What is Madonnas problem?

[2vermont]

Jul 18, 2012 16:41:32 GMT -5 @crackhabit said:

she should be a judge on american idol.

That's actually not a bad idea. Didn't two judges quit?

[heyjude]

Jul 18, 2012 16:50:26 GMT -5 2vermont said:

Jul 18, 2012 16:41:47 GMT -5 heyjude said:

Does anyone tell mick jagger to bow out?

I can't help but admit that I have definitely wondered if no one has why they haven't.

But I'm not quite there yet with Madonna.

They haven't because MICK JAGGER IS DEVINE.

[IIOY]

Jul 18, 2012 16:46:14 GMT -5 tarzanswife said:

LOL, So you guys are saying you want to see her gyrating up on stage when she is 60, 70?? Come on..

If she can bring the goods, why not? My only problem with her now is that she has stopped being original and is mimicking people thirty years her junior. It's not working and makes her look tapped out. If she can conjure her magic again, let her perform until she's 104.

[Deleted]

Jul 18, 2012 16:48:27 GMT -5 toledo said:

Jul 18, 2012 16:46:14 GMT -5 tarzanswife said:

LOL, So you guys are saying you want to see her gyrating up on stage when she is 60, 70?? Come on..

I don't go to her concerts. Though she'll likely still be hot and limber at 60 and 70, you ageist.

I do listen to her music. As long as she stops pretending to be a teenybopper, I'm down with listening to her forever.

Who knew there was a mandated retirement age for musicians?

I'm not an ageist and I don't think there is a mandatory retirement age, I just feel like she needs to mature in her art as she is maturing in life. As a fan I just feel like she is trying to re-capture the fame of her glory years and it just isn't happening. I've been to all of her concerts and well, she puts on a good show but the music just isn't as good as it used to be.

I think if she wants to stay marketable she needs to re-invent herself again. She also needs to stop trying to compete with the younger crowd and show them a new direction.

[Deleted]

Jul 18, 2012 14:05:14 GMT -5 asdfjkl said:

Jul 18, 2012 13:59:25 GMT -5 marie427 said:

Oh, me too. The Immaculate Collection is still amazeballs. But 2012 Madonna just sucks.

Immaculate Collection was amazeballs. I don't think there is one bad song on that whole album.

Granted, I have not followed Madonna's career as closely as others, but has she ever put out another album that even came close to IC?

Immaculate Collection was a Best Of. You can't really compare.

Is there any artist who has one album that tops their Best of?

[dylanite]

Jul 18, 2012 17:10:06 GMT -5 sandsonik said:

Jul 18, 2012 14:05:14 GMT -5 asdfjkl said:

Immaculate Collection was amazeballs. I don't think there is one bad song on that whole album.

Granted, I have not followed Madonna's career as closely as others, but has she ever put out another album that even came close to IC?

Immaculate Collection was a Best Of. You can't really compare.

Is there any artist who has one album that tops their Best of?

Chumbawumba's single?

[julief]

--read the op and a few subsequent posts and got the gist...

I like Madonna quite a bit and always have. Of course there's no way that her latest offerings will live up to the popularity of her previous songs (12 or 13 #1 hits and half that many #2 songs), but MDNA was a good record, probably the best of her later career.

I think her longevity is something that only a few artists in music have ever achieved, including the most top 40 songs and one behind Streisand for the most number one albums by a female artist.

It's ok to say she's past her time and all that, but let's look at everybody who's around now, then jump 30 years in the future and see how relevant they are, how they have shaped cultural life...

She certainly had a positive impression on me. Through her songs like Vogue, I found out a lot about Old Hollywood stars, different artists, and so forth. I read a bio on each of the stars mentioned in the song, which then branched off to other artists and directors. I really like her and listen to her cds to this day.

I'm not sure what entertainer in the modern world couldn't be described as an AW.

[emmybean]

Jul 18, 2012 17:16:15 GMT -5 julief said:

--read the op and a few subsequent posts and got the gist...

I like Madonna quite a bit and always have. Of course there's no way that her latest offerings will live up to the popularity of her previous songs (12 or 13 #1 hits and half that many #2 songs), but MDNA was a good record, probably the best of her later career.

I think her longevity is something that only a few artists in music have ever achieved, including the most top 40 songs and one behind Streisand for the most number one albums by a female artist.

It's ok to say she's past her time and all that, but let's look at everybody who's around now, then jump 30 years in the future and see how relevant they are, how they have shaped cultural life...

She certainly had a positive impression on me. Through her songs like Vogue, I found out a lot about Old Hollywood stars, different artists, and so forth. I read a bio on each of the stars mentioned in the song, which then branched off to other artists and directors. I really like her and listen to her cds to this day.

I'm not sure what entertainer in the modern world couldn't be described as an AW.

[julief]

---skimmed the thread

Woah, we must not be listening to the same MDNA. I like quite a few of the songs. I'd rate Like a Prayer, Ray of Light, and certain tracks of Erotica and Bedtime Stories as among the greatest pop tracks of all time, and I'm comparing to the elite artists.

To say that she has Immaculate Collection and that's it is just not so, and she has three greatest hits collections, not just one. There was one with ballads, Something to Remember, and a greatest hits volume 2.

There are enough good album tracks on her records to warrant their own greatest hits collection.

[Deleted]

Jul 18, 2012 16:54:31 GMT -5 IIOY said:

Jul 18, 2012 16:46:14 GMT -5 tarzanswife said:

LOL, So you guys are saying you want to see her gyrating up on stage when she is 60, 70?? Come on..

If she can bring the goods, why not? My only problem with her now is that she has stopped being original and is mimicking people thirty years her junior.

My only problem is with the notion that Madonna was EVER original. Or that talented at anything beyond packaging herself and getting attention. She's an ok but not very strong singer, an ok dancer and she can't write her own music. If MTV hadn't existed (and been so huge) when Madonna came up, I'm not sure any of us would even know who she was.

[heyjude]

Who was madonna copying in the 80s to be called "never original"?

[bluestreet]

Even when she was doing the Evita thing (and her look for Take a Bow), I thought she should have reserved that look for her late 50s. That would be so perfect now. Sexy and mature. Rather than desperate.

[IIOY]

Jul 18, 2012 17:23:04 GMT -5 sandsonik said:

Jul 18, 2012 16:54:31 GMT -5 IIOY said:

If she can bring the goods, why not? My only problem with her now is that she has stopped being original and is mimicking people thirty years her junior.

My only problem is with the notion that Madonna was EVER original. Or that talented at anything beyond packaging herself and getting attention. She's an ok but not very strong singer, an ok dancer and she can't write her own music. If MTV hadn't existed (and been so huge) when Madonna came up, I'm not sure any of us would even know who she was.

To the contrary, Madonna co-writes and co-produces almost all of her own materal. She's always five minutes behind the curve now but I can't get on board the "never original" train.

[dylanite]

Yeah she's completely original.

www.aishamusic.com/lawsuit_many_artists_madonna_stole_from.htm

[IIOY]

Jul 18, 2012 18:45:51 GMT -5 dylanite said:

Yeah she's completely original.

www.aishamusic.com/lawsuit_many_artists_madonna_stole_from.htm

Yeah, none of those are stretches. Or frivolous lawsuits. At all.

[dylanite]

Jul 18, 2012 18:58:47 GMT -5 IIOY said:

Jul 18, 2012 18:45:51 GMT -5 dylanite said:

Yeah she's completely original.

www.aishamusic.com/lawsuit_many_artists_madonna_stole_from.htm

Yeah, none of those are stretches. Or frivolous lawsuits. At all.

You checked those fast! But dude, the pics scream how wrong you are. Just so embarrassingly wrong. Objectively so, even. Fact.

[dylanite]

Jul 18, 2012 19:12:44 GMT -5 toledo said:

Jul 18, 2012 18:45:51 GMT -5 dylanite said:

Yeah she's completely original.

www.aishamusic.com/lawsuit_many_artists_madonna_stole_from.htm

Well, aren't you a googling pro.

Hopefully you learned a valuable lesson about not typing until after you've educated yourself fully. Or, at all.

[Deleted]

Mick Jagger isn't making himself look ridiculous trying to be at the top of the chart with the Bieber crowd. He knows his audience, he's not adverse to playing his old stuff, and he's pretty much the same as he ever was, albeit older.

You really can't say the same for Madonna.

[heyjude]

Jul 18, 2012 19:30:32 GMT -5 @habbsies said:

Mick Jagger isn't making himself look ridiculous trying to be at the top of the chart with the Bieber crowd. He knows his audience, he's not adverse to playing his old stuff, and he's pretty much the same as he ever was, albeit older.

You really can't say the same for Madonna.

Did you see him on SNL recently?

[Deleted]

Nope. But I saw him do some awards show two years ago (can't remember which one.) And dude has always looked like a scarecrow on crack so unless he was rambling about the diabeetus, meh.

[Deleted]

Jul 18, 2012 18:09:45 GMT -5 IIOY said:

Jul 18, 2012 17:23:04 GMT -5 sandsonik said:

My only problem is with the notion that Madonna was EVER original. Or that talented at anything beyond packaging herself and getting attention. She's an ok but not very strong singer, an ok dancer and she can't write her own music. If MTV hadn't existed (and been so huge) when Madonna came up, I'm not sure any of us would even know who she was.

To the contrary, Madonna co-writes and co-produces almost all of her own materal. She's always five minutes behind the curve now but I can't get on board the "never original" train.

Do a little research about those co-writing credits. It's not unusual for stars to demand a co-writing credit in return for "giving" a songwriter a break and exposure. They want the publishing. But if you read interviews with Madonna's co-writers, her input was usually minimal, like one or two lines (and no music) and on many of her biggest hits, she's not even listed as co-writer.

I don't know what people find original about her - can you elucidate? Her looks, her music, what?

But I feel that way about Lady Gaga too. "Oh, she's so theatrical! No one's ever done that before"

Like David Bowie, Alice Cooper and ahem, Madonna never existed.

[Deleted]

Jul 18, 2012 19:30:32 GMT -5 @habbsies said:

Mick Jagger isn't making himself look ridiculous trying to be at the top of the chart with the Bieber crowd. He knows his audience, he's not adverse to playing his old stuff, and he's pretty much the same as he ever was, albeit older.

You really can't say the same for Madonna.

Because she's in POP music, which always has and always will be aimed at a younger crowd who's not going to look for depth, and will always be looking for the next trend, the next controversy, the next buzz. Pop music is not about being the same as you ever were...Hell, I sure hope rock isn't either for that matter. That's just artistic death.

It's not like Madonna can suddenly become a jazz artist. You can say she doesn't have the chops anymore, or the songs, but it seems silly to criticize her for trying to be current, when pop isher genre.

[IIOY]

Jul 18, 2012 23:58:52 GMT -5 sandsonik said:

Jul 18, 2012 18:09:45 GMT -5 IIOY said:

To the contrary, Madonna co-writes and co-produces almost all of her own materal. She's always five minutes behind the curve now but I can't get on board the "never original" train.

Do a little research about those co-writing credits. It's not unusual for stars to demand a co-writing credit in return for "giving" a songwriter a break and exposure. They want the publishing. But if you read interviews with Madonna's co-writers, her input was usually minimal, like one or two lines (and no music) and on many of her biggest hits, she's not even listed as co-writer.

Well, that's not presumptuous or condescending at all, LOL. But OK, sands.

[Deleted]

Jul 19, 2012 4:03:22 GMT -5 IIOY said:

Jul 18, 2012 23:58:52 GMT -5 sandsonik said:

Do a little research about those co-writing credits. It's not unusual for stars to demand a co-writing credit in return for "giving" a songwriter a break and exposure. They want the publishing. But if you read interviews with Madonna's co-writers, her input was usually minimal, like one or two lines (and no music) and on many of her biggest hits, she's not even listed as co-writer.

Well, that's not presumptuous or condescending at all, LOL. But OK, sands.

Sorry, I don't get it - how was that presumptuous or condescending? That wasn't my intent, so I celebrity-apologize if you were offended, LOL.

PS - are you Madonna??!!

[teflep]

Jul 19, 2012 6:56:43 GMT -5 sandsonik said:

Jul 19, 2012 4:03:22 GMT -5 IIOY said:

Well, that's not presumptuous or condescending at all, LOL. But OK, sands.

Sorry, I don't get it - how was that presumptuous or condescending? That wasn't my intent, so I celebrity-apologize if you were offended, LOL.

PS - are you Madonna??!!

I am going to go with "Do a little research"...just an observ.

[Deleted]

Jul 18, 2012 17:23:04 GMT -5 sandsonik said:

My only problem is with the notion that Madonna was EVER original. Or that talented at anything beyond packaging herself and getting attention. She's an ok but not very strong singer, an ok dancer and she can't write her own music. If MTV hadn't existed (and been so huge) when Madonna came up, I'm not sure any of us would even know who she was.

This.

And LMAO that someone compared Madonna to Mick Jagger. Yes, I saw his most recent SNL appearance (not his only one; he had an awesome one in the 90's) but I can let that slide given the magnitude and significance of his musical accomplishments, which I'm sorry but are far more than madonna's.

[Deleted]

Jul 19, 2012 0:05:19 GMT -5 sandsonik said:

Because she's in POP music, which always has and always will be aimed at a younger crowd who's not going to look for depth, and will always be looking for the next trend, the next controversy, the next buzz. Pop music is not about being the same as you ever were...Hell, I sure hope rock isn't either for that matter. That's just artistic death.

It's not like Madonna can suddenly become a jazz artist. You can say she doesn't have the chops anymore, or the songs, but it seems silly to criticize her for trying to be current, when pop isher genre.

And yet Mariah and a whole bunch of other established pop artists aren't striving for this level of ridiculousness.

[teflep]

Jul 19, 2012 7:38:34 GMT -5 @habbsies said:

Jul 19, 2012 0:05:19 GMT -5 sandsonik said:

Because she's in POP music, which always has and always will be aimed at a younger crowd who's not going to look for depth, and will always be looking for the next trend, the next controversy, the next buzz. Pop music is not about being the same as you ever were...Hell, I sure hope rock isn't either for that matter. That's just artistic death.

It's not like Madonna can suddenly become a jazz artist. You can say she doesn't have the chops anymore, or the songs, but it seems silly to criticize her for trying to be current, when pop isher genre.

And yet Mariah and a whole bunch of other established pop artists aren't striving for this level of ridiculousness.

I think mariah was heading there, before kids, IMO

[Deleted]

Mariah is ridiculous, don't get me wrong but it's her personality, not her performances or her music. I think Mariah is aware, moreso than Madonna of what her fans want and where her appeal lies.

IMO, her music and tours are geared towards established fans with the home that if it's good enough, others will like it too. Madonna, otoh, seemingly doesn't care about the people who already love her and instead, is focusing on winning the attention of critics and competing with acts like Gaga, Kesha, and Katy Perry. Mariah knows what she does and she continues to does it well. Madonna is desperately searching to be the newest thing and failing.

[Waffles]

Jul 18, 2012 13:54:41 GMT -5 asdfjkl said:

I think she's a victim of her own success. 30 years ago when Madonna first hit, everyone was pearl clutching because she looked like a whore and sang about bastard babies. Fast forward ten years, and we're all used to the whores and bastard babies, so she goes anti-religion. Fast forward ten years and we're all used to the pope-sucks rhetoric from celebrities, so she goes dominatrix sex in your face it's not porn it's art. No we're all sexed out. So what's left. She's the one who led these movements. She defined them and shocked us with them. But we're all shocked out and now all we want is a good song. Something she's been significantly less consistent about.

That's nailed it for me. I grew up with Madonna and while I was never a major fan, I have really enjoyed some of her songs over the years.

Despite not really enjoying 2012 Madonna, I did go see her concert last week as I always thought it would be quite a show... I wasn't disappointed: the woman still has it. She def. is a polished performer, if not warming to her audience. And luckily for me, she did play some of her old songs.

I also think no one can deny she keeps reinventing herself. Who knows what she'll do next? Hopefully better music than this last album!