WWYD - Cars and @ Related

[wawa]

I could have sworn I wrote this post once before. But I couldn't remember what anybody said in reply, and I can't find it in the search, so I'm thinking I wrote it and never posted?

anyway...

MH drives a tacoma. It's only the extended cab, so a half back door and stupid little seats. It has the anchor thingies for a car seat, but based on our measurments there is no way to actually get a rear-facing infant seat back there without mashing my knees into the dash. We're going to test this with a friend's carseat this weekend, but I'm pretty confident that it's not going to work.

So he'll need a new car once we have a baby. And he has the longer commute of the two of us - about 30 miles/day round trip. (mine is more like 10). So it makes sense to hook him up with a little fuel efficient sedan as his family/commuter car.

But we have to own a truck. We regularly haul truckbed sized loads of stuff around (plywood, drywall, insulation, lumber, etc) and we have a boat that we have to be able to tow.

The tacoma is paid off.

So...
Option 1 - do we keep the tacoma and buy a third vehicle (thinking ford focus or something like that). This will save us money on gas, but will cost more in insurance and taxes when we buy the new car. It would also mean that any time we want to go somewhere with the boat and the futurekids we'd have to drive two vehicles. I think that'd be a problem about two or three times a year when we visit my family at the jersey shore or go camping in southern maryland with the boat.

Or Option 2 - do we trade in the tacoma for a crew cab F-150 with a full back seat? A truck with the options we need (4wd, crew cab) costs considerably more than a small sedan, but that would be partially offset by the trade-in. But we'd not have to have three cars worth of insurance, and wouldn't have to have three cars in the driveway. The F150 would also just work better for what we need truck-wise. More towing capacity (the tacoma is just barely rated to tow the boat) and a bigger bed for hauling crap. But the gas milage sucks.

My driving the truck is not an option - I hate driving large vehicles on a regular basis. Makes me nervous. And his commute is pretty well set for now...job is looking good and we're not budging from this house. We both head the same direction for work and work similar hours, so chances are we'll be taking turns with daycare p/u and d/o once we get to that point so it really is neccessary for his vehicle to be able to take the futurebaby.

crunching the numbers, it looks like initial costs are fairly close. Over time, based on a rough guess on insurance and current gas prices we'd be saving less money on gas than we'd be losing on insurance if we had three vehicles. But it's not a huge amount of money. like $150 over a year IIRC. And that could be way off since we haven't gotten a quote on the insurance and who knows what gas prices will do.

thoughts? are there other factors I'm not thinking of here?

[caden]

Do you only need the truck for towing the boat? I just ask b/c you can get a decent towing package on other vehicles (like a crossover. hell even a chevy cruze has a towing package but I'm not sure how much you can tow). If you are for sure going to buy a car then I don't see why you should keep the Tacoma. Use that as a DP for your next purchase.

[ladybrettashley]

Since the cost seems to be pretty even, I would go with replacing the truck with a larger truck for two reasons:

1. Like you said, it would be a PITA to take two vehicles any time you went on a trip requiring both the truck and the baby.

2. I don't know if garage/driveway space is an issue for you, but I would hate to always have 3 cars taking up space.

I am biased though because we have a crew cab F-150 and absolutely love it. I feel safer with my son in DH's truck than in my car.

ETA: If you're wondering about gas mileage with the F-150, my husband has nearly double the commute of yours (about 55 miles per day roundtrip), and he fills up 2-3 times per month. With current gas prices it costs about $120 per tank.

[wawa]

Jun 22, 2012 13:36:13 GMT -5 caden said:

Do you only need the truck for towing the boat? I just ask b/c you can get a decent towing package on other vehicles (like a crossover. hell even a chevy cruze has a towing package but I'm not sure how much you can tow). If you are for sure going to buy a car then I don't see why you should keep the Tacoma. Use that as a DP for your next purchase.

the boat and for hauling construction supplies. The truck gets used as a truck on a weekly basis - either hauling heavy stuff in the bed or towing something. Having access to a truck is not negotioable. A small SUV isn't going to cut it, and I'd rather have a truck than a large SUV.

I drive a Venza that we just bought last year. It doesn't come close to being able to tow the boat. And the cargo area is nice and big, but the seats have to get folded down to take stuff like drywall or lumber, so that would be an issue with trying to run errands with kids.


As for the bolded, I'm not following what you mean.
If got a bigger truck that would be MH's daily driver, so no car.
But the tacoma won't be an option for a daily driver once we have kids since I'm 95% sure we can't get an infant seat in there.

[ringstrue]

Both of my parents have boats and both haul them with minivans. IME, trucks take more work to use as a family car vs. just have a minivan or crossover. I mean, you'll have luggage and tons of crap for a baby, (PNPs, baby gates, booster seats, etc.) and that is a PITA to tarp down in a truck vs. just pack inside a car. Dunno about those huge trucks but I know the smaller ones at last needed to have sand bags in the back to weight them down for icy road conditions. I get wanting a truck if you are hauling hay multiple times a month, but once the house reno is done, are you really going to be hauling materials that much to warrant a new vehicle for 10-ish years?

[caden]

Ok I just wondered if you used the truck as a truck regularly. Yah I'd just get a new bigger cab truck in your shoes. In the bolded sentence I was using "car" as a synonym for "truck". Sorry about the confusion. I just mean if you are for sure going to make a vehicle purchase then IMO it makes more sense to sell the Tacoma and have 2 vehicles, not 3.

[ringstrue]

Also, even if your kids are 3+ years apart you are gonna still have 2 kids in carseats in the back - so if you are talking about a ford focus with 2 carseats and luggage for the whole family.

But either way, it sounds like we are all in agreement that you shouldn't do the 3 car thing.

[caden]

Wait now I'm confused. Do you only need a truck temporarily?
ETA: N/m you just answered this.

[wawa]

Jun 22, 2012 13:50:23 GMT -5 ringstrue said:

Both of my parents have boats and both haul them with minivans. IME, trucks take more work to use as a family car vs. just have a minivan or crossover. I mean, you'll have luggage and tons of crap for a baby, (PNPs, baby gates, booster seats, etc.) and that is a PITA to tarp down in a truck vs. just pack inside a car. Dunno about those huge trucks but I know the smaller ones at last needed to have sand bags in the back to weight them down for icy road conditions. I get wanting a truck if you are hauling hay multiple times a month, but once the house reno is done, are you really going to be hauling materials that much to warrant a new vehicle for 10-ish years?

yup. because once this particular reno is done there is still all the landscaping that needs to be redone, new kitchen, new shed, etc and helping our friends with their houses, and helping my sister out at her farm, and eventually I'd like my own horse, which would mean my own horse trailer....

you get the idea.

I really do appreciate your thoughts pointing out the issues with trucks, but when I say that owning a truck is non-negotiable, I mean it. It's something MH and I have debated and talked over many many times, but we really do use the truck as a truck on a regular basis and have for the entire 5 years he's owned it. That need isn't going away.

[caden]

Also I have a SUV and can safely say it's a PITA to pack anything for a vaction w/ multiple kids.

[pescalita]

Let me know when you figure this out. We thought about keeping MrP's Ranger and putting the kid in the front seat for the ~0.5mi to/from daycare, but we ended up swapping it for a Dodge Ram so that we could all fit in it at the same time. It's not our regular family car, but that way we can all go to Home Depot, it was awesome for the drive in, and we'll probably take it camping (until we bring the dogs, still haven't figured that one out). The big truck is about the same age and we lost ~$1500 in the transaction. The gas mileage is the suck.

Longer term he wants a crossover and keep the Dodge, or a newer truck. We gave serious consideration to a sedan for commute and a truck as a 3rd vehicle, but he just doesn't like driving a sedan. That's fine, I don't either. I'm not convinced we have enough hauling to warrant carrying insurance or paying gas for a truck, but we obviously disagree there.

[wawa]

Jun 22, 2012 14:21:07 GMT -5 pescalita said:

Let me know when you figure this out. We thought about keeping MrP's Ranger and putting the kid in the front seat for the ~0.5mi to/from daycare, but we ended up swapping it for a Dodge Ram so that we could all fit in it at the same time. It's not our regular family car, but that way we can all go to Home Depot, it was awesome for the drive in, and we'll probably take it camping (until we bring the dogs, still haven't figured that one out). The big truck is about the same age and we lost ~$1500 in the transaction. The gas mileage is the suck.

Longer term he wants a crossover and keep the Dodge, or a newer truck. We gave serious consideration to a sedan for commute and a truck as a 3rd vehicle, but he just doesn't like driving a sedan. That's fine, I don't either. I'm not convinced we have enough hauling to warrant carrying insurance or paying gas for a truck, but we obviously disagree there.

Camping is a challenge. MH wants to get a cap for the truck and put Teddy's crate back there. I don't hate that idea, but I dont' love it either.

He's a really good traveler and loves his crate, so I don't doubt that he'd just lay right down for the entire drive. And he'd be sheltered from the wind. and we could keep the window between the cab and the bed open so we could monitor the temp back there. But i'd feel mean not having him in the cab with us. For one kid, and one dog - they can could still share the back seat - but if we get a 2nd dog (which we've talked about) or have a 2nd kid (you know...once we manage to produce the first one) we'd have to figure that out.

[wawa]

Thanks for the input everybody. we'll test the tacoma with a carseat before we make a final decision, but I'm definitely leaning toward just trading it in for a bigger truck.

[pescalita]

Yeah, we've talked about crates in the bed and I'm not in love with it. Both of them are neurotic, so they could easily flip their shit. We would go slow and test it out around the block and stuff, but if it doesn't work we have $$ crates to offload and still no solution. I'm not comfortable with Ronny in the back with A alone.

This may all be moot as we're tackling our first trip with just the kiddo in two weeks. MrP wanted to isolate our variables so we're boarding the dogs this time. Considering we've only taken them once in three years, this problem may solve itself

[wawa]

Jun 22, 2012 14:59:01 GMT -5 pescalita said:

Yeah, we've talked about crates in the bed and I'm not in love with it. Both of them are neurotic, so they could easily flip their shit. We would go slow and test it out around the block and stuff, but if it doesn't work we have $$ crates to offload and still no solution. I'm not comfortable with Ronny in the back with A alone.

This may all be moot as we're tackling our first trip with just the kiddo in two weeks. MrP wanted to isolate our variables so we're boarding the dogs this time. Considering we've only taken them once in three years, this problem may solve itself

true! Dealing with my dog is a lot less complicated than your two. He's pretty easy going, and is currently crate trained so there's that. And I think after a couple of car rides where I sit in the back between the dog and the futurebaby he'll figure out leaving the kid alone.

As it is he has a serious baby licking problem. Apparently the combination of snot and milk is irrisistable and he licks every baby he sees. Like...full tounge chin to forehead swipes. I've had to police him pretty closely with our friend's kids until they got old enough to fend him off themselves so he didn't drown the poor kids in slobber.

this tounge does not kid around.


But so far no pawing, nipping, or being at all tweaked out by crying or other weird baby noises. I've got high hopes for his career as a doggy big brother. He's an excellent dog cousin with my blood and unofficial nieces and nephews.

Except that his his cutoff for "big enough for full on romping" is about "taller than him". When they're smaller he's been really adorably careful with them. (under supervision of course) But once they are about face to face with him he thinks they can go fullforce with the playing. Unshockingly a 60lb boxer ramming into a 3 year old at top speed is not a good scene. He takes out our best friend's little girl every single time he sees her. She's tall for her age, but totally uncoordinated and he just doesn't seem to understand why she falls down so easily.

But she cries for about 30 seconds and then asks if she can play with him some more. I'm never sure what the right answer is...but her mom just says, "sure, but I don't want to hear it when he knocks you down again." I usally just just end up keeping an eye on him and giving the "eh" noise if he starts to work up too much steam. He'll figure it out eventually, right?

Ummm...consider me officially side tracked.

[ECB]

Jun 22, 2012 13:38:58 GMT -5 ladybrettashley said:

1. Like you said, it would be a PITA to take two vehicles any time you went on a trip requiring both the truck and the baby.

For this reason alone, I'd get the truck. The occasional times DH and I have to take 2 cars due to our schedules, I HATE it.

[lys]

Have you considered a Chevy Silverado with an extended cab & box? Less costly and more fuel efficient than the Tacoma.

[meshaliuknits]

PUPPY!!!

Adorable!

Sent from my EVO

[laurenpetro]

i'd go for the bigger truck. i've driven my kids around in a silverado with the back seat and it was great.

i will say, if you're considering keeping the tacoma then don't just try it out with an infant seat. get one of those big honking convertible car seats. those things push your seats up farther than the graco infant seats.

[decemberwedding07]

ETA: Never mind. I obviously didn't finish reading your post and missed the point about you not feeling comfortable driving his truck and also that you'll probably need to have one person drop off the baby and the other pick him/her up. I vote for option 2. One less car to worry about. Maintenance costs are unpredictable and can be huge.

Do you each need to have your own car? Couldn't you just make a rule that whoever leaves without the baby takes the truck? Then when you're both together with the baby, you just take your car?

I don't have children, but I wouldn't think it would be a huge deal to only have one car that works with the baby. I actually know a lot of people who only have car seats in one car, so that's the one that's always with the baby. Basically, the car that fits the car seat almost becomes the baby's car. If the baby is home, that car stays home, and the person who leaves without the baby takes the other car.

I certainly wouldn't rush into anything. You can try it for a month or two and see how it goes after you have the baby. If it doesn't work as well as I suspect it will work, you can go buy a car then and that way, you'll be basing your car purchase on your own actual real life experiences with the baby.

[ringstrue]

Jun 22, 2012 13:57:36 GMT -5 wawa said:

Jun 22, 2012 13:50:23 GMT -5 ringstrue said:

Both of my parents have boats and both haul them with minivans. IME, trucks take more work to use as a family car vs. just have a minivan or crossover. I mean, you'll have luggage and tons of crap for a baby, (PNPs, baby gates, booster seats, etc.) and that is a PITA to tarp down in a truck vs. just pack inside a car. Dunno about those huge trucks but I know the smaller ones at last needed to have sand bags in the back to weight them down for icy road conditions. I get wanting a truck if you are hauling hay multiple times a month, but once the house reno is done, are you really going to be hauling materials that much to warrant a new vehicle for 10-ish years?

yup. because once this particular reno is done there is still all the landscaping that needs to be redone, new kitchen, new shed, etc and helping our friends with their houses, and helping my sister out at her farm, and eventually I'd like my own horse, which would mean my own horse trailer....

you get the idea.

I really do appreciate your thoughts pointing out the issues with trucks, but when I say that owning a truck is non-negotiable, I mean it. It's something MH and I have debated and talked over many many times, but we really do use the truck as a truck on a regular basis and have for the entire 5 years he's owned it. That need isn't going away.

Yeah that is more understandable. Though hauling even things like all that =/= truck. I think I'm just thinking that a van or SUV can be used for both hauling whatever and family trips (my dad hauled wood, queen sized mattresses, dressers, etc in his van plenty of times) if you get the kind with the fold down seats and all. But a truck can't "convert" to a family car. I mean if you are talking the Pilot or something of that caliber, I dunno that you really have anything you couldn't put in it that you could put in a truck? I mean with proper laying down of tarp before and all. I'm not anti-truck I'm just trying to prevent you guys from getting eleventy-billion cars

Nother random - we did a "what kind of car do you have" quiz on here once (old board) and it seemed like almost everyone with at least one kid and one dog had a van or crossover/SUV vehicle. I never really thought of it as I'm still sort of a station-wagon person nowadays, but with a boxy crate and carseat and all, it makes a lot more sense if you are taking substantial road trips. I dunno if you have a dog now but just another factor to ponder .

[decemberwedding07]

Oh, and I have no idea what the towing capacity on a minivan is, but if 4 wheel drive and large ground clearance isn't a necessity, and if a minivan has the towing capability that you're looking for, then I would suggest that you at least test drive one.

I don't have any children and I drive a Honda Odyssey and I LOVE it. LOVE it. Those power sliding doors are amazing. Someone can park right next to me and I can still open my rear doors fully, and I can even open them remotely. I have fit all sorts of large items into it with no troubles. The lower height on the minivan makes it much easier for me to put heavy items into the van and take them out again, compared to a truck or SUV. Our Odyssey actually has a greater cargo capacity than my MIL's new Ford Expedition. I seriously love my van. LOVE IT.

ETA: The one drawback to a minivan, and I swear it's not my imagination, is the way other motorists treat you. Nobody ever wants to let me over . I swear, I never have that problem when I drive our Accord. It's just when I'm in the minivan.