What, if anything, should be done about jihadists?

[summer]

I had this discussion with a friend after reading this, but we talk about it a lot here, as well.

What, if anything, should the rest of the world do when pockets of countries are taken over by radical religions against the will of the people who live there? War, like in Afghanistan, really only put them off, but when we leave there, the Taliban will be back. They already are. And they seem to be gaining strength in Pakistan, as well?

click link for pg 2.

www.nytimes.com/2012/07/18/world/africa/jidhadists-fierce-justice-drives-thousands-to-flee-mali.html?_r=1&hp

MBERA, Mauritania — The vast desert expanse of northern Mali has become a magnet for Islamic extremists who have tightened their grip on Timbuktu and other far-flung towns, imposing a strict form of justice that is prompting tens of thousands of people to flee what some are likening to an African Afghanistan.

Rattled recent arrivals at a 92,000-person makeshift camp here at Mauritania’s remote eastern edge describe an influx of jihadists — some homegrown and others possibly from afar — intent on imposing an Islam of lash and gun on Malian Muslims who have long coexisted with Western tourists in the fabled town of Timbuktu.

The conditions here in Mbera are grim, with many of the Malians sick, hungry and bewildered. But that is better, refugees said in interviews Tuesday, than the grueling life turned upside-down that an unexpected Islamist military triumph inflicted on their lives in a vast region in the heart of West Africa.

Refugees from such places as Timbuktu, Goundam, Gao and Kidal described witnessing repeated whippings, beatings and other punishments in the streets, ostensibly for having violated strict Islamic law, and some of those who fled said they had been subjected to this harsh justice themselves.

“They said: ‘You are thieves. Why are you out walking at this hour?’ ” Mohamed ag el-Hadj, a 27-year-old former soldier in the Malian Army recalled. He and a friend out for a stroll at 7 in the evening found themselves surrounded by two carloads of well-armed men. The men tied the friends’ arms behind their backs, bound them to a tree and forced them to kneel, bending forward, for the evening. In the morning, “everything was swollen.”

“It was scary,” Mr. Hadj recalled. “They insulted me, called me a savage, an unbeliever.”

When they found a cigarette pack in his shirt pocket, they beat him about the face. “For nothing,” the young man said. “These are their punishments.”

Living under rows of dirty blue-and-white United Nations tents or under makeshift sheet-and-stick shelters, refugees spoke of heavily armed men of numerous races, nationalities, and languages — “black, brown, yellow, white,” one said — now controlling the streets. One spoke of encountering Afghans, Pakistanis and Nigerians.

American counterterrorism experts express concerns that Mali could turn into a magnet for international terrorists, but they say that such reports have not yet been corroborated. The turmoil in northern Mali has likely drawn extremists from the region, though, experts say.

“The concern is that these local groups will further establish a safe haven in northern Mali to serve as a base of operations,” said a United States official who asked not to be identified while discussing sensitive intelligence matters. “Then maybe northern Mali could become a destination for foreign fighters from the wider region and even further afield, but it isn’t there yet.”

The Islamists in Timbuktu have destroyed at least a half-dozen venerable above-ground tombs of holy men revered in the ancient city, proclaiming them contrary to Shariah, a legal code based on Islam. The destruction provoked outrage among the citizens and in international organizations. “The day they destroyed the mausoleums, they put sentinels everywhere,” said Hassan ag Sidi, a refugee.

Ali ag Diaba, a traveling musician who fled northern Mali last weekend, said he witnessed citizens being whipped and undressed in the streets of Goundam by the Islamists, who are taken aback by the Malians’ Sufi sect. Many Malians follow a line of belief that posits a more mystical, personal relation with the deity. “They persecute and torture people, under the guise of a false religion,” he said.

Speaking in the shade of a tent, he explained that “When they beat people and others approach” to protest, the Islamists “fire in the air to disperse them.”

The extremist ministate in northern Mali is the unexpected fallout from the collapse of what had been regarded in the West — mistakenly — as a stable African democracy with functioning institutions in the capital, Bamako. In late March, army officers angry over the government’s handling of a rebellion by nomadic Tuareg rebels in the north rose up in a coup d’état, installing a military junta under an American-trained officer after two decades of elected governments.

[marie427]

Lawless countries/territories are a natural breeding ground for extremist activity. Helping prop up stable governments in lawless areas takes years and offers no guarantee of anything (see: Somalia). Plus, to quell the violence a country may need someone who rules with an iron fist, which has its own share of potential problems (see: former Yugoslavia).

This is all to say that I don't have a clue what needs to be done to stop this from continuing.