Guardianship

[themoneytree]

Please talk to me about guardianship real quick.

I'm especially interested in hearing from those who don't have an obvious candidate.

We are going to update our wills today. Guardianship is the thing that worries me most and the reason we have been putting it off.

Pertinent info. We are both only children.
Both Grand Fathers are out of the running for various reasons.
My Mom is out of the running because of her partner (which breaks my heart, but it is what it is).

H's Mom is a possibility. She loves A and they know each other. She lives 6 hours away, but at least it's the same country? She is not in great health and my main issue is that the extended family (who she spends a lot of time around) are all tea party, pro gun, uber religious, anti gay marriage kind of people. The kind of people who do lots for charity but make racist jokes (but swear they aren't racist). This a real problem for me (and for H). Admittedly MIL is the least nuts of all of them and she is not homophobic. And A would be with her, not them. At least mostly. But MIL also wouldn't contradict them when they say gross things in front of A.

The other main possibility is my cousin. She just turned 50. She and her H have 2 great kids who are college aged. They sent their kids to good schools and live in a wonderful village. I think they would raise her in the same kind of way we would raise her and with similar ideals. They are not perfect, but they are a lot like H and I. My Mother who A knows and loves would have easy access to her and gets on amazingly well with my cousin.
H and I both agree they are the perfect choice, but they live in the UK and A doesn't really know them. So she would move countries to live with people she doesn't really know. : (

I am so torn on what to do.

I have 2 sets of friends who I would also be comfortable having as guardians and both would be willing, but neither is the perfect fit. I think we will put them down as back ups.

I am finding this difficult and may therefor not be thinking things through clearly. Any input?

[shostakovich]

Have you talked to any of the above potential guardians?

[CloudBee]

Are any of the friends people that you will have in your life forever, and your children are comfortable around? Are they in your age bracket?

[hopecounts]

While we chose to make the ILs our primary guardians to minimize the disruption for DD I think it sounds like the cousin in the UK would be a good choice for your situation.

It is entirely possible that a completely fresh start will be helpful if this situation were to come up so I would focus on who you think is the best guardian and not worry about the rest too much.

As for knowing them would the cousin be up for periodic facetiming/skyping doesn't have to be frequent but it could help build a relationship just in case.

[themoneytree]

We have talked to my cousin and they would be very happy to take her.

I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that MIL would WANT her.

Whichever grandparent is left without as much access to her would receive an annual payment to allow for a couple of paid for visits a year. This is where overseas marriages can be really tough. : (

[EmilieMadison]

Logistically, your MIL would be the most logical choice.
But the cousins sound like a much better fit, and they're younger.

I'd consider close friends if you have any, and not limit yourself to strictly family.

[thebreakfastclub]

I don't think there is a perfect fit in many situations.

I think I would choose the best set of friends, and then I might have the cousin oversee the financial trust.

MIL being in poor health is a major obstacle for me.

[nomad100]

TBH, I would likely pick friends who are closer in age to what I am because I wouldn't want my child to possibly lose another set of parents young (ugh, that sounds really morbid doesn't it?).

[cbwm1]

At first, my brother and SIL were going to be Will's guardians. However, they turned crazy and super tea party and love their fucking guns, so H and I decided they cannot raise Will with the same ideas and morals we have.

Ultimately, we decided that if anything were to happen to is, H's cousin and his wife would take Will. They're 100% on the same level as we are with everything and we know they'd be able to give him a good life.

[circa1978]

I would choose your cousin.

[themoneytree]

Jan 14, 2015 15:41:24 GMT -5 CloudBee said:

Are any of the friends people that you will have in your life forever, and your children are comfortable around? Are they in your age bracket?

Yes but while we have good friends in the US there is no one I would feel comfortable designating as guardian.

The friends I've known for 20+ years are in the UK. My BFF would be great and would take her in a heartbeat. She also doesn't know her though and her H is a difficult person. I love him, but he's tough.

The other couple stayed with us over Christmas and she loved them. Gay couple. Live a very DINK type lifestyle (I mean REALLY). But they are AMAZING people and would be wonderful parents. Except they don't want kids. My friend has some fairly severe emotional issues which he keeps under control and he and his partner have a really inspirational marriage. But what if he gets really sick? He has been suicidal on several occasions. He's also so loving and kind. They would be willing but I don't know.....

[anlo]

I would probably choose the person who I felt could give my child the upbringing closest to what H and I would have done, regardless of location. Staying close to home would be a benefit imp, but not as necessary as someone who will love your child, give stability, good character and values, etc.

I know it's hard. It helps me to remember that this is the worst case scenario. It's your backup plan. Good luck.

[themoneytree]

We do have great US friends. We just haven't known them as long. They are wonderful people, but no one feels right somehow.
There is one couple who I really admire as parents and love as people but for some reason it doesn't feel right.

Then we have a bunch of DINK friends who like A but wouldn't want to live with her. Lol.

We've only known our present friends for 2 or 3 years here. I have. Really good circle of friends but certainly no one I would give guardianship.

[Jermys]

For my kids, it's either going to be MWOS, cbwm1, or frkls. My family is crazy or too far away, H's family is too old, and I want someone who would honor our openness with their first families.

[CloudBee]

If you go with someone she's not super close with now, you can start fostering such a relationship now. Friends or family. Spark a new connection. Keep them in her circle.

[cville]

Jan 14, 2015 15:53:41 GMT -5 themoneytree said:

We do have great US friends. We just haven't known them as long. They are wonderful people, but no one feels right somehow.
There is one couple who I really admire as parents and love as people but for some reason it doesn't feel right.

Then we have a bunch of DINK friends who like A but wouldn't want to live with her. Lol.

We've only known our present friends for 2 or 3 years here. I have. Really good circle of friends but certainly no one I would give guardianship.

I'd pick your MIL and make these your secondary.  I think a lot of the "not feeling right" is that anyone other than YOU raising your kids doesn't feel right.

My parents and ILs are all still married, but for REASONS neither my husband nor I are comfortable with my dad or my FIL being the sole guardian.  So we designated my MIL (who is younger, and would move here) as our primary and my mom as our secondary.

If my brother gets it together in a more child-friendly way, we might sub him or our close friends in for my mom or MIL in a few years.  

[mrsdoe]

I am sure you can ask your lawyer this since this is not my area of practice, but are there any concerns with naming a guardian not from the us as far as courts/jurisdiction is concerned. If you were to pass who you name is not a guarantee and I would be afraid with an intended guardian who is abroad that they may not have the resources/motivation to vigorously fight for custody if for some reason whomever you name is challenged as guardian. I would also be sure to explicitly say who you do not want to be guardian - that's nearly as important.

How often would your child see the extended family of mil. We all have some crazies in our family and my parents don't really confront them but that doesn't mean they haven't instilled better values in me, kwim?

[whattheheck]

There's nothing that says that both you and your H have to choose the same guardian. Unless you both perish in the same incident, the surviving spouse can change their will to their choice so really, having different guardians is no different than that unless you both die simultaneously. But that will mean you have to choose carefully when determining who is deemed to predecease who in an event you can't tell.

[psychmom]

DHs sister and her husband are DSs guardians should anything happen and they live in the Czech Republic. DS has only met them once but they got along fabulously and they would make amazing parents. All of my family is out for various reasons and MIL & FIL are too old. I'm confident in the choice though. Kids are resilient and can adapt to lots of difference circumstances.

[whattheheck]

Jan 14, 2015 16:09:44 GMT -5 mrsdoe said:

Jan 14, 2015 16:07:08 GMT -5 whattheheck said:

There's nothing that says that both you and your H have to choose the same guardian. Unless you both perish in the same incident, the surviving spouse can change their will to their choice so really, having different guardians is no different than that unless you both die simultaneously. But that will mean you have to choose carefully when determining who is deemed to predecease who in an event you can't tell.

What? I can't even make sense of this. Where their kid goes is a joint decision. Or am I being daft?!

No . . . I'm being distracted.

You and H can decide on different guardians.  If H were to predecease you, you could always change your guardian to your choice, so really, there is no practical difference in having two different guardians in each of your wills.

UNLESS you both die at the same time.  Generally a will says that if H & W die in an event where it cannot be determined who died first, then it is to be presumed that one predeceased the other (so, hypothetically, your will can state that if you and H die simultaneously your wills should be executed as if H predeceased you or vice versa).

So if you die simultaneously - the will of the presumed "surviving spouse" will dictate guardianship.  So if you can't decide on guardians and each pick a different one, the next battle is to choose who will be deemed to predecease who.  But since that's a pretty unlikely occurrence, it might be a compromise that the person who feels less strongly is willing to make since it has a lower risk of actually happening.

Does that make any more sense that my prior rambling?

[auntie]

I purposely chose someone other than a grandparent.

My sister died when my nieces were 9 and 13; my parents had custody for a year before and several after. It was a clusterfuck.

In their grief, my parents just weren't up to the task. They were young and healthy. They previously had been wonderful grandparents who had the kids each weekend and traveled with them each year. But once their beloved DD died, they were broken. They had to be custodial rather than Disney grandparents, which meant the kids not only lost mom, they lost their two biggest allies. My parents refused to parent by today's standards. If I heard them say "back in my day kids played in the yard, nobody went to camp or someshit" one more time, I'd have offed myself. My parents felt trapped by the job being 24/7- the vast majority of their friends moved on and stopped including them. Plus they were trying to grieve and had no down time in which to just process things.

It never got better. They barely have a relationship now.

ETA: I chose my niece once she was old enough. I chose someone else to be trustee of the estate. 

At one time DH and I were named guardians for 5 different kids; Thank God they've all aged out and still have healthy parents.

[themoneytree]

H and I are on the same page and don't have differing wishes for guardian so that makes things easier at least.

[luvvy]

H and I don't have a specific guardian(s) picked out for G because no one is a perfect fit. We are running on the assumption that we will be alive and well long enough that if something does happen, SS will be adult enough to take on his little brother. (For reference he is 20 but would never place that on him until he was stable and able.)

[UnderProtest]

We picked friends instead of family because the friends have stuck through us through the years and have made an effort to see us. We know that their parenting styles are much closer than my husband's brother and his wife and that they will make every effort that BOTH families would still have access to our kids. At this point, they are overseas (we moved away from everyone), but we can easily communicate and foster that relationship via FaceTime.

I definitely vote your cousin, but you and your husband need to decide together.

[trafficgirl]

auntie - that's an interesting perspective that hadn't really occurred to me.

We also need to get a will drawn up and guardianship decided in the event of our deaths. My parents see the boys every week (they watch them on Mondays) and H's parents see them maybe once a month. My parents are still in decent health, FIL is also but MIL isn't so much.

We've thought about listing my parents up to a certain age, then listing someone else after that. However I have no idea who. My brother is 32 and single and not really into kids - he both plays computer games all the time and designs them for a living. H's (older) brother has a family with 3 kids, but one has autism and will need at least minimal support likely the rest of his life, while the second had health issues that could pop up again. We could choose one of our friends but that feels kind of weird. Or maybe one of my cousins?

themoneytree - so basically I'm in a similar spot to you. It's rough.

[olive]

We have chosen my cousin and his wife as our guardians should anything happen to both DH and I. It was a difficult decision because both sets of grandparents are amazing and local but they are getting older and it would definitely be a stress on them to handle two little girls. My brother is out and H's sister is out. My cousin and his wife are great and have two little ones my girls' age. They were happy to accept the job when we asked. My girls would have to move a couple hours away but would be in a small town with other relatives of mine.

That said, we are hoping that we will be able to transfer guardianship to my BIL in the future. He was young at the time we did up our wills but he has now settled down and he and his GF have a sweet little baby. If that situation remains stable over the next few years, we will consider transferring guardianship to them.

It's tough when there is no obvious or easy choice.

[cbwm1]

Jan 14, 2015 15:55:08 GMT -5 Jermys said:

For my kids, it's either going to be MWOS, cbwm1, or frkls. My family is crazy or too far away, H's family is too old, and I want someone who would honor our openness with their first families.

You're our backups. Don't know if you knew that. If not, you know now.

[Captain Serious]

We had named my BIL and his wife, but are changing it because of her sleeping with her priest in our house and not showing the slightest bit of remorse.

The problem is, we don't have anyone else we are comfortable with. We'd like to designate my brother and his wife, but a religious upbringing is important to us, and they won't do that. In the end, we'll likely go with them, but I can't make that decision right now, while I'm still hurting and angry over one failed attempt at finding suitable guardians. We also each have friends we'd be okay designating, but they live far away, and given or boys' history of loss, we'd like it to be someone they know well.

So for now, we've decided to name my parents, just for 6 months or a year, while we figure this all out. It's not a perfect situation, but it removes my SIL, and also means she'll have no chance of getting her hands on any of our life insurance money, either.

[themoneytree]

So we had the appointment and it went well.
We named my cousin.

The attorney had an interesting point about designating MIL. He mentioned that if her health isn't great it's a risk that a young child ends up becoming a care giver to a much older guardian. So that made it much easier to rule her out because I could totally see that happening.

So now we just need to designate a backup guardian and a trustee. The trustee seems super hard as well because they control all the money and can help make visitation decisions, etc. It's a powerful position and it's really hard to pick for that too.
He's drawing it up now so we need to make some more decisions.

Thanks for the input!! : )

[trafficgirl]

themoneytree - can the trustee and the guardian not be the same person? Or is that a bad idea?

I'm getting confused.