Intro and some questions

[nextbigthing]

Hi,

They sent me over from MMM and I'm an old MM and GP vet that's been around since the Nest days.

I've been married 11 years and last week I came home to my husband watching our 15 month old son who had to stay home from school with a fever.  H was drunk and after two hours I got him to admit drinking vodka all afternoon.  I made him call his sister to come get him and I haven't seen him since (tomorrow will be a week).

I'm filing for divorce this week.  This was the last straw.   He's begging me to let him come back, he is starting therapy, blah blah blah.  I'm done.  He's been a liar and a loser our entire marriage with drinking, eating (he is an emotional eater), he can't keep a job for more than a few months, lazy, blah blah blah.  I've been supporting him for years and putting up with this crap.

Here's my problem.  Friends and my parents keep trying to get me to try to work it out.  I keep telling them that they don't know the whole story and to be honest I don't want to tell everyone the whole story, it's embarrassing for me and him.  I just want support.

My dad whom I adore called me yesterday and said that he would support me no matter what but he really wanted me to try to work it out. Said there aren't a ton of good guys out there and that my H is a good guy.  I told him that he doesn't know everything.  DH is secretive and has lied to me our entire marriage.

I know I'm rambling, I just know that if I try to make this work I'll waste another year of my life trying to make it work then end up in the same place.


I'm in touch with a therapist and setting up an appointment this week.  I make all the money and hold all the cards, I just am hoping that I can tell H I plan to file then we can work it out in a civil matter so things don't get too ugly.


Any advice or commiseration would be greatly appreciated.  I'm struggling because I'm getting more "are you sure you can't make it work?" than I am "we're here for you, you're better off without him" and it's messing with my head.

Questions:
1.  How do I tell him I'm filing?
2.  When do I let him back in to get stuff, etc?
3.  Am I wrong to think we can work this out amicably to divide up stuff?
4.  What do I do about custody stuff, etc?  I don't want him alone with DS until the drinking is fixed.

ETA:  I do have a lawyer in place, I met with yesterday and am happy with.  She told me to call when I'm ready to file.

Thanks

[doriswe]

If you're done, you're done. You don't need to justify it to anyone.

1. If you're civil-ish, I'd just tell him you're filing. I'd opt to on the phone or in a public place, just in case there's dramatics.
2. I would set a date/time for him to get his stuff and then make sure there is a trusted person there to supervise.
3. It can happen. I did it with my XH. But I don't know your H. Try to have the conversation with him and see where it goes. If he can't agree, have your lawyer manage it.
4. I think you need to get a lawyer in place for this. I'm not sure one drunk day is enough for supervised visits, but I could be wrong. Plus it's your work against his, kwim? I'd talk to the lawyer about how to approach this.

[housewife]

"Sometimes the people around you won't understand you journey. They don't need to, it's not for them."  <- maybe that's super lame, but it helped me so much when I felt I needed to explain to people my decision to leave. 


1. I just told H I couldn't do it anymore and was done. By that point he was just as done, so there was no fight or argument about it. 

2. Set a time and don't be alone when he comes or don't be there at all have someone else supervise. 

3. I have had a very amicable split. We agreed on every thing from splitting up money to the kids schedules. The first 3-4 months we were both pretty emotionally charged and I was probably a bitch more often than I should have been. I've taken to talking to him like he's another parent on the soccer field and not my ex. It's helped me navigate the new boundaries of our relationship. 

4. I have no idea here. We were able to agree on an arrangement, but neither one of us had safety concerns about them being unsupervised with the other. I would ask a lawyer on how to proceed there.

[doriswe]

Jun 14, 2016 11:29:52 GMT -5 housewife said:

3. I have had a very amicable split. We agreed on every thing from splitting up money to the kids schedules. The first 3-4 months we were both pretty emotionally charged and I was probably a bitch more often than I should have been. I've taken to talking to him like he's another parent on the soccer field and not my ex. It's helped me navigate the new boundaries of our relationship. 

Oh yeah, all of this! I know the first few months I reacted out of emotion vs. the best interest of DS. Now I see my relationship with XH as a business partner. We are in the business of raising DS and I don't bring emotions to work with me, why would I let them in my relationship with XH. Changing how I see our relationship has helped immensely.  There are still hot button issues, but since we communicate (mostly) through email, I take a day to think it out, process, run it by others and then respond to just the issue with DS and not the drama XH is trying to stir up.

[Deleted]

So for the friends and family trying to get you to work it out just put this on repeat "I would like for you to support my decision on divorce. It's a choice that I have not made lightly." And then cut them off. I'm sorry that the people who are supposed to be your support system are being crappy.


Questions:

1. How do I tell him I'm filing?
You can just get him served. You don't need to tell him if you don't want. If you are texting or talking I would just say "I have decided on divorce and I hope you will cooperate and co-parent with me so we can be the best parents possible for DS."
2. When do I let him back in to get stuff, etc?
I would ask your lawyer. I would have a family friend at the house and tell him to come by and pick the stuff up from this time to this time and you must be sober.
3. Am I wrong to think we can work this out amicably to divide up stuff?
I don't think so. I had a no contact order against my XH and we still were able to divide things with ease. No court. No mediation. We just took what we wanted and walked away. It was spelled out in our paperwork that we had already divided property and whatever was in our possession was ours. We had no debt (consumer, car notes, nor mortgage). 
4. What do I do about custody stuff, etc? I don't want him alone with DS until the drinking is fixed.
I would discuss this with your lawyer. Express your concerns about this. Your lawyer is paid to advise you and help you navigate tough issues like this. We have a few ladies that deal with XH and substance abuse. Each case is different. But it immediately needs to be discussed with your lawyer to put a temporary custody order in place.

[jojoandleo]

For number 3-I have seen super easy agreeable divorces, and I have seen divorces that take YEARS to finalize due to fighting. I have also seen agreed to divorces turn into a mess, and messy divorces turn out very simple. It is totally possible to have an easy, agreed to divorce, BUT it is not something you can do on your own. No matter how agreeable you are willing to be, doesn't mean your ex will be.

Take my sister-divorce was agreed to, easy. Her ex refuses to pay child support. She takes him to court EVER. FUCKING. YEAR. This means, homeboy has to pay interest, but he still does it, just to be a dick. And EVERY. DAMN. YEAR. He tries to tell the judge he isn't going to pay child support because my sister did XYZ (which isn't how CS works). EVERY YEAR, he threatens to take her to court for custody. He told my sister to "enjoy prison" when she took her daughter on a cruise (during her time). My sister never takes his bait. She always responds professionally, but it will never make her ex stop acting like a complete asshat.

[marylennox]

I just wanted to commiserate about the comments from family as I received similar from several of mine. A lot of "we're praying for the resolution of your marriage," praying for H to change and turn his life around (even if he did, I wouldn't reconcile), "you never know, things can change, miracles can happen," etc. I think they meant well, but I found it insulting, almost. I just didn't really even respond to them, unless to thank people for support. People on the outside can make all the comments they want but you know yourself, your relationship and what you need to do.

[1confused1]

Welcome and sorry you are here.


1. How do I tell him I'm filing?
 Just tell him if you think it's necessary.  I told my now xh on the phone (we were already separated).  


2. When do I let him back in to get stuff, etc?
I let xh come back in to get his stuff when I had someone with me (my dad) and the kids were not home.  My divorce is not at all amicable and he called me some awful things during this process.


3. Am I wrong to think we can work this out amicably to divide up stuff?
 Not wrong, some people can.  My xh still hasn't accepted the fact that we are divorced (it's been 4 years).  But prepare yourself just in case you can't.


4. What do I do about custody stuff, etc? I don't want him alone with DS until the drinking is fixed.
 I would ask your attorney.  We had to go to mediation multiple times because we couldn't agree to a plan.  

[heywhat]

Doris gave you good advice.

I'll give you unsolicited advice about your family wanting you to work it out. My ex, on the exterior, seemed like a nice person. I covered for him, especially to my family because no one wants to admit they married a psycho/loser/drunk/whatever. It is also tricky to complain about a spouse if there are severe problems, because then your family might not forgive your spouse even if you work it out. I kept a lot from my family for that reason. When I chose to get divorced I came clean about everything that was going on, and the reasons I withheld that from my family. They were extremely supportive.

[dancelnow]

It is possible to keep it amicable, but hard. First you both have to want it to remain so (focus on your kid). It will take conscious effort to not give in to petty retorts because you will get frustrated and want to. But that will start a downward spiral.

Your lawyer can advise on custody because of the safety concern. I know he's demonstrated being drunk while the caregiver, but don't jump to withholding the child. You will have to make an effort to maintain that relationship for your child.

[dancelnow]

Oh and the family thing, I feel you. Mine is doing the same. I've just stopped discussing it with them. I'm not changing my mind and I need to surround myself with people who support me and want what's best for me long term.

[doglove]

I think you've already got a lot of good quality responses to your questions. I just wanted to add that you don't need to explain yourself or justify where you are emotionally/mentally with this relationship to anyone. No one else is in the relationship with you and no one is going to understand why it happened. The comment about good guys really irks me because what's the worst that could happen if you divorce? You find no one and live a perfectly happy life with yourself, your kid, friends and activities you enjoy? That sounds much more enjoyable than being stuck with someone who brings you down. The idea of being with someone forever or marriage is a social construct. We can choose to have that if we want or we can choose other paths for ourselves at NO DETRIMENT to ourselves.

Hugs.

ETA - and it's not like there are only 4 "good guys" left in the world for christsakes. 

[Deleted]

Jun 14, 2016 15:24:48 GMT -5 doglove said:

ETA - and it's not like there are only 4 "good guys" left in the world for christsakes. 

Yes, we are swimming in an ocean, not a fish tank. FWIW, I would rather be single forever than with my ex. I've never had the thought "Damn, I wish I hadn't gotten divorced". 

[bg]

I experienced some of the family thing too. My mom even said, "well maybe you'll get divorced and then get back together again - that happens sometimes." Um, no, just no.

[nextbigthing]

Jun 14, 2016 14:42:58 GMT -5 heywhat said:

Doris gave you good advice.

I'll give you unsolicited advice about your family wanting you to work it out. My ex, on the exterior, seemed like a nice person. I covered for him, especially to my family because no one wants to admit they married a psycho/loser/drunk/whatever. It is also tricky to complain about a spouse if there are severe problems, because then your family might not forgive your spouse even if you work it out. I kept a lot from my family for that reason. When I chose to get divorced I came clean about everything that was going on, and the reasons I withheld that from my family. They were extremely supportive.

This is exactly how I feel. Thank you for replying

[Deleted]

If your family and friends aren't supportive, then you need to just cut them off when they bring it up.  Tell them that only YOU live your life and know what is best.  And that's the truth.  You deserve happiness.

[flatlan]

You have gotten lots of great advice for your specific questions. I would like to address the comments that your family is making and you "covering" for a lot of the things that your h is doing. I completely understand the feeling that you need to save face. My XH is an alcoholic, and after several months of therapy, I understood that I no longer need to keep his secret. I don't blurt it out to random people or share unnecessary stories but I also don't shy away from it. It is very freeing.

[thedutchgirl]

I won't chime on your specific questions, but I will encourage you to read up a bit on codependency. I agree with flatlan. You don't need to keep his secrets any more, and his failings don't reflect on you. No need to overshare, but don't protect him any more either.

[nextbigthing]

Jun 14, 2016 20:02:24 GMT -5 @blueyes623 said:

If your family and friends aren't supportive, then you need to just cut them off when they bring it up.  Tell them that only YOU live your life and know what is best.  And that's the truth.  You deserve happiness.

I think the problem is that they're making me think. But I'm not thinking "do I still love him".

I'm thinking "man I hate the thought of not seeing DS every holiday" "man I hate the thought of not going to ILS super fun beach house". And stuff like that is a stupid reason to stay married.

I hate that I don't love him anymore, he's been gone a week and I don't miss him, I feel like that's pretty telling.

It's just lonely not to have my family's support, I may just have to tell them everything to make them get it.

[doglove]

Jun 14, 2016 16:11:28 GMT -5 @lemonlover said:

Jun 14, 2016 15:24:48 GMT -5 doglove said:

ETA - and it's not like there are only 4 "good guys" left in the world for christsakes. 

Yes, we are swimming in an ocean, not a fish tank. FWIW, I would rather be single forever than with my ex. I've never had the thought "Damn, I wish I hadn't gotten divorced". 

Never have I ever thought, I wish I was still in that marriage. EVER. Even since the minute I decided I was done. I have felt lonely and sad, but I am so much better off and in a much healthier place than I ever was with him. And I have this great relationship with myself now that I never had before.  

[asoctoberfalls]

Jun 14, 2016 14:42:58 GMT -5 heywhat said:

Doris gave you good advice.

I'll give you unsolicited advice about your family wanting you to work it out. My ex, on the exterior, seemed like a nice person. I covered for him, especially to my family because no one wants to admit they married a psycho/loser/drunk/whatever. It is also tricky to complain about a spouse if there are severe problems, because then your family might not forgive your spouse even if you work it out. I kept a lot from my family for that reason. When I chose to get divorced I came clean about everything that was going on, and the reasons I withheld that from my family. They were extremely supportive.

This is exactly my experience. My parents are very devout Christians, as am I. We don't believe in divorce, period. My H was just like you describe - seems like a nice person to outsiders (although that facade has started to crumble in recent years). I covered for him all the time and told no one what he was really like. I didn't want to make people hate him and I was still hoping he would change.

When he left me, I told my family and friends everything. They were shocked and appalled. Some mutual friends are still friends with him, some are not. But I'm not covering for him any more.

I think my situation is slightly different because he's the one who left and I am still willing to reconcile if he's able to change. But, i have had nothing but support from all my family and friends. However, I'm guessing I may not have had the same level of support if they didn't know what was really going on.

I'm glad you've made it over here, but I'm sorry you're in this situation.

[asoctoberfalls]

Oh, also... I am so, so much happier than I was before. I feel like a weight has been lifted and I'm actually excited about my future. Before, when I would think of retirement, I thought of it with dread because I couldn't imagine spending that much time with H. I think I'll have an even stronger sense of relief when the divorce is final and the house is sold.

[stephreloaded]

You have gotten very good responses. I think that part of this journey is focusing more on what YOU need than what everyone says you should do.

You can and "should" have a civil relationship with you ex. It takes a lot of work though and it takes two to tango.

[nextbigthing]

ugh. now my mother and father BOTH just called/texted me that H sent them a "very nice email apologizing for everything and telling them he's getting help". my mom wanted to know what I wanted her to say back I told her I didn't care, not my business.

this shit hurts my feelings more than stupid H

[pinkdutchtulips]

Jun 15, 2016 14:08:48 GMT -5 nextbigthing said:

ugh. now my mother and father BOTH just called/texted me that H sent them a "very nice email apologizing for everything and telling them he's getting help". my mom wanted to know what I wanted her to say back I told her I didn't care, not my business.

this shit hurts my feelings more than stupid H

my xh, note xh, apologized profusely and said he was getting help w/in days of the split. He squatted in our formal rental for THREE months higher than a kite most days.

Thankfully having a RO meant I didn't have to say a word to him

[1confused1]

Jun 15, 2016 14:08:48 GMT -5 nextbigthing said:

ugh. now my mother and father BOTH just called/texted me that H sent them a "very nice email apologizing for everything and telling them he's getting help". my mom wanted to know what I wanted her to say back I told her I didn't care, not my business.

this shit hurts my feelings more than stupid H

You need to set boundaries with your parents (and anyone else who isn't supportive).  This isn't their life, it's your's.  

Tell them you need their support and, if they are not willing to do that, then you would prefer if they stayed out of it.  It's ok for them to ignore your STBX's text messages and you don't want to hear about what he is saying.


I'm sorry they are putting you through this. 

[FormerlyRR]

Jun 15, 2016 14:08:48 GMT -5 nextbigthing said:

ugh. now my mother and father BOTH just called/texted me that H sent them a "very nice email apologizing for everything and telling them he's getting help". my mom wanted to know what I wanted her to say back I told her I didn't care, not my business.

this shit hurts my feelings more than stupid H

I would also say to your parents that they are YOUR family, and you expect their loyalty to you. That if he needs support, he has his own family to get it from. And that if they insist on being helpful and supportive to him beyond polite grandparent stuff, please keep it to themselves.