@ Homework Question

[tres3]

How much homework do you think is appropriate for a 4th grader? 

We are really struggling with this and he even has homework over the weekend although teacher said it isn't due until Tuesday....

I've already had a conference with the teacher. We are in tears every night (not just my kid... me too).

DS1 didn't have this much homework in 4th grade he only had a math worksheet with usually less than 10 problems that took him no time, study for the Friday spelling test and reading for 20 min every night. 

DS2 is really struggling. He's a very different kid and unlike DS1 he's going to have to study all week for the spelling test on Friday, not just Friday morning. We haven't even started spelling words yet which is why I'm so scared.  He has science reading and short questions to answer this weekend. He's been sitting doing them for over 45 min already and he's answered only 2 questions out of 10.  His IEP says he can type but these are all fill in the blank sheets. 

We use the weekends to try to get our 20 minutes of reading done for the week so we just have to focus on the other stuff, but now we have this to deal with too. 

I like his teachers and his team, but I left the meeting upset that their goal is to prepare him for middle school. How about we prepare him for 5th grade???  

My 5th grader hasn't brought home any homework  except bring in a picture of himself to school. 

[tres3]

I should add, I'm really frustrated that so far all of his homework seems to be in the format of the state test. Why are we prepping for the test the first week of school?

[irishbride2]

Only twenty minutes of reading a week? That seems low to me.

[katfco]

The general rule of thumb is 10 minutes per grade, so in 4th grade, he could reasonably have as much as 40 minutes worth, including reading time.

If the IEP says he can type, the teacher needs to provide a way to accommodate that. Maybe he can type his answers on a different paper? This is especially important if the writing is causing him additional stress.

As for it being in the state test format, it depends on the school and curriculum why that is. It's possible the curriculum is set up that way to make sure they're comfortable with the format, or, because the first weeks of school are often pretests, it won't stay that way.

[IIOY]

Ask me in a month. We don't start school until 9/10. ::tears::

[tres3]

Aug 16, 2015 17:00:43 GMT -5 irishbride2 said:

Only twenty minutes of reading a week? That seems low to me.

a night.. we just try to cram as many minutes as we can on the weekend so if we have to we can skip reading

[irishbride2]

Aug 16, 2015 17:05:13 GMT -5 tres3 said:

Aug 16, 2015 17:00:43 GMT -5 irishbride2 said:

Only twenty minutes of reading a week? That seems low to me.

a night.. we just try to cram as many minutes as we can on the weekend so if we have to we can skip reading

Ahh y s twenty a night is more the norm.

[mominatrix]

Yeah. Our school uses the 10 min per grade guideline, but reading (20 mins/night) is additional.

I think that's reasonable, and I'd be OK with more if it were in prep for a big project / science fair / etc.

[cinco]

I have heard the 10 minutes per grade as well, but I kind of feel 40 minutes would be a lot for my 4th grader. I think the 30 minute range is good. I don't mind extra reading on top of that if they can pick the reading material.

We start next week, so I'm unsure what DD's teacher will give. She had an hour in 2nd and about 15 minutes in 3rd. So much for consistency among the different teachers. DS had maybe 10 minutes in K, and zero in 1st. ZERO. I loved it.

[IIOY]

Aug 16, 2015 17:12:45 GMT -5 cinco said:

We start next week, so I'm unsure what DD's teacher will give. She had an hour in 2nd and about 15 minutes in 3rd. So much for consistency among the different teachers. DS had maybe 10 minutes in K, and zero in 1st. ZERO. I loved it.

DD had probably a good 60-70 minutes/night in second grade and perhaps 20 minutes/night in third. DS had 20 minutes/night in second grade on a bad night. In talking to other parents, second grade seems to be a wild card depending upon teacher, while third seems pretty consistently low stress.

[tres3]

Aug 16, 2015 17:26:00 GMT -5 jenny1980 said:

You personally are crying every night during homework? Can someone else help your son? This doesn't seem like a good dynamic.

It is not a good family dynamic. My option is to spend $50/hr to hire a tutor but at the rate he's going on his homework it could end up costing me $2k/mo in tutor fees. 

[hopecounts]

40 minutes a night would be the typical rec.
Enforce the IEP, if it says he can type then his teacher needs to provide the work in a format that allows that.
(Perhaps he types the worksheet title and then the # and answer)
But she needs to provide the required accommodation.

[taratru]

40 minutes is pretty standard for 4th grade, and splitting it up might help for most kids. Personally, I feel that starting to prep kids for increased loads in middle school can easily start in 4th grade. But I'd be screaming about his IEP and the accommodations that he should be getting. And is it maybe time to revisit the IEP?

[tres3]

DS just spent 2 hours reading a sheet about how precipitation works and then answering 15 short answer questions about it.

[StrawberryBlondie]

I think I had around an hour of homework a night in 4th grade.

This was about 25 years ago.

[UMaineTeach]

Our 4th grade has a lot of homework. Like 30 math problems, 20 minutes of reading, plus whatever random science/SS they didn't finish in class.

I think it's time for an IEP to modify assignments, or just get the teacher to do it without the IEP. Common is writing the child may have either 50% more time or 50% fewer problems.

I also think that if he read for 10 minutes a day that would be better than cramming all weekend. The goal is usually to build a daily habit.

For the reading with comprehension questions, can you read it to him, so he sees and hears the words correctly and fluently, then read it again trading paragraphs? You can preview the questions and then think aloud while you read. "I'm wondering why..." "I think it's neat that..."

[oscarnerdjulief]

I'd definitely follow up with the IEP issue with typing. I would think there's technology available at school. As a teacher, I know that I prefer students turning in work in typed form, especially if it's through Google Docs or Classroom where it can be kept.

I can't speak to the homework question because it varies so much based on the class and the teacher. I personally don't give a lot of homework for a variety of reasons, chief among them the fact that we have class sets, not individual copies of novels and textbooks. I never give homework on weekends. Kids who really like to read get rewards for doing AR (Accel. Reader); I've had some read about 10 books and get 180 points or more.

I would say the teacher is putting a lot of the work in the test format so that kids can get used to it. Sometimes kids need to be taught a new way of thinking just to complete the test because the questions are not written like anything they've seen in the past. That was true in the past with our PARCC questions because there was a general Part A question and then B where evidence had to be cited. If you got A wrong, you couldn't get credit for B no matter what. Also, unfortunately, if a teacher's livelihood is 50% based on a standardized test like it is in our state, you're darn right a teacher's going to teach to the test so she doesn't get labeled ineffective and lose the job.

[katfco]

Aug 16, 2015 18:42:40 GMT -5 tres3 said:

DS just spent 2 hours reading a sheet about how precipitation works and then answering 15 short answer questions about it.

I don't know for what reason he needs his IEP, but fourth grade is when things become very content-heavy, and even typically-developing kids can struggle. If appropriate I'd request content accommodations as well. 

[eclaires]

I've heard the rule of 10 minutes per grade. I know it varies by teacher at our school. Jackson's teacher gives no homework (3rd) but his best friend from last year has homework every day except Wednesday and I hear it's pretty intense. Jackson's teacher said she specifically likes the kids to have lives outside of school and time for activities. Well and they have 20 minutes reading each night (suggested) and they get spelling words Monday.

Because Jackson has very minimal homework we are making him type each day after school. My understanding is they have to type for the test or at least some of them which will be a learning curve for him I think.

His GT pull out starts in the next few weeks so he may have homework for that? Idk.

[frlcb]

Aug 16, 2015 19:09:43 GMT -5 eclaires said:

I've heard the rule of 10 minutes per grade. I know it varies by teacher at our school. Jackson's teacher gives no homework (3rd) but his best friend from last year has homework every day except Wednesday and I hear it's pretty intense. Jackson's teacher said she specifically likes the kids to have lives outside of school and time for activities. Well and they have 20 minutes reading each night (suggested) and they get spelling words Monday.

Because Jackson has very minimal homework we are making him type each day after school. My understanding is they have to type for the test or at least some of them which will be a learning curve for him I think.

His GT pull out starts in the next few weeks so he may have homework for that? Idk.

Your son's teacher is awesome. I can only dream that our school would give up homework. It is such a waste.

My second grader gets a packet of homework on Monday and it is due on Friday. We get our first one tomorrow so no idea how much it is. Lats year in first his homework took maybe 5 minutes. He is a voracious reader on his own so we never really practice reading with him.

[eclaires]

Aug 16, 2015 19:46:16 GMT -5 frlcb said:

Aug 16, 2015 19:09:43 GMT -5 eclaires said:

I've heard the rule of 10 minutes per grade. I know it varies by teacher at our school. Jackson's teacher gives no homework (3rd) but his best friend from last year has homework every day except Wednesday and I hear it's pretty intense. Jackson's teacher said she specifically likes the kids to have lives outside of school and time for activities. Well and they have 20 minutes reading each night (suggested) and they get spelling words Monday.

Because Jackson has very minimal homework we are making him type each day after school. My understanding is they have to type for the test or at least some of them which will be a learning curve for him I think.

His GT pull out starts in the next few weeks so he may have homework for that? Idk.

Your son's teacher is awesome. I can only dream that our school would give up homework. It is such a waste.

My second grader gets a packet of homework on Monday and it is due on Friday. We get our first one tomorrow so no idea how much it is. Lats year in first his homework took maybe 5 minutes. He is a voracious reader on his own so we never really practice reading with him.

Homework is pretty worthless, IMO, so I'm in love with his teacher.  I'm pretty sure she is the teacher to have - everyone loves her and she seems like she is great at her job, too.

Jackson reads a lot, generally, so I don't really follow the 20 minutes per night.  He read for over an hour (maybe close to 2) today on his own with no prompting from us.  We're supposed to initial that they read on their agenda, but I have zero problem fudging it since he reads so much if we have a busy night.  His 2nd grade homework was a packet, but it was basically two pages - sentences with his spelling words/grammar lessons for the week and a math sheet.  It took probably a total of 20 minutes if he wasn't being lazy with his sentences and handwriting.

[erbear]

I'm a teacher and I subscribe to the no more than 10 minutes per grade rule. So in 4th, no more than 40 minutes worth, tops (even that seems like a lot to me). If he's not done, I'd mark where 40 minutes got him and let the teacher know. Either he needs help, or the assignment needs tweaking.

I fucking hate homework. I teach 7th and 8th (history) and the only hw I assign is reading, since the time it takes kids to do in school is so variable that it would be impossible to do during class.

[frlcb]

Aug 16, 2015 19:52:29 GMT -5 eclaires said:

Aug 16, 2015 19:46:16 GMT -5 frlcb said:

Your son's teacher is awesome. I can only dream that our school would give up homework. It is such a waste.

My second grader gets a packet of homework on Monday and it is due on Friday. We get our first one tomorrow so no idea how much it is. Lats year in first his homework took maybe 5 minutes. He is a voracious reader on his own so we never really practice reading with him.

Homework is pretty worthless, IMO, so I'm in love with his teacher.  I'm pretty sure she is the teacher to have - everyone loves her and she seems like she is great at her job, too.

Jackson reads a lot, generally, so I don't really follow the 20 minutes per night.  He read for over an hour (maybe close to 2) today on his own with no prompting from us.  We're supposed to initial that they read on their agenda, but I have zero problem fudging it since he reads so much if we have a busy night.  His 2nd grade homework was a packet, but it was basically two pages - sentences with his spelling words/grammar lessons for the week and a math sheet.  It took probably a total of 20 minutes if he wasn't being lazy with his sentences and handwriting.

That sounds like my son, he just reads cause he loves it, which is great for us because we don't have to pressure him. I hope our packet is as easy. It just is silly - if they understand the work then why do worksheets at home, and if they don't they should be getting help at school. 

[dropitlikeitshott]

Have you talked to his teacher? If he has an iep I would give him and alternative assignment or at least lesson the amount. To me homework isn't worth ruining a families daily life over. I do expect students to read nightly, but other than that we have very little homework.

[UMaineTeach]

Aug 16, 2015 20:16:20 GMT -5 frlcb said:

Aug 16, 2015 19:52:29 GMT -5 eclaires said:

Homework is pretty worthless, IMO, so I'm in love with his teacher.  I'm pretty sure she is the teacher to have - everyone loves her and she seems like she is great at her job, too.

Jackson reads a lot, generally, so I don't really follow the 20 minutes per night.  He read for over an hour (maybe close to 2) today on his own with no prompting from us.  We're supposed to initial that they read on their agenda, but I have zero problem fudging it since he reads so much if we have a busy night.  His 2nd grade homework was a packet, but it was basically two pages - sentences with his spelling words/grammar lessons for the week and a math sheet.  It took probably a total of 20 minutes if he wasn't being lazy with his sentences and handwriting.

That sounds like my son, he just reads cause he loves it, which is great for us because we don't have to pressure him. I hope our packet is as easy. It just is silly - if they understand the work then why do worksheets at home, and if they don't they should be getting help at school. 

because I don't have time or extra staff. I'm already individualizing and mass customizing my brains out. I cannot do it all. I need help from home, especially for kids who need to make more than a year's gains in a year.

I hope your packet isn't easy. or hard. I hope it's at your child's instructional level, so it doesn't waste your time. If it's easy, I'm giving you internet permission to 1. not do it 2. meet with the teacher about what your kid needs to learn

[downtoearth]

I'll check back in on this later since I have a 4th grader starting in a week and a half, but that would kill ME as the parent for a kid to spend hours on a worksheet and 15 questions. Worksheets suck donkey balls IMO and tell kids basically nothing. If the homework isn't graded, I would put a time limit of like 40 min per night and just return with a note each day. But if they make him miss recess or complete at school that won't work (which a lot of teachers do.)

[EnchantedSoul]

DS1 is entering 5th grade next year so 4th grade is still pretty fresh. He had hours of homework, every night. I think some students probably got through it in an hour or so but it takes him a little longer. I was shocked at the daily math, spelling, reading etc then weekly assignments and monthly "contracts". On top of this, weekly online work. It's nuts. They are only 9 yr olds for crying out loud.

In regards to the IEP, I'd ask if he can type out his answers and staple them to the original worksheet for submission. I have also had teachers whom I've worked with, accept half an assignment if the student demonstrates knowledge of the work.

Teachers don't want their students struggling with homework and realize that it also becomes a burden for you. I hope you find a solution soon. I can certainly commiserate.

[frlcb]

Aug 16, 2015 20:38:10 GMT -5 UMaineTeach said:

Aug 16, 2015 20:16:20 GMT -5 frlcb said:

That sounds like my son, he just reads cause he loves it, which is great for us because we don't have to pressure him. I hope our packet is as easy. It just is silly - if they understand the work then why do worksheets at home, and if they don't they should be getting help at school. 

because I don't have time or extra staff. I'm already individualizing and mass customizing my brains out. I cannot do it all. I need help from home, especially for kids who need to make more than a year's gains in a year.

I hope your packet isn't easy. or hard. I hope it's at your child's instructional level, so it doesn't waste your time. If it's easy, I'm giving you internet permission to 1. not do it 2. meet with the teacher about what your kid needs to learn

I understand your point but i feel differently. If my kid doesn't understand something then I believe the first step should be help from his teachers. If that doesn't work then we will tackle it outside of school. It is simply my belief that homework isn't necessary. I have zero issues with projects or reading or book reports.

[matildasun]

Aug 16, 2015 16:35:16 GMT -5 tres3 said:

He has science reading and short questions to answer this weekend. He's been sitting doing them for over 45 min already and he's answered only 2 questions out of 10.  His IEP says he can type but these are all fill in the blank sheets.

I would write his answers for him on this type of assignment. If he is struggling to write then he isn't focusing on the content, which in my opinion is more important than practicing writing in this instance.

[bugandbibs]

I'm of the opinion that homework is a a waste of time. An exception might be working on a project or doing a research paper.

For DD1 we have found a good way to balence. I read her text out loud and then she answers the question. Everything is typed unless it is a fill in the blank type sheet. For longer assignments she uses a dictation program to type for her. Sometimes we make a choice to skip assignments all together.