Ok but, see how people came at you and how you responded attempting to explain your intent, acknowledging the frustration and reiterating your desire to be a better ally? They came at her the same way and she immediately got defensive and feelings and think of the children.
So it's not actually about how things are communicated. It's about the person being communicated having the ability to not get up in their feelings and to listen with recognition of the frustration behind the words.
And I, for one, am no longer here for couching what I have to say in cotton candy and bubble wrap. If you really want to listen, then LISTEN. I can whisper that a house is on fire, or scream it, or calmly state it but the fact is no matter how I communicate it the house is still on fucking fire.
Not quite. I was all feelings and think of the children in my OP. It was my entire point.
But, keep being insulting and shitty. I'm gonna head to bed.
Night!
So not only are you guilty of being so wrapped up in yourself that you can't see that you're doing EXACTLY what capscapscaps is talking about (in a response that is WAY more measured than is deserved, btw), but you're going to call HER shitty and insulting? Are you kidding me?
Of course you're allowed to be sad/disappointed/scared about world affairs and what they mean for your kids. But that might be a sentiment better directed toward your spouse or your friend in a separate conversation. In the middle of conversations about how we as a community need to improve how we relate to and support our WOC and how we have seriously failed at that over and over again, is NOT the appropriate time/place. Your worries are not invalid. They *are* irrelevant to the conversation, and dropping them here is disrespectful to and distracting from it, which is why you are getting the response you are.
Not quite. I was all feelings and think of the children in my OP. It was my entire point.
But, keep being insulting and shitty. I'm gonna head to bed.
Night!
Everybody on this board has seen me be insulting and shitty. This was neither. Thanks for proving me right, though.
Like, I want to believe you hacked her account and posted this solely to illustrate your point, because SURELY no one could follow your comment with that without being intentionally demonstrative......RIGHT?! JFC
Everybody on this board has seen me be insulting and shitty. This was neither. Thanks for proving me right, though.
Like, I want to believe you hacked her account and posted this solely to illustrate your point, because SURELY no one could follow your comment with that without being intentionally demonstrative......RIGHT?! JFC
I don't keep up on all ML posters, but hasn't this one always been a bit dim? It's all I've got in my vague memories of her. Dim...very dim.
Like, I want to believe you hacked her account and posted this solely to illustrate your point, because SURELY no one could follow your comment with that without being intentionally demonstrative......RIGHT?! JFC
I don't keep up on all ML posters, but hasn't this one always been a bit dim? Â It's all I've got in my vague memories of her. Â Dim...very dim.
she's rather pitiful, which is why I've always tried to be nice to her. People forget that they've shared all the sordid details of their unenviable lives when they come prancing in with their ass in the air. It's hilarious.
Get out of here with your little emoji smile as if that absolves you of everything or anything.
Oh, El oh el, noodles. Calm the FUCK down and give it a rest tonight, will ya? Too hard to admit to yourself that i, as a white woman, wanted to try sharring an opinion in a respectful way for the last hour. I get nothing but dumped on,misunderstood, laughed at... so I throw a tiny snark emoji out there and you're riled?
Good luck irl.
You know, I was working on a long and thoughtful response about how no one is telling you that you can't feel your feelings, but think about how white kids will never, ever be impacted by living in a racist country the same way that children of color are, every single day and sometimes talking about your feelings as a white woman is not the appropriate contribution to a conversation about race.
But fuck that. No. This is fucking bullshit. You don't get to laugh about this, laugh it off or say that you're "misunderstood" or get a pass because your opinion matters so fucking much that you can't see how fucking disrespectful it is that you can say that "all lives matter" bothers you and NOT understand that you're basically saying "all worries matter!" That you're saying yours about your white children carry the same weight as black mothers and fathers who wonder whether their kids will get shot by police on a pretext, get arrested, get incarcerated for shit that white boys and girls get off scot free for, have their resumes thrown in the trash because of their names. NO. That's not a respectful, or respectable, opinion and you can GTFO with that BS.
I don't keep up on all ML posters, but hasn't this one always been a bit dim? It's all I've got in my vague memories of her. Dim...very dim.
she's rather pitiful, which is why I've always tried to be nice to her. People forget that they've shared all the sordid details of their unenviable lives when they come prancing in with their ass in the air. It's hilarious.
especially with a quick perusal of the handy dandy member's recent posts link...good lord.
Get out of here with your little emoji smile as if that absolves you of everything or anything.
Oh, El oh el, noodles. Calm the FUCK down and give it a rest tonight, will ya? Too hard to admit to yourself that i, as a white woman, wanted to try sharring an opinion in a respectful way for the last hour. I get nothing but dumped on,misunderstood, laughed at... so I throw a tiny snark emoji out there and you're riled?
Good luck irl.
Fucking twat. I have no patience for your old ass white boohoo tears
missyny your kids will be fine no matter what. Whether they'd lived 150 years ago, or 150 years from now, they'll be fine because they have white skin. So your hand-wringing is out of place.
missyny- you know I have always loved you, and think your heart was in the right place, but the comment is the equivalent of watching a car wreck with your kids and then saying the victim's family "I'm so worried about how this will affect my children." Your children will obviously be adversely affected, and your true concern may be for them, but you also can't be surprised if the person you're talking to doesn't want to hear it.
I am so, so poorly situated to understand how the WOC feel, but I have this deep, burning anger towards the male preference that exists in the higher levels of my industry, which I honestly didn't even feel three years ago, so when these things come up I substitute the white girls (like us) for the men that I work with, and think about how I'd feel if one of them expressed concern about having his son exposed to a sexist system that, if it doesn't change, will benefit . . . . him. I wouldn't receive that concern well, no matter how well intentioned.
I mean, maybe this isn't the perfect way to have empathy, and it's tone deaf too because I'm talking about being discriminated in terms of getting to the tippy top of an industry while other people are talking about being discriminated against all the time, but I think about the deep rage this causes me, and then think about how I'd feel if it was like that all the time in every part of my life, even on my off duty, me time, message board. . . And I swear to god, I am pretty sure I'd be homicidal or suicidal.
missyny your kids will be fine no matter what. Whether they'd lived 150 years ago, or 150 years from now, they'll be fine because they have white skin. So your hand-wringing is out of place.
This is so true, although I hope 150 years from now will be better. But yeah, POC have been living with racism and violence against them for-fucking-ever. The WOC on this board and others have been incredibly patient in putting up with racist shit here and helping us understand what they have to face daily. It's been way too long since the @kirkette ama, which is I when first recall the whole "listening and learning" phrase being thrown about. All of us should have listened and should have learned by now. So the onus is not on them to explain what is racist and what is not to us. It never should have been on them.
well into your 40's with three kids, and this is the best you can do. Lol. Pathetic.
Actually, I hope your kids continue to experience privilege, because they'll need it. Since we're all just thinking out loud and sharing opinions here.
Let me help you out. There isn't really a good time or place to be upset about the "effects" racism will have on your white kids.
oh I like this game!
Sigh, I'm so worried about my wealthy black child growing up in a world filled with poverty. Yes, I feel bad for the poor people too, but I hate that my daughter will have to see it, you know? When will everyone have as much money as me? I'm scared it will never happen. Apologies if this isn't the place or time. I just really wanted to share my perspective as a well-meaning, non-political person.
It's nothing to do with time and place. It's the wrong thing to worry about, anywhere, anytime.
It is a great time to think about how you can teach your children to be better. Teach them that racism is a real thing, how to spot it, and how to be a true ally for POC.
I am sorry for being insensitive. I am sorry for expressing myself in an inappropriate way in the thread. My original intent was not to be hurtful or disrespectful in any way. I am aware of white privilege. And yet, I still managed to blow it bc I mentioned my children. I want to understand this. And I'm so sorry that it's hard for me. I want to be an ally. I don't want to further the problem, and I do my best to call out friends and fam members irl.
I was tired last night. And I was highly distracted by the name calling. I got pissy and defensive and I'm sorry for that. I am sorry if I hurt anyone.
I was short with my original apology bc I I didn't think it would even matter anymore ,what I had to say. Maybe it still doesnt? Idk. But, I do see my worry as being similar to ALM. Sorry.
I don't know how to do this. But I will keep trying. I do care.
Let me help you out. There isn't really a good time or place to be upset about the "effects" racism will have on your white kids.
oh I like this game!
Sigh, I'm so worried about my wealthy black child growing up in a world filled with poverty. Yes, I feel bad for the poor people too, but I hate that my daughter will have to see it, you know? When will everyone have as much money as me? I'm scared it will never happen. Apologies if this isn't the place or time. I just really wanted to share my perspective as a well-meaning, non-political person.
I am sorry for being insensitive. I am sorry for expressing myself in an inappropriate way in the thread. My original intent was not to be hurtful or disrespectful in any way. I am aware of white privilege. And yet, I still managed to blow it bc I mentioned my children. I want to understand this. And I'm so sorry that it's hard for me. I want to be an ally. I don't want to further the problem, and I do my best to call out friends and fam members irl.
No, you were being deliberately offensive and calling out 05, a WOC. And deliberately "misunderstanding" caps, another WOC, with your white privilege "I don't get it" tears.
You didn't blow it because you mentioned your children. You blew it because of HOW you mentioned your children. As if they would be observers to racism, and not actively involved. As white children, they are part of the privileged and if they aren't allies, they're perpetuators simply by their inaction. And you, waving your arms all around about how *they* will be affected, rather than how the world as a whole, is being affected today, tomorrow and in the future. About how your (white, privileged) family will be "upset" by the racism, rather than understanding how others are LIVING it, and aren't privileged to merely "observe" it around them, and working to dismantle the structures that permit white privilege and "feeling upset that my babies will see it and grow up with it surround them."
Newsflash: my babies are also white and also growing up with this around them. I'm not worried about how racism is affecting them. I'm worried now about how THEY ARE AFFECTING RACISM.
Talking about it is a start, but a better start is to stop thinking about how it affects YOUR family and think about how it actually affects THOSE WHO LIVE IT, and work from there.