I believe that too. I think it was an accident - a training exercise went horribly wrong.
I also feel pretty confident that Flight 93 was shot down.
Except some of the passengers called their loved ones and told them they were going to fight back.
Yeah but there were some very weird things about those calls. Who calls their mother and introduces themselves by their first and last name??
Even if so, there's no evidence they actually made it into the flight deck. And I just don't think the military would (or should) have just let that plane go and done nothing, knowing what the hijackers intentions were.
Except some of the passengers called their loved ones and told them they were going to fight back.
Yeah but there were some very weird things about those calls. Who calls their mother and introduces themselves by their first and last name??
Even if so, there's no evidence they actually made it into the flight deck. And I just don't think the military would (or should) have just let that plane go and done nothing, knowing what the hijackers intentions were.
I'm not sure of the exact timeline, but I think people underestimate the time it takes to scramble jets to get up, catch up to a plane, and shoot it down. It's not like there are military pilots sitting in a room all day just waiting to run out to the flight line and hop in a jet. It doesn't work that way. I estimate it would take at least 45 minutes from the time the order was given to get the jet in the air, then time to catch up to the plane and shoot it down. I'd have to look up the timelines before I decide if I can believe this.
I believe that too. I think it was an accident - a training exercise went horribly wrong.
I also feel pretty confident that Flight 93 was shot down.
Except some of the passengers called their loved ones and told them they were going to fight back.
I don't feel strongly about this theory but the plane could have been shot down after those phone calls.
As for my own tinfoil hat theories, the only one is JFK. I don't know what exactly happened but I don't believe the Warren Commission. But lots of other people don't either so this isn't an unusual conspiracy theory.
Weren't the families of the flight 93 passengers allowed to listen to the cockpit voice recorder? I seem to recall they were, and that it was fairly clear as to what was going on in the last moments.
Yeah but there were some very weird things about those calls. Who calls their mother and introduces themselves by their first and last name??
Even if so, there's no evidence they actually made it into the flight deck. And I just don't think the military would (or should) have just let that plane go and done nothing, knowing what the hijackers intentions were.
I'm not sure of the exact timeline, but I think people underestimate the time it takes to scramble jets to get up, catch up to a plane, and shoot it down. It's not like there are military pilots sitting in a room all day just waiting to run out to the flight line and hop in a jet. It doesn't work that way. I estimate it would take at least 45 minutes from the time the order was given to get the jet in the air, then time to catch up to the plane and shoot it down. I'd have to look up the timelines before I decide if I can believe this.
They had been scrambled from Andrews AFB and were, at a minimum in route when it happened.
Yeah but there were some very weird things about those calls. Who calls their mother and introduces themselves by their first and last name??
Even if so, there's no evidence they actually made it into the flight deck. And I just don't think the military would (or should) have just let that plane go and done nothing, knowing what the hijackers intentions were.
I'm not sure of the exact timeline, but I think people underestimate the time it takes to scramble jets to get up, catch up to a plane, and shoot it down. It's not like there are military pilots sitting in a room all day just waiting to run out to the flight line and hop in a jet. It doesn't work that way. I estimate it would take at least 45 minutes from the time the order was given to get the jet in the air, then time to catch up to the plane and shoot it down. I'd have to look up the timelines before I decide if I can believe this.
I thought I remembered reading firsthand accounts from the pilots that were sent to track Flight 93. I believe it was a woman. There were jets following it for sure.
Post by Velar Fricative on Jul 15, 2015 21:38:38 GMT -5
The hijacking of flight 93 began at 9:28 am and the plane hit the ground at 10:03 am. But the recorder was on until the last moments when the hijackers were talking about "putting down" the plane.
I'm not sure of the exact timeline, but I think people underestimate the time it takes to scramble jets to get up, catch up to a plane, and shoot it down. It's not like there are military pilots sitting in a room all day just waiting to run out to the flight line and hop in a jet. It doesn't work that way. I estimate it would take at least 45 minutes from the time the order was given to get the jet in the air, then time to catch up to the plane and shoot it down. I'd have to look up the timelines before I decide if I can believe this.
I thought I remembered reading firsthand accounts from the pilots that were sent to track Flight 93. I believe it was a woman. There were jets following it for sure.
Jets were ordered scrambled and were in the air, but not anywhere near the plane yet. I don't think they could have made it, based on where there were jets stationed to scramble, how long it takes to get one in the air, and the fact that there were only 33 minutes from the time anyone knew the plane was being hijacked until it crashed.
Post by anastasia517 on Jul 15, 2015 21:42:36 GMT -5
I believe in all the things.
Well, not really. But I am not immediately opposed to things nor do I believe the "official story" on things just because the government says so. I think this was a result of studying history and the kind of disturbing things that were approved by governments over time. Some of the disbelief in official stories is pretty popular though (ex. JFK's assassination).
I think somebody has to know with a decent level of certainty what happened to Malaysia Airlines 370 but isn't saying for one reason or another. (And, other than Olympics stuff, this was one of the first things I really got into on this board.)
I thought I remembered reading firsthand accounts from the pilots that were sent to track Flight 93. I believe it was a woman. There were jets following it for sure.
Jets were ordered scrambled and were in the air, but not anywhere near the plane yet. I don't think they could have made it, based on where there were jets stationed to scramble, how long it takes to get one in the air, and the fact that there were only 33 minutes from the time anyone knew the plane was being hijacked until it crashed.
I just reread it and you're right. I remembered it wrong.
I thought I remembered reading firsthand accounts from the pilots that were sent to track Flight 93. I believe it was a woman. There were jets following it for sure.
Jets were ordered scrambled and were in the air, but not anywhere near the plane yet. I don't think they could have made it, based on where there were jets stationed to scramble, how long it takes to get one in the air, and the fact that there were only 33 minutes from the time anyone knew the plane was being hijacked until it crashed.
I'm looking for proof of this, but I thought I was certain that Andrews always had F16s on standby and could scramble I'm under 10 mins.
Jets were ordered scrambled and were in the air, but not anywhere near the plane yet. I don't think they could have made it, based on where there were jets stationed to scramble, how long it takes to get one in the air, and the fact that there were only 33 minutes from the time anyone knew the plane was being hijacked until it crashed.
I'm looking for proof of this, but I thought I was certain that Andrews always had F16s on standby and could scramble I'm under 10 mins.
This is possible given that it's Andrews. I know several F16 pilots, but none that have been stationed at Andrews. If that is the case, then I guess the timeline does match up, since UA93 crashed 20 minutes from Washington, plus 10 minutes to scramble jets = about the 33/35 minutes between hijacking and crash.
now all I'm finding is conspiracy theory sites, but the ones "proving" the gov was behind the whole thing. I could be misremembering, but I thought I remembered they saying there was another plane, F16s were flying, and thinking "I hope they get it!"
So it's possible I'm remembering what I though should have happened at the time. As you all have discussed here many times, memory is not 100%. I guess what I know for sure was also my 3 day living in DC after moving from the rural south, and there were F16s flying cover over the city all night.
Well, not really. But I am not immediately opposed to things nor do I believe the "official story" on things just because the government says so. I think this was a result of studying history and the kind of disturbing things that were approved by governments over time. Some of the disbelief in official stories is pretty popular though (ex. JFK's assassination).
I think somebody has to know with a decent level of certainty what happened to Malaysia Airlines 370 but isn't saying for one reason or another. (And, other than Olympics stuff, this was one of the first things I really got into on this board.)
There was that one article about the MH370 Kazakhstan theory that was intriguing. I'm too lazy to look for it right now. Sadly, I do think the plane is in the bottom of the ocean somewhere.
Or, in a Hail Mary attempt to win out over Beijing for the 2022 Olympics in a couple of weeks, the Almaty folks might whip out MH370 and be like, "We may not have the Olympic infrastructure but we found the missing plane!!!"
Not a great site, but I think some of the cites are correct. Per this, they started arming at 9:03 and were ordered in the air after the pentagon was hit. And the 10 minutes I have in my head is after arming...
http://www.911myths.*com/index.*php/Andrews_*Air_Force_Base (remove the *s)
I studied this in one of my social justice classes. The reasoning some people think the government wanted him dead was because his movement was transitioning from racial equality to ending poverty. He was scheduled to give a speech about ending poverty, particularly among black people, the day after he was killed.
Not a great site, but I think some of the cites are correct. Per this, they started arming at 9:03 and were ordered in the air after the pentagon was hit. And the 10 minutes I have in my head is after arming...
http://www.911myths.*com/index.*php/Andrews_*Air_Force_Base (remove the *s)
It says the arming takes 3 hours, but maybe they could have gotten it done in 45 minutes. It also directly contradicts pretty much everything in the WaPo article linked upthread. I'm more inclined to believe that the WaPo article is PR fluff BS, but your link makes no mention of launching unarmed F16s with the intention of taking down UA93 kamikaze-style.
I believe that FDR knew that Pearl Harbor was going to happen, and when, and still let the tragedy occur to get us into WWII.
I wouldn't be shocked. He wanted us in the U.S. public opinion was coming around but at a snails space and England was in the midst of the Blitz/Battle of Britain and how long they could hold out was unclear. It solved a very big problem for him.
I studied this in one of my social justice classes. The reasoning some people think the government wanted him dead was because his movement was transitioning from racial equality to ending poverty. He was scheduled to give a speech about ending poverty, particularly among black people, the day after he was killed.
Yeah, but in 2015 still, look at how many crazy racist motherfuckers own guns. I think the simplest explanation is likely to be true here.
I mostly agree. But as "dangerous" as Dr King was to the status quo it does make me question it a bit. And from a sociological perspective it can be a convincing argument.
I believe that FDR knew that Pearl Harbor was going to happen, and when, and still let the tragedy occur to get us into WWII.
That's a pretty big gamble to make on the entire Pacific fleet. That's like some House of Cards level conspiracy.
Except they had and were pulling a lot of the pacific fleet for use in the Atlantic so the pacific fleet was well below full strength And it actually didn't do that much damage most of the ships were repaired and back in service within 6 months to a year. A gamble but the torpedoes the Japanese were using had been modified for the shallow port and hadn't been used before so a bit of banking on it being imperfect wouldn't be unheard of. And he may have weighed that against the war we'd be fighting alone if Britain fell and we were dragged into a war with them on our own after the Brits collapsed. Again I don't know if I believe this theory but I wouldn't be shocked if it was true.
Not a great site, but I think some of the cites are correct. Per this, they started arming at 9:03 and were ordered in the air after the pentagon was hit. And the 10 minutes I have in my head is after arming...
http://www.911myths.*com/index.*php/Andrews_*Air_Force_Base (remove the *s)
It says the arming takes 3 hours, but maybe they could have gotten it done in 45 minutes. It also directly contradicts pretty much everything in the WaPo article linked upthread. I'm more inclined to believe that the WaPo article is PR fluff BS, but your link makes no mention of launching unarmed F16s with the intention of taking down UA93 kamikaze-style.
Yeah, I don't know. I can't find anything reputable tonight and I need sleep. Maybe I'll read the 911 commission report tomorrow. Or just go back to saying it's what happened bc it just had to be!