Lawyer types, a q.

[scotty]

What does it mean when someone is promoted from an associate to principal? Is it more $? Is it different work?

tia

[Deleted]

Yes, likely yes (but not necessarily), and not really.

If by "principal," you mean "partner" or "member."

[scotty]

It was just listed as associate to principal in a law firm.

Yes, I am spying on someone that I know. Karma states that he'll be wildly rich and famous someday.

*sigh*

[WOT?*]

What Miso said.

Junior Associate = drudge work assigned by the partner/principal and senior associates.
Senior Associate = slightly more exciting work assigned by the partner/principal.
Principal = generally partner or has an interest in the firm and gets pick of the projects depending on the type of law and his place in the partnership. Stuff he doesn't like he sends on to the senior associates who then assigns to the junior associates who, if s/he is fortunate has a paralegal and/or assistant he can give the really really crappy parts of the assignments.

But otoh, the junior associates report to the senior associates and partners/principals who have to make sure his work product is adequate and correct so it all comes back in the end and the ultimate responsibility is with the assigning partner/principal who then gets to roll the crap downhill if things go wrong.

The higher up the food chain, the more money as a general rule. But mo' money = mo' problems and mo' responsibility. (btw, this same food chain applies to other professions such as engineers, architects, accounting firms, etc.)

[Deleted]

But not all "partners" are created equal.

Sometimes, firms have different tiers, wherein non-equity partners are pretty much glorified associates who don't get a cut of profits.

[scotty]

There was some mention of profit-sharing. Thanks, btw.

[Deleted]

Sounds like the person is a "real" partner then. LOL.

[scotty]

Fancy. I need a fire lit under my ass.

[Deleted]

Scotty~ junior partners generally aren't rolling in it. The senior partners may be. But the real $ doesn't come until you're a rain maker. Partnership itself just guarantees a nice upper middle class income.

[scotty]

What kind of income, like dollar-wise-ish?

I'm tacky, okay!

[Deleted]

Finder, minder, grinder!

[Deleted]

Do you know the name of the firm?

Numbers may actually be public information.

[scotty]

Wow. I just looked.

[Deleted]

Jun 20, 2012 16:21:40 GMT -5 Lucy Honeychurch said:

Non-equity partners are the partners everyone secretly sort of laughs at.

TRUTH.

Or...not-so-secretly. Hahahaha.

[scotty]

If only I were more level-headed, didn't forget what I was saying half of the time when I started speaking, and had any interest in law. And crazy motivation/work ethic. Because, damn.

Damn.

[Deleted]

Elle will be partner one day! I'm pretty sure of it!

[Deleted]

I wouldn't mind being of counsel.

It's just day in, day out, no pressure.

[WOT?*]

Again, OC depends on the firm.

OC in my old firm (fairly small) was some guy who rented an office from us. Not laughable considering he was not a bad lawyer and not a bad looking guy. Just a sole-practitioner who wanted to do his thing but have the appearance of having a behind him. OC in DH's firm (biglaw) can be "we want the 'civilians' to see him as more than associate but he was hired as an associate and we can't name him partner because he's been with us less than a year and our firm by-laws state he must be with us for X years before we can put him up and we want to make sure he knows we view him as partner-material so he doesn't leave to go to a competitor." (DH) Or "he has waaay to much experience to be an associate but we don't think he's partnership material so we'll name him as OC to while we wait and see." (Another at his experience level who keeps shooting himself in the foot.) First is fine, second not-so-much.

Some Non-Equity Partners have been NEPs forever and won't move beyond NEP (one of DH's partners - sad but she'll never be more than an NEP). Others are NEP on track to be moved forward but have to take the steps in-between. (One of DH's NEPs currently and potentially DH as well since even the Equities in his office are promoting him as the best choice for managing the office since MP is retiring.)

Equities viewed as "not management material" are in my book sadder/more laughable than NEPs that are viewed as at least having the potential.

Gotta love firm politics.

[Deleted]

Jun 20, 2012 16:25:35 GMT -5 @misoangry said:

I wouldn't mind being of counsel.

It's just day in, day out, no pressure.

I have to disagree wtih the of counsel thing. The most famous person at my firm is of counsel. There are good reasons for preferring it to partnership.

[WOT?*]

Jun 20, 2012 16:59:09 GMT -5 elle said:

Jun 20, 2012 16:25:35 GMT -5 @misoangry said:

I wouldn't mind being of counsel.

It's just day in, day out, no pressure.

I have to disagree wtih the of counsel thing. The most famous person at my firm is of counsel. There are good reasons for preferring it to partnership.

Yup. The guy at my firm only had to pay rent for his office and a share of expenses. He got to go home and swim in his money rather than split it with the lesser mortals.

[Deleted]

You're not disagreeing with meeeeeeeeee.

[Deleted]

Jun 20, 2012 17:07:51 GMT -5 @misoangry said:

You're not disagreeing with meeeeeeeeee.

No! I was agreeing with you. And doing a crappy job of quoting!