My principal definitely doesn't take it as seriously as I do and thinks that giving a zero on the assignment (with the option to do it over for half credit) is too harsh.
This right here does not surprise me at all but it infuriates me nevertheless.
Me too.
Wasn't it NewOrleans that was dealing with this same issue? She wanted to give a student a zero, but the administration was all "No, that's too mean!!" I was dying over that whole situation.
To clarify, I was not throwing teachers under the bus for looking the other way. I suspect that if it gets done, it's more because of administration/parents.
It's disappointing that you don't understand the definition of plagiarism. If stealing someone's ideas were plagiarism, no student could ever write a paper. Certainly there would be no science fairs -- I actually don't think Dr. Jud's idea passes your test for originality: Was it his idea that Lionfish are an invasive species? (No, he "plagiarized" that idea.) Was it his ideal that marine organisms may invade estuaries? (No, he "plagiarized" that idea too!) Was he the first guy to track invasive species? (No.. OMG, he "plagiarized" that as well!) In fact, I see he's cited 34 prior studies and by YOUR (goofy) definition, that's plagiarism. Jeez, HIS "idea" is starting to look COMPLETELY plagiarized, isn't it? Well, by YOUR definition, he's a raging plagiarist... However, your definition of plagiarism sucks.
Ask any scientist: science is mostly incremental, which is probably why the field yawned when Jud published his findings. And THAT'S WHAT THIS IS ABOUT. Jud is a big crying envious baby, whose admitted that he is jealous and doesn't know how to go about cashing in on this child's lucky break with the media. And you, so-called adults, are pathetic, stupid, misguided enablers.
And if I seem rude, it's because I am. But also Jud pisses me off. His is the kind of crap science that we don't need. He doesn't care about how his work helps people or the ocean ecology or informs public policy or anything like that. He's whiny because he's not getting the limelight, which is SOO OBSCENE. That kind of thinking is how we get journals full of marginally useful knowledge, like that lionfish can invade estuaries.
And, no, I am not the girl's father. (But I have to say, I'm not surprised that you stupid people jump to the wrong conclusion.) I'm a published Ph.D. researcher in a completely different field and I'm incensed that stupid adults who have no idea how science works (nor what plagiarism means) are trashing a little girl. That kid at the science fair with the potato clock -- you think he's been in his lab for a few years, measuring the chemical composition of tubers?
And another thing: If we accept the premise that she plagiarized, that means she stole from him. But Dr. Douchbag's work was fucking published (and what pissed him off was that no one cared). All she stole was the spotlight.
And finally, if a 12-year-old with six fish tanks can "steal" your idea, was your idea all that great? Probably not. The press was impressed when a 12-year-old did it. Science yawned when a Ph.D. did it. And the douche bag has the gall to complain about it?
"Not gonna lie; I kind of keep expecting you to post one day that you threw down on someone who clearly had no idea that today was NOT THEIR DAY." ~dontcallmeshirley
And if I seem rude, it's because I am. But also Jud pisses me off. His is the kind of crap science that we don't need. He doesn't care about how his work helps people or the ocean ecology or informs public policy or anything like that. He's whiny because he's not getting the limelight, which is SOO OBSCENE. That kind of thinking is how we get journals full of marginally useful knowledge, like that lionfish can invade estuaries.
Actual LOL
and I'm a real scientist!
HE DOESN'T EVEN CARE ABOUT HELPING PEOPLE
LOLOLOL. Thank you. I am giving you credit for making me laugh. See what I did there?
It's disappointing that you don't understand the definition of plagiarism. If stealing someone's ideas were plagiarism, no student could ever write a paper. Certainly there would be no science fairs -- I actually don't think Dr. Jud's idea passes your test for originality: Was it his idea that Lionfish are an invasive species? (No, he "plagiarized" that idea.) Was it his ideal that marine organisms may invade estuaries? (No, he "plagiarized" that idea too!) Was he the first guy to track invasive species? (No.. OMG, he "plagiarized" that as well!) In fact, I see he's cited 34 prior studies and by YOUR (goofy) definition, that's plagiarism. Jeez, HIS "idea" is starting to look COMPLETELY plagiarized, isn't it? Well, by YOUR definition, he's a raging plagiarist... However, your definition of plagiarism sucks.
Ask any scientist: science is mostly incremental, which is probably why the field yawned when Jud published his findings. And THAT'S WHAT THIS IS ABOUT. Jud is a big crying envious baby, whose admitted that he is jealous and doesn't know how to go about cashing in on this child's lucky break with the media. And you, so-called adults, are pathetic, stupid, misguided enablers.
And if I seem rude, it's because I am. But also Jud pisses me off. His is the kind of crap science that we don't need. He doesn't care about how his work helps people or the ocean ecology or informs public policy or anything like that. He's whiny because he's not getting the limelight, which is SOO OBSCENE. That kind of thinking is how we get journals full of marginally useful knowledge, like that lionfish can invade estuaries.
Shame on the dad, who should have known better (especially being an academic himself). Now his daughter, who seems legitimately bright, will have this whole plagiarism affair attached to her name. Way to go, dad.
I'm glad that the grad student is getting proper credit for his work though. I was annoyed once when a research collaborator used a figure from one of my publications without crediting me. I can't imagine how angry I would be if I had made a significant discovery (with all of the grant writing to obtain funding, experimental setup and design, data recording and analysis, fieldwork, submission for peer review, etc etc etc that goes into something like this), and my findings were credited to a 12 year old.
This right here does not surprise me at all but it infuriates me nevertheless.
Me too.
Wasn't it NewOrleans that was dealing with this same issue? She wanted to give a student a zero, but the administration was all "No, that's too mean!!" I was dying over that whole situation.
Post by NewOrleans on Jul 28, 2014 20:34:14 GMT -5
Hi Arrington family! I'm thinking mom.
You should take your argument up with... academia, not this board. I'm sure your child is lovely and bright and has done many other things to make you proud. Model for her how to handle disappointment gracefully.
It's disappointing that you don't understand the definition of plagiarism. If stealing someone's ideas were plagiarism, no student could ever write a paper. Certainly there would be no science fairs -- I actually don't think Dr. Jud's idea passes your test for originality: Was it his idea that Lionfish are an invasive species? (No, he "plagiarized" that idea.) Was it his ideal that marine organisms may invade estuaries? (No, he "plagiarized" that idea too!) Was he the first guy to track invasive species? (No.. OMG, he "plagiarized" that as well!) In fact, I see he's cited 34 prior studies and by YOUR (goofy) definition, that's plagiarism. Jeez, HIS "idea" is starting to look COMPLETELY plagiarized, isn't it? Well, by YOUR definition, he's a raging plagiarist... However, your definition of plagiarism sucks.
Ask any scientist: science is mostly incremental, which is probably why the field yawned when Jud published his findings. And THAT'S WHAT THIS IS ABOUT. Jud is a big crying envious baby, whose admitted that he is jealous and doesn't know how to go about cashing in on this child's lucky break with the media. And you, so-called adults, are pathetic, stupid, misguided enablers.
And if I seem rude, it's because I am. But also Jud pisses me off. His is the kind of crap science that we don't need. He doesn't care about how his work helps people or the ocean ecology or informs public policy or anything like that. He's whiny because he's not getting the limelight, which is SOO OBSCENE. That kind of thinking is how we get journals full of marginally useful knowledge, like that lionfish can invade estuaries.
And, no, I am not the girl's father. (But I have to say, I'm not surprised that you stupid people jump to the wrong conclusion.) I'm a published Ph.D. researcher in a completely different field and I'm incensed that stupid adults who have no idea how science works (nor what plagiarism means) are trashing a little girl. That kid at the science fair with the potato clock -- you think he's been in his lab for a few years, measuring the chemical composition of tubers?
And another thing: If we accept the premise that she plagiarized, that means she stole from him. But Dr. Douchbag's work was fucking published (and what pissed him off was that no one cared). All she stole was the spotlight.
And finally, if a 12-year-old with six fish tanks can "steal" your idea, was your idea all that great? Probably not. The press was impressed when a 12-year-old did it. Science yawned when a Ph.D. did it. And the douche bag has the gall to complain about it?
Okay, I was on the fence between this case and the senator's plagiarized "thesis" for a plagiarism lesson I'm working on for the fall semester, but this is the nail in the coffin. Lionfish science project for the extra-wanky win!
If you had read this whole thread you would have known that no one was trashing the little girl. We all think she's pretty cool. But her parents, Dad specifically, should have known better and should have been teaching her about properly crediting another's ideas and research and not making oversized claims about what you personally actually did whether in writing or in interviews.
"Not gonna lie; I kind of keep expecting you to post one day that you threw down on someone who clearly had no idea that today was NOT THEIR DAY." ~dontcallmeshirley