Interested to hear your thoguhts.. (long)

[Deleted]

This may be controversial but I am interested to hear what a lot of you think about the following "Open Leter to the LGBTQ Community" from my pastor.
A lot of you are more intelligent/experienced/educated/open minded/etc than I (and my group of friends) am, so I am genuinely curious what you think...

"I am a pastor and a follower of Jesus. I know Louie Giglio only by reputation. I have a great deal of respect for him. I have followed the news surrounding his invitation to pray at the President's inaguration with some interest.

I want to begin by simply confessing the great deal of harm that we Christians have done to you in the name of Jesus. Our anger, hostility, and antagonism toward you have no place in the community that is supposed to represent Him. I am so sorry. Far too frequently we in the Christian community are rightly characterized as homophobic, mean-spirited, and narrow-minded.

I have several friends who are gay, and they have enlightened me to the heavy burden that many of you carry when you are rejected, mocked, and discarded by those in the church. Instead of offering helpful care, wisdom, and encouragement, we have often turned you away in disgust. We have done too much talking and not enough listening. I grieve this. And I know that Jesus does also. He had a very tender place in His ministry and priorities for those who were marginalized by the religious leadership of his day.

I regret that we have not been more faithful to His example. The church has lied to you in at least two ways. We have highlighted homosexuality over other issues in the Christian community. We have railed against homosexual marriage while turning a blind eye toward concerns like quick and easy divorce, premarital and extramarital heterosexual sex, greed, gossip, and anger. Our double standards have served only to highlight our own hypocrisy.

Some of us have also said to you that salvation or coming to Jesus means being automatically transformed into a heterosexual. I do think transofmration is possible, but often we seem woefully naive of all the factors involved in this issue. As far as I can tell, one’s sexual orientation is not the determining factor in one’s eternal destiny. If my friendships are any indication, many yearn to follow Jesus fully and completely and yet continue to struggle to reconcile their faith with their desire for intimacy (sexual or otherwise) with someone of the same sex. We have failed to live out the good news of Jesus. Please forgive us.

I also believe that, at times, the homosexual community isn’t entirely truthful to you either. For one thing, the gospel of Jesus Christ announces that our desires are not our destinies. They can be overcome and placed in their proper context. Our wants don’t have to become our needs. Entrance into the kingdom of God through Jesus makes possible those things that, prior to Him, were thought to be impossible. We don’t have to live at the mercy of desire. Salvation isn’t found in self-gratification, nor is it found in unhealthy repression or denial. Jesus offers a third way.

One last thing. I disagree with those who think your sexual orientation is the most important thing about you. The most important thing about you is that, as a human being, you are made in the image of God. As an image bearer, you are a person who has intrinsic dignity, honor, and worth. You, like the rest of us, are also broken and bent toward what is worst for us. But the good news is that Jesus has come to make things right. He invites you into that redemption. Please don’t hold the sins of the church against Him.

I do sincerely ask your forgiveness. I grieve the harm we have done, and I recognize that if the church had done a better job listening, grieving, encouraging, telling the truth, and giving grace along the way, we would not be so polarized and alienated from each other today."

Thoughts?

[gmoneymommy]

I can't tell...is he saying that homosexuality is just a desire that can be overcome? I appreciate some if what he is saying, but I'm not sure if I understand that sixth paragraph.

[Deleted]

Jan 11, 2013 17:57:34 GMT -5 gmoneymommy said:

I can't tell...is he saying that homosexuality is just a desire that can be overcome? I appreciate some if what he is saying, but I'm not sure if I understand that sixth paragraph.

I felt a little confused too.. but I have an awful sinus infection (not thinking clearly) and honestly am not that smart so I thought maybe it was just me...

[petitepomme]

I think he had good intentions but towards the end he makes it sound like being homosexual is an obstacle to be overcome. Like, if you try hard enough you can become heterosexual and then find salvation.

[gmoneymommy]

Oh stop with this, "I'm not that smart," business. I am super smart (I'm kidding) and I am confused. It's not just you.

[gmoneymommy]

Jan 11, 2013 18:02:35 GMT -5 petitepomme said:

I think he had good intentions but towards the end he makes it sound like being homosexual is an obstacle to be overcome. Like, if you try hard enough you can become heterosexual and then find salvation.

That was how I interpreted it as well. It confused me because at first he seemed to be accepting.

[mikehoncho]

I have a problem with these two parts:

"I do think transofmration is possible"
and

"They can be overcome and placed in their proper context. Our wants don’t have to become our needs."

^^I feel like he is trying to imply that homosexuals can and should take vows of celibacy as a way to overcome their sexual orientation here. Right? Because that is the only way that a heterosexual can overcome their "needs" but it isn't really assumed that all heterosexuals need to overcome their needs, so why is that expected of homosexuals?

I also don't really understand the comment about the homosexual community not being honest. Whhhhhats that even mean?

ETA: wording

[Deleted]

I agree with everyone's points so far. I think he is trying to say that he accepts homosexuality even if he doesn't necessarily agree with it. But I do think the "transformation is possible" line can be/is off-putting.

[jenbelle]

Jan 11, 2013 18:39:36 GMT -5 @therealmc said:

I'm going to be honest here - I like the letter. I think that is a good step in the right direction. The church will take a long time, if ever, to accept homosexuality. Personally, I think they may never fully believe it is NOT something that can be overcome but I also think that if they can be accepting of homosexuals despite this belief, then it is a good thing.

This. I also liked the part that he said that sexual orientation is NOT the most important thing, that we are all made in His image.
I think the letter is a good start...

[spaghetticat]

Jan 11, 2013 18:07:53 GMT -5 @chelsmonster said:

He had me until "I do think transformation is possible..." blah blah and then I stopped paying attention.

This.

And why do you keep saying you're not smart?

[Deleted]

Jan 11, 2013 18:02:35 GMT -5 petitepomme said:

I think he had good intentions but towards the end he makes it sound like being homosexual is an obstacle to be overcome. Like, if you try hard enough you can become heterosexual and then find salvation.

This and that is the crux of the issue.

[lolaburns]

Jan 11, 2013 18:39:36 GMT -5 @therealmc said:

I'm going to be honest here - I like the letter. I think that is a good step in the right direction. The church will take a long time, if ever, to accept homosexuality. Personally, I think they may never fully believe it is NOT something that can be overcome but I also think that if they can be accepting of homosexuals despite this belief, then it is a good thing.

This. I believe judgement comes from God, not from me.

When he talks about sexual orientation not being the most important thing, I have had this discussion with two of my gay friends a few times. It was moving to me because they aren't a part of and disagree with the NYC " gay scene", for the most part.


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[Deleted]

I like the part where he says that it is not the most important part of a person and everybody else has "sins" that are being ignored. I do not like the part where he implies that they should just resist the urge.

I think Christianity will always think homosexual sex is a sin, but they really need to stop thinking/saying the person can change.

[erniebufflo]

I like the beginning. But then he undermines it by comparing sexual orientation to a sin that must be overcome. Also, it's weird that he suggests that LGBTQ people argue that sexual orientation is the most important thing about them. They simply argue that it is intrinsic. If a ton of people were trying to convince him he should "overcome" his eye color, I wonder how important it would suddenly become to him.

Still, a much better message than most churches are preaching.