Why? Because he wants to make more than $30k? Are teachers supposed to just teach out of the goodness of their hearts and not care about paying their electric bills or feeding their families?
Teacher salaries in WI are public. The majority make FAR more than $30k.
Why? Because he wants to make more than $30k? Are teachers supposed to just teach out of the goodness of their hearts and not care about paying their electric bills or feeding their families?
Teacher salaries in WI are public. The majority make FAR more than $30k.
I'm talking specifically about the PP's husband. You say you're glad he's leaving the educational field because he can make more money in the private sector, as if wanting to make more money makes him inherently a bad person to teach.
But this is what I'm having a hard time understanding. This is happening nation wide, no? Wasn't Obama just lambasted for not creating the jobs he said he would?
WI had drastically lagged behind the rest of the nation in jobs creation. In fact, they have seen negative job growth in the private sector for the last 6 or 7 months while the rest of the nation was posting decent positive numbers.
The housing market also just posted something like a 28% foreclosure rate last month.
So, no. This isn't happening nationwide. WI is lagging horribly in recovery and has been since Walker took office.
I could talk about this all day but, unfortunately, I have a major presentation today and tomorrow so i'll be otherwise occupied...
Is there a source for this? I only found data on April and WI didn't seem that out of line with the rest of the nation. www.deptofnumbers.com/employment/states/ What is Wi's income tax average 6 something? MN is 7.85% and they are looking to raise it.
Teacher salaries in WI are public. The majority make FAR more than $30k.
I'm talking specifically about the PP's husband. You say you're glad he's leaving the educational field because he can make more money in the private sector, as if wanting to make more money makes him inherently a bad person to teach.
No. If you look at the parts I bolded, it was over his attitude towards his profession. Although Harpy stated later those were her words, not his.
Quite frankly, if you don't enjoy what you do, as with any profession, you should leave.
Post by secretlyevil on Jun 6, 2012 9:45:25 GMT -5
I don't understand why people don't like recalls. I think they are the very spirit of this country's foundation in that we elected you but you have really sucked and not done what we want so we're firing you. The fact that he won the recall is predicted to win the recall is disappointing. The fact that he took all that out of state money is just fucked up. BUt what's really fucked up is most definitely that he is winning said recall.
I don't understand why people don't like recalls. I think they are the very spirit of this country's foundation in that we elected you but you have really sucked and not done what we want so we're firing you. The fact that he won the recall is predicted to win the recall is disappointing. The fact that he took all that out of state money is just fucked up. BUt what's really fucked up is most definitely that he is winning said recall.
But Walker DID what the the majority wanted. This was proven twice now. He also delivered on his campaign promises. There was no reason to waste all of this time and money on a recall. He did not perform gross misconduct, in which I would support a recall.
He simply pissed off a sector of people and they felt it was enough to try and prevent him from serving him term.
And the money really made no difference in this election. As mentioned earlier, the majority had their minds made up long ago.
I don't understand why people don't like recalls. I think they are the very spirit of this country's foundation in that we elected you but you have really sucked and not done what we want so we're firing you. The fact that he won the recall is predicted to win the recall is disappointing. The fact that he took all that out of state money is just fucked up. BUt what's really fucked up is most definitely that he is winning said recall.
This makes no sense. If you like recalls just fine, you can't then decide they are fucked up if they don't turn out the way you want.
The political person in me loves recalls, they are great political theater.
The practical person in me recognizes that they are a huge obstacle to governing. The electorate already gets a chance to throw the bums out because they didn't live up to expectations every 2, 4, or 6 years, as appropriate. You don't need a recall process on top of that, except in the case of gross abuses. Political differences are not the same as gross abuses.
What stops WI dems from mounting another recall campaign against Walker today, just to continue to keep him off balance?
I don't understand why people don't like recalls. I think they are the very spirit of this country's foundation in that we elected you but you have really sucked and not done what we want so we're firing you. The fact that he won the recall is predicted to win the recall is disappointing. The fact that he took all that out of state money is just fucked up. BUt what's really fucked up is most definitely that he is winning said recall.
well, there have only been 3 recalls of Governors in history right? and Walker is the first to win? In Walkers case, I kind of look at it as a population of people thinking they speak for everyone, when in fact that wasn't the case, since well, he won again by a wider margin. And what happens if we start doing this to everyone? Obama seems paralyzed to do anything drastic in his first term for fear he won't be re-elected. Recalling would seem to add to that paralysis.
I would have no problem with another recall. I'd love to go after Walker the way he went after me a couple years ago. Make him nervous every year that he's going to lose his job and see how well he sleeps at night. Yes, I'm still bitter.
I would have no problem with another recall. I'd love to go after Walker the way he went after me a couple years ago. Make him nervous every year that he's going to lose his job and see how well he sleeps at night. Yes, I'm still bitter.
WI had drastically lagged behind the rest of the nation in jobs creation. In fact, they have seen negative job growth in the private sector for the last 6 or 7 months while the rest of the nation was posting decent positive numbers.
The housing market also just posted something like a 28% foreclosure rate last month.
So, no. This isn't happening nationwide. WI is lagging horribly in recovery and has been since Walker took office.
I could talk about this all day but, unfortunately, I have a major presentation today and tomorrow so i'll be otherwise occupied...
Is there a source for this? I only found data on April and WI didn't seem that out of line with the rest of the nation. www.deptofnumbers.com/employment/states/ What is Wi's income tax average 6 something? MN is 7.85% and they are looking to raise it.
We're talking about private sector jobs.
In April alone wi lost 6200 jobs and led the nation In the last 12 months - "The largest over-the-year percentage decrease in employment occurred in Wisconsin (-0.9 percent)."
I don't understand why people don't like recalls. I think they are the very spirit of this country's foundation in that we elected you but you have really sucked and not done what we want so we're firing you. The fact that he won the recall is predicted to win the recall is disappointing. The fact that he took all that out of state money is just fucked up. BUt what's really fucked up is most definitely that he is winning said recall.
What Y4M said. You can already kick them out when they are up for reelection every 2, 4, 6 years depending on the position. That's why people are elected for a finite term. Don't like the job they're doing? Elect someone else. Ideally, 1 person isn't going to irrevocably destroy a government in that time period. And since it takes so long to put a recall election together anyway, well... just wait and kick him out in 2014. I think it's actually UNdemocratic to, well, not use the democratic process in the way it was intended.
And the Gray Davis fiasco in CA in 2003 demonstrates the weird power of recalls. Yes, only 3 governors have been up for recall before, but Gray Davis really didn't deserve it. Schwartzenegger just couldn't wait to get elected, though, and got the population behind him.
Re: Angry Harpy's husband - in the US, health care and retirement benefits are part of your employment package. Some companies also give more vacation days and a better work environment, or, if you work for Google, cool mini-kitchens and catered lunch. Rather than monetary compensation, it's part of an overall package. It costs money, of course. But so would better salaries with no benefits. It's a trade off when you get deferred compensation in the way of a retirement pension and whatnot.
So basically, Walker is cutting salaries. Well, he IS cutting salaries, and then he's also cutting benefits, which is a double whammy. Because now public employees need to pay more for their health care and retirement, but with less money.
It's not necessarily about where the money comes from (although I happen to be fiscally liberal), but about a decent standard of living for public employees, who are paid by the government because it is thought they provide a service to the public, in this case through public education.
AH, what does he teach? My husband is a mathematician and has found the private sector is definitely higher paying. However, as someone in the humanities myself, I could only dream of having a job with any benefits. ;-)
Is there a source for this? I only found data on April and WI didn't seem that out of line with the rest of the nation. www.deptofnumbers.com/employment/states/ What is Wi's income tax average 6 something? MN is 7.85% and they are looking to raise it.
We're talking about private sector jobs.
In April alone wi lost 6200 jobs and led the nation In the last 12 months - "The largest over-the-year percentage decrease in employment occurred in Wisconsin (-0.9 percent)."
It's not necessarily about where the money comes from (although I happen to be fiscally liberal), but about a decent standard of living for public employees, who are paid by the government because it is thought they provide a service to the public, in this case through public education.
quote]I would like you to expand on this more. How is it not about where the money comes from? What defines a decent standard of living?
But this is what I'm having a hard time understanding. This is happening nation wide, no? Wasn't Obama just lambasted for not creating the jobs he said he would?
WI had drastically lagged behind the rest of the nation in jobs creation. In fact, they have seen negative job growth in the private sector for the last 6 or 7 months while the rest of the nation was posting decent positive numbers.
The housing market also just posted something like a 28% foreclosure rate last month.
So, no. This isn't happening nationwide. WI is lagging horribly in recovery and has been since Walker took office.
I could talk about this all day but, unfortunately, I have a major presentation today and tomorrow so i'll be otherwise occupied...
They are not in the bottom 5 in job creation. I would say it is happening elsewhere, unfortunately.
Decent standard of living is entirely subjective. However, when the public sector makes decidedly less than the private sector, you can't blame someone for thinking they deserve to make what the private sector is paying. After all, that's capitalism. The market is willing to pay you X, but the public sector isn't the free market.
In addition, I don't know of anyone in higher ed who will only take a job at a public university or a private university. Obviously, your student population at either will be different. But then again, the student population at U of Michigan is going to be markedly different from that at Kent State, and the population at Claremont McKenna is not the same as that at Yale. But that's really just one aspect of the job. Most professors I know accept jobs with good pay and benefits over those with crappy pay an benefits, and also in departments in which they and their research will be a good fit.
IMO, where the money comes from is a separate issue and not AH's husband's problem. I don't really care how my employer pays my salary, just that it gets paid. The money can come from all sorts of places. Even in public education, it can come from taxes, or grants, or donations, or tuition, or an endowment. Basically, the exact same places it comes from in private education with the exception of a direct infusion of tax money. Anyway, it's not up to him to sacrifice himself for the good of the taxpayers, if that's what you're getting at. Taxes are so we can function at a societal level. States have decided that public education is to the benefit of society. Ergo, they should fund that goal at appropriate levels, or else suffer the consequences.