Speaking of international parenting

[crimsonandclover]

news.yahoo.com/fears-brat-ocracy-child-centred-sweden-032211025.html

Are Swedish kids spoiled brats because of Swedish parenting? WDYT? I don't think we have anyone from Sweden in here to say how they compare with the rest of the world, but I'd still be interested to know if any of you have an opinion on this.

[popcorn]

Pretty fascinating article.  I do think a lot of it boils down to cultural differences.  So many people would say Americans teach their children to be far too independent and are too strict with them.  Some might say Spanish people encourage their kids to mooch and live a life of entitlement.  I'm sure there is some grain of truth to all these things, but I don't know if I can say it's bad or not.

The only thing I can say with certainty is that it would drive me bananas to be around parents who didn't correct their children as that is not really how I am.  I don't know any Swedish people to ask about this though so...

[crimsonandclover]

Oct 28, 2013 7:40:11 GMT -5 popcorn said:

Pretty fascinating article.  I do think a lot of it boils down to cultural differences.  So many people would say Americans teach their children to be far too independent and are too strict with them. 

And on the opposite extreme, you have the helicopter mom phenomenon.

I remember a friend telling me about how her cousins raised their friends "anti-authoritarian" and were then shocked when the kids wouldn't listen to them and the 15-year-old even slapped his mom.

I think most people tend towards a middle path, which is probably good, but as a parent I think it's difficult to know who to listen to - how much and what kind of punishment is the "right" kind? How to walk the fine line between encouraging independence and setting boundaries? I thought the article was interesting as at least one opinion of this kind of behavior being a national phenomenon in Sweden. I wish I could hear from "normal" people whether they agree.

[potatopie]

No idea if this is true in Sweden or not, but I'm definitely seeing this phenomenon in the States. Parents are letting their children run things and then they're shocked when the kids won't listen to them. It really sucks as a teacher. A classroom with 30 of these kids is a nightmare. They've even coined a new term for this "disorder" called Oppositional Defiant Disorder. Seriously? I feel like it's just kids who grew up without strong boundaries or structures.

[mrsukyankee]

Actually ODD was defined in 1980 so not a new term, but I think it's come into the forefront of the news more now. I do think people over-use it as it's the precursor to Conduct Disorder or Antisocial Personality Disorder which is VERY bad to have as a diagnosis.

I do see the results of kids due to the parenting phenomenon in schools as well - including in the heightened states of anxiety that kids are having at earlier and earlier ages. Boundaries are necessary for kids to feel safe - w/o them, anxiety or anger comes in.

[potatopie]

Thanks for the clarification, mrsukyankee. Are these disorders considered intrinsic (is that the right word to use?)or can they be "cultivated" in the right kind of environment?

If it is a matter of nurture over nature, then I'd whole-heartedly agree that ODD is becoming a problem. Otherwise, I'm sure there are some serious cases of ODD. And I'm also sure that, regardless of any diagnosis, many of my students went on to have great difficulty adapting to an adult world.

[mrsukyankee]

Here's a great article on ODD.  From what I've read, there is a genetic component that is compounded by how the children are raised.  Parenting work is very necessary to help the child, though for some, they will/would never get 'better' as it's much more nature than nurture - these are the kids who go on to doing very bad things as adults (setting fires, stealing things, etc).

[Wanderista]

None of my Swedish friends have kids yet. I know one who is pregnant. Not sure if she'll raise her kid like that though.

I won't opine on the specifics of parenting, obviously. I only want to say that what I've seen in my area of the US among random families is a lot like what potatopie mentioned. I see a lot of lack of basic public discipline and cases of kids acting out because they seem like they are asking for boundaries and attention. That's not every kid I meet, but I see a lot of kids not being corrected for acting out. I remember not long ago that I saw a kid doing cartwheels around a (non-kid-oriented) restaurant while his parents completely ignored him. I've seen things like that fairly frequently. Maybe that's a parenting strategy and I just don't know much about it but it was kind of shocking. I have also seen that sort of thing sometimes in other countries, so not just America but it is quite common around here.

[EllieT]

Well I am Swedish but I don't have any kids nor does any of my friends have kids. And I don't even have cousins or nieces/nephews so I really can't tell what kids are like these days.

[paradebegone]

I asked a Swedish friend about this today. She just laughed and said it was true.