Obama brags about his absolute authority to kill

[teamc]

reason.com/blog/2012/09/07/obama-brags-about-his-extensive-process

Argh, I don't know how to cut and paste the article on my iPad (first world problems). Interesting analysis about drone killings...

[soontobeka]

I think "bragging" is a stretch. Is the policy concerning-for me, yes. But I also understand that he cannot give us every detail of how the decision to kill is made.

[soontobeka]

In an interview this week, Jessica Yellin, CNN's chief White House correspondent, asked President Obama how he decides who will live and who will die. "I've got to be a little careful here," Obama replied, because "there are classified issues." But he was able to assure the American people that "our criteria for using [drones] is [sic] very tight and very strict": The threat must be "serious and not speculative," capture has to be "very difficult," and the risk of "civilian casualties" must be minimized. How does the government make sure these criteria are satisfied?

We have an extensive process with a lot of checks, a lot of eyes looking at it. Obviously, as president, I'm ultimately responsible for decisions that are made by the administration. But I think what the American people need to know is the seriousness with which we take both the responsibility to keep them safe but also the seriousness with which we take the need to abide by our traditions of rule of law and due process. 

All of this is done secretly, of course, and all of the "eyes looking at it" belong to people who work for the president, so you kinda have to take Obama's word for it. In his view, the executive branch is checking itself, so there is no need for judicial oversight. And he should know, right? He used to teach constitutional law. But doesn't this arrangement effectively give one man the power to kill anyone he identifies as an enemy of the state? Yes and no:

I can’t get too deeply into how these things work. But as I said, as commander in chief ultimately I am responsible for the process that we've set up.

Obama conceded that singling people out for death dealt at a distance is "something that you have to struggle with, because if you don't it's very easy to slip into a situation in which you end up bending rules, thinking that the ends always justify the means." What a relief to know that the president is not bending the rules when he orders the summary execution of people he considers threats to national security.

Obama closed the exchange by flattering his interviewer. "It's very important for the president and the entire culture of our national security team to continually ask tough questions," he said. "Are we doing the right thing? Are we abiding by the rule of law? Are we abiding by due process?" Yellin asked those tough questions, and she got her answer: yes. The rest is classified.

[heightsyankee]

This isn't written with any bias or anything.

[anonymous]

Bragging? Am I blind? This is what I hope any president would say about this subject.

[bhnumbers]

I'm not sure how anyone can call this bragging. That's utterly ridiculous.

[ringstrue]

I get that the president has the final say, but with how much info and pressure and opinions he gets from others I sort of side-eye that he is making the decision in a traditional sense.

[5thofjuly]

I don't read this as bragging at all. I read it as very "heavy is the head."

[ttt]

I don't understand. What part is "bragging"?

[sweettooth]

I would rather take this route than lose thousands of lives and billions of dollars in multiple wars. We don't fight countries now--we fight isolated terrorists.

[marie427]

I'm so glad other people are wondering how this constitutes bragging. I honestly thought I was missing something huge while reading it.

[teflep]

I am guessing here
I can’t get too deeply into how these things work. But as I said, as commander in chief ultimately I am responsible for the process that we've set up.

We all know the POTUS makes the final call so I guess that is why? To me, it may be more condescending than bragging, but, I know I also think people know how these things go and that is not really the case.

[teflep]

Voodoo-the one I posted "I can't get too deeply into how these things works". Like I said, most know he makes the decision. I don't slam him for this, just something I think.

[epphd]

I take this as very much a "I take responsibility for the decisions that are made and any consequences thereof." certainly not a brag - more of a statement acknowledging the incredible gravity of that decision making.

[soontobeka]

Sept 8, 2012 13:55:57 GMT -5 teflep said:

Voodoo-the one I posted "I can't get too deeply into how these things works". Like I said, most know he makes the decision. I don't slam him for this, just something I think.

To me that statement is not condescending but about protecting classified information.

[teflep]

Sept 8, 2012 15:26:15 GMT -5 soontobeka said:

Sept 8, 2012 13:55:57 GMT -5 teflep said:

Voodoo-the one I posted "I can't get too deeply into how these things works". Like I said, most know he makes the decision. I don't slam him for this, just something I think.

To me that statement is not condescending but about protecting classified information.

even with the f/u? Okay, I just disagree. Like I said, I am not slamming him for it as I don't think he meant it that way. I just thought it came across a bit that way.

[epphd]

Not any more condescending than it would be for a doctor to say "I can't get too deep into the details of the specific patient's case" or the priest or lawyer saying "I can't get too deep into the details of my client/parishoner's statements".

[sweettooth]

Sept 8, 2012 13:39:05 GMT -5 @mx said:

I hate drone strikes and doubt their legality. But I'm too mch of a realist to believe that any president we elect wouldn't use them. Constitution be damned.

But I find the notion that drone strikes are better than "war" to be untrue. Just because the people being killed aren't (usually) Americans doesn't mean they don't count. Pretty sure the kids we kill are't terrorists. And even if you believe infants deserve to die to save American lives, do you really believe that drone strikes are making Americans in places like Pakistan and Yemen safer? I can't go into too much detail here, but there are plenty of Americans in those places who are in extreme danger thanks to these strikes.

Children and babies get killed and maimed in war also--I'm willing to bet that in 10 years of war, more have been killed than in the drone strikes. If Pakistan refuses to let us come in and capture terrorists, are we supposed to just let them hide there until their next strike? How many were killed on 9/11 and then the wars?

I don't "like" the killing, but I hate prolonged wars and seeing the thousands killed and even more disabled for life.

[soontobeka]

Sept 8, 2012 16:51:05 GMT -5 @mrdobalina said:

Shoot, if I was president I'd be bragging about a 24 hour staffed kitchen, my own helicopter and plane. I'd prank with the"red phone" and wake up important people in the middle of their nights around the globe just to be all "hey girl!" So no, I don't think is bragging and if you want to see some legitimate (yeah, went there) presidential bragging vote Dobalina 2012. Thank you. And God Bless America.

How many years of tax returns are you willing to release?

[poutinedreams]

Jacob Sullum on abortion:
"When the law blesses the murder of babies, it is hardly worthy of respect, any more than laws blessing the enslavement of Africans or the gassing of Jews were, and violent resistance against such enactments surely is justified in principle."

President Obama talked about the process in clinical terms. Sullum cited no instances of bragging.

Sullum is a columnist who probably gets paid by the number of hits. A provacative headline gets the hits, even if it has no connect to the story or the truth.

[teflep]

Sept 8, 2012 16:55:40 GMT -5 NewOrleans said:

Sept 8, 2012 13:55:57 GMT -5 teflep said:

Voodoo-the one I posted .

Ah. It just showed up for me as some broken symbols / code, so I didn't realize it was a quote. You must be on an ipad / phone that re-formats quotes weird.

I am. The app...might be that.

[2vermont]

I don't see the bragging either and I'm cool with others feeling that way too as long as they would have said the same thing if Bush had said the same exact things.

[teflep]

Sept 8, 2012 17:34:43 GMT -5 2vermont said:

I don't see the bragging either and I'm cool with others feeling that way too as long as they would have said the same thing if Bush had said the same exact things.

I would. I also hone in on war speak & overstepping as I am anti-war

[2vermont]

Sept 8, 2012 17:43:32 GMT -5 teflep said:

Sept 8, 2012 17:34:43 GMT -5 2vermont said:

I don't see the bragging either and I'm cool with others feeling that way too as long as they would have said the same thing if Bush had said the same exact things.

I would. I also hone in on war speak & overstepping as I am anti-war

Unfortunately, I'm thinking a lot of the responses would not have looked the same.....just based on some of the knee-jerk reactions to other articles that showed liberal bias in the past few weeks.

[teflep]

Sept 8, 2012 18:28:17 GMT -5 2vermont said:

Sept 8, 2012 17:43:32 GMT -5 teflep said:

I would. I also hone in on war speak & overstepping as I am anti-war

Unfortunately, I'm thinking a lot of the responses would not have looked the same.....just based on some of the knee-jerk reactions to other articles that showed liberal bias in the past few weeks.

maybe but I think most try to be even when cray or obvious bias comes through

[teflep]

Sept 8, 2012 22:00:18 GMT -5 nuggetbrain said:

Sept 8, 2012 18:28:17 GMT -5 2vermont said:

Unfortunately, I'm thinking a lot of the responses would not have looked the same.....just based on some of the knee-jerk reactions to other articles that showed liberal bias in the past few weeks.

I think discussion has been very even-keeled since personalattackgate. If people want to keep it that way then I think some shit needs to be let go.

Sent from my ADR6400L using proboards

They have, but you missed the tin foil thread. Not saying it is the same, but it does need to be let go (and has yet to be). I think that is all 2V was referring.

[2vermont]

Sept 8, 2012 22:00:18 GMT -5 nuggetbrain said:

Sept 8, 2012 18:28:17 GMT -5 2vermont said:

Unfortunately, I'm thinking a lot of the responses would not have looked the same.....just based on some of the knee-jerk reactions to other articles that showed liberal bias in the past few weeks.

I think discussion has been very even-keeled since personalattackgate. If people want to keep it that way then I think some shit needs to be let go.

Sent from my ADR6400L using proboards

I agree, but if we're honest there really hasn't been too much of a test of that yet.

[Deleted]

I dont see him as bragging - like epphd said, I think he is acknowledging the gravity of the decision he is faced with making. I think Bush would have felt the same way, fwiw.

[basilosaurus]

It is neither bragging nor condescending. This is highly classified, and it's the role of the president to execute. WTF else is he supposed to say? epphd is right. It's no different than a doctor commenting in general terms on a patient's condition and saying they're doing everything they can.

My feelings on the strikes, and targeting of american citizens especially, aren't even addressed by this moronic article. It's just blustering to get hits, not to offer any insightful commentary.