. Maybe that's not what you meant by your post?
No, I just meant that they went above and beyond. They're applying for her same job, AND they spent at least 4 years in the military.
I sure as hell would never join the military, I'm not cut out for it.
Have you pulled people out of burning buildings? Have you put your own life in the line for others? Have you put a strain on your marriage by being willing to be in another country for years at a time? Have you been put in gas chambers without a gas mask for training? Have you been given Anthrax and Smallpox vaccinations or Malaria pills, just in case?
If I was as qualified as a veteran, and passed up for a job because he served, I wouldn't be a jerk about it. I'd go look for another job.
I took malaria pills! I have also been sprayed with pepper spray does this count for anything?
Vet preference doesn't really bother me. I do have a friend who has been complaining about it a bit lately. But I think her complaint is somewhat legit. For the past 15 years she managed US government funded projects in support of US foreign policy in Afghanistan, Somalia, Yemen, Pakistan, Liberia, Sudan and the north Caucasus (ie Chechnya). She has been exposed to innumerable dangerous situations up to and including armed abduction in Yemen and being in an unarmored vehicle that was shot up at close range in Sudan. She also spent a year in a PRT. She has been passed up for two "dream" jobs due to military preference and it kind of sucks. Especially when it's possible that the vets selected may have never been deployed to a combat zone.
So those of us who don't opt to join the military haven't done anything with our lives?
Have you pulled people out of burning buildings? Have you put your own life in the line for others? Have you put a strain on your marriage by being willing to be in another country for years at a time? Have you been put in gas chambers without a gas mask for training? Have you been given Anthrax and Smallpox vaccinations or Malaria pills, just in case?
If I was as qualified as a veteran, and passed up for a job because he served, I wouldn't be a jerk about it. I'd go look for another job.
So all of this is the only that equals "doing something with your life"? I have had six knee surgeries and I have asthma, so I guess I'll never know what it feels like to lead a fulfilling life, since this would disqualify me from serving in most branches, yes?
I am not anti-military, but this shit makes me roll my eyes.
Have you pulled people out of burning buildings? Have you put your own life in the line for others? Have you put a strain on your marriage by being willing to be in another country for years at a time? Have you been put in gas chambers without a gas mask for training? Have you been given Anthrax and Smallpox vaccinations or Malaria pills, just in case?
Of course I haven't. I don't think those things are the only determing factors when deciding if I have done anything with my life.
I see how this could be a sensitive topic for you.
I also know vets who will get preference who also did none of the above...so should they not get the preference...only the ones who risked their lives? The ones who sat back and ordered supplies in a warehouse in Kuwait maybe gets 1 point because they never donned a gas mask or pulled people out of burning buildings?
What about the people who joined the military because they knew they would get a pretty sweet paycheck. I know a couple of those. It had nothing to do with self sacrifice or serving their country, but rather they didn't have any better options and a recruiter promised them the world?
I truly wonder if you know how Veteran's Preference works. It's not as if someone can walk in from the street and say "give me this job". They have to have the same qualifications that you do (all those special things that you posted about up there and are so proud of), so if the position requires a security clearance and a certain degree, they have to have those things. If it requires a particular certification, they have to have that too.
I'm kind of appalled that you're so willing to write off the education and experience of thousands of men and women who served this country honorably and are only seeking to find a job just like you are.
I realize that they need to meet the minimum qualification to be considered...which is why I pointed out that I wasn't taking jobs away from the homeless vets battling drug problems.
Vet preference doesn't really bother me. I do have a friend who has been complaining about it a bit lately. But I think her complaint is somewhat legit. For the past 15 years she managed US government funded projects in support of US foreign policy in Afghanistan, Somalia, Yemen, Pakistan, Liberia, Sudan and the north Caucasus (ie Chechnya). She has been exposed to innumerable dangerous situations up to and including armed abduction in Yemen and being in an unarmored vehicle that was shot up at close range in Sudan. She also spent a year in a PRT. She has been passed up for two "dream" jobs due to military preference and it kind of sucks. Especially when it's possible that the vets selected may have never been deployed to a combat zone.
Yeah...your friend has more than me to be frustrated about...thats for sure.
Vet preference doesn't really bother me. I do have a friend who has been complaining about it a bit lately. But I think her complaint is somewhat legit. For the past 15 years she managed US government funded projects in support of US foreign policy in Afghanistan, Somalia, Yemen, Pakistan, Liberia, Sudan and the north Caucasus (ie Chechnya). She has been exposed to innumerable dangerous situations up to and including armed abduction in Yemen and being in an unarmored vehicle that was shot up at close range in Sudan. She also spent a year in a PRT. She has been passed up for two "dream" jobs due to military preference and it kind of sucks. Especially when it's possible that the vets selected may have never been deployed to a combat zone.
I really dislike vet preference. I think the best person for the job should be hired. Sure they served in the military but they made that choice going in. I also won't support companies that I know give preference to vets. I think it's BS.