Q for Special Educators

[2vermont]

I'm pretty sure we have a handful of regulars who are special educators (but this is for anyone lurking as well).

How many students are in your caseload? Do they include 504 kids? If so, how many are IEP kids?

[Deleted]

DS2 is mainstreamed but I know of 5 kids in his class of 20 with IEPs.

[rugbywife]

I am not a Sped teacher but in most of my school the case loads of the SERTS (Special Education Resource Teachers) stands at about 30 - 45 IEPs. I have no idea what a 504 student is, all we have is IEPs, either formal (with a diagnosis) or school based (no formal diagnosis but a need for an IEP).

They likely helps more students beyond those 30 - 45 IEPs but those are their legal responsibility.

[2vermont]

Sept 9, 2012 17:24:06 GMT -5 @septimus said:

DS2 is mainstreamed but I know of 5 kids in his class of 20 with IEPs.

Chances are the speical educator responsible for your son has other kids in other classes as well though. I'm thinking 12-15 kids is average, but I thought I'd do a PB poll to see if I'm on the right track.

[imimahoney]

I'm a regular ed HS teacher but the sped. teachers (or resource as we call them) have around 20 - 30. Students with 504's do not receive resource help.

As a regular ed teacher, in a class of 25, I can have up to 10 IEP students and an unlimited amount of 504 students per class.

[2vermont]

Sept 9, 2012 17:24:43 GMT -5 rugbywife said:

I am not a Sped teacher but in most of my school the case loads of the SERTS (Special Education Resource Teachers) stands at about 30 - 45 IEPs. I have no idea what a 504 student is, all we have is IEPs, either formal (with a diagnosis) or school based (no formal diagnosis but a need for an IEP).

They likely helps more students beyond those 30 - 45 IEPs but those are their legal responsibility.

[2vermont]

I can't believe the nunbers you guys are saying. In all my years as a special educator (in NY and VT) I have never had more than 12-15.

[Deleted]

I'm pretty sure our SpEd has more than 15. She was at both of my son's IEP meetings. One is ASD/Sensory/Speech/Stuttering and one is just speech so different levels of interventions are needed.

[janetplanet20]

I'm a general ed teacher, but I co-teach one period with the RSP teacher for mainstreamed special ed students. She has about 16-18 RSP students on her caseload. This includes both 7th and 8th grade students.

The SDC teacher has around 12, I think. We also have a severely handicapped class with about 8 students, if I remember correctly.

[imimahoney]

Sept 9, 2012 17:29:15 GMT -5 2vermont said:

I can't believe the nunbers you guys are saying. In all my years as a special educator (in NY and VT) I have never had more than 12-15.

In my HS of 800 there are 6 resource teachers (one was recently cut due to budget restrictions) but the number of IEP students keep rising and rising.

Each resource teacher does have their own aid to assist in managing the resource room and the special needs of the students.

[UMaineTeach]

each of our case managers (2) gr. 1-4 has 15-20 kids - there are 7 ed techs

our K case manager has 3 right now - but keep in mind that she will get more as the year goes on, there are just the kid who had an ISFP/IEP prior to school. - there are 2 ed techs.

middle school gr 5-8 had 4 case managers, but I don't know the #s of kids - there are 4-5 ed techs

if it's a 504 kid who has no academic need he is on the G/T /504/curriculum coordinator's case load

there are also some kids that the SPL is case manager for if they only have a speech/lang. diagnosis and don't need resource room help.

[thejackpot]

I left Spec Ed 3 years ago but my caseload averaged 14 students and none were 504s. Our 504s are handled by te guidance dept.

[teflep]

I think it depends on the school and number of special educators. When I was in the special Ed classroom, I had 22 and 3 504s (on my caseload) and it was my first year as a sped teacher. We had a large number of teachers but also a large pop with Ieps.

[teacherjulie]

I am k-4 special education I have 12 full inclusion children and 3 504's

[Deleted]

In my school 504 students are not the responsibility of special education teachers so they are not on their caseload. We have 4 resource room teachers each with about 8 - 12 students and then 4 inclusion teachers with the same amount. We have a lot of 504s this year the most I have ever seen.

[Deleted]

23 students in ICR
14 in RR

so, 37 in all...last year 47

[rugbywife]

I should point out that the numbers I stated (30 - 45) are students who are fully integrated into regular classrooms. Students who are integrated can range from high needs ASD students (possibly with Pervasive Developmental Delay), to students with LDs, or gifted students, or students who are of low-average IQ, or even Mild Intellectual Delay. The SERTs are responsible for the IEP in conjunction with the classroom teacher and provide different levels of support depending on the needs of the student (resource support through withdrawal, in class support, etc). They also coordinate the Educational Assistants who support students with special needs in their classroom.

This role is different than a teacher who teaches a 'self-contained' special education class. These students tend to be limited to a maximum of 10 students (we have three levels of these classes - LD (grades 4-6 or 6-8), Life Skills (grades 1-3, 4-6, 6-8) and Behavioural (6-8, although most of these have been disbanded and kids have been sent back to regular classrooms). (EDIT: The LD and Behaviour settings involve students being in a self-contained setting for only 50% of the time, the rest of the time they should be integrated with other classes, so at our school I have a student that comes in for Phys Ed., Art, French, and Music and a few other classes here and there).

There is one more designated self-contained setting, I think it is called a 'Communication Needs' class, and I believe it is geared towards low functioning ASD students in grades 1-3, but I have never worked in a school with one so I am not sure how many students there are.

Then we have self-contained gifted classrooms but they aren't limited to 10 students, they can be as large as regular classes, which sucks because a lot of the students have a dual diagnosis of gifted-ness and LD.

So yeah, self-contained teachers generally never have more than 10 students (the LD class at my new school has 5 students in it) but my SERT at my last school finished they year off being responsible for 45 IEPed students.

As a classroom teacher I currently have 3 this year, one ASD, an LD and a student who has yet to be tested but has a school-based IEP based on need. Last year, I taught grade 8, I had 5 IEPs in each of my two classes.

[mrslefty]

Ours must have more than 20 but less than 30. I know last year we qualified for a full time and .5 resource room teacher, but not sure how many kiddos we had. I teach at a pretty big school though with >600 kids.

[taratru]

Where I work, there are sped teachers who run specific programs, so their caseloads (and number of paras) vary fairly widely. I know one teacher only has 6, but those are the most intensive 6 in the building. Mod needs teachers generally have 15-25, I think.

504s are managed by a counselor, and based on the number of students my husband and I have, I would venture a guess there are well over 200 kids in the building on a 504.

[rugbywife]

What is a 504?

[mrslefty]

Sept 9, 2012 18:36:42 GMT -5 rugbywife said:

What is a 504?

Section 504 is a part of the Rehabilitation Act of 1973 that prohibits discrimination based upon disability. Section 504 is an anti-discrimination, civil rights statute that requires the needs of students with disabilities to be met as adequately as the needs of the non-disabled are met.
www.greatschools.org/special-education/legal-rights/868-section-504.gs

[2vermont]

Sept 9, 2012 18:36:42 GMT -5 rugbywife said:

What is a 504?

Here's a basic explanation of the difference between the two:



www.washington.edu/doit/Stem/articles?52

[rugbywife]

Oh! Yeah, those situations are the responsibility of the administrator. Technically the administrator is in charge of the Educational Assistants, not the SERTs, but the SERTs generally are the ones who figure out the schedule. Some cases do involve medical needs AND an IEP (I have no idea how many OP...) and in that case the medical accommodations are dealt with through one document and the IEP is a separate document.

In the end, it is all the responsibility of the principal, which is what scares me. I am ready to be a VP, but being a principal is a whole other ball game. Thankfully, I have 21 years left in the profession so I can spend a while at VP (hopefully will be one next fall!) before I worry about P.

[UMaineTeach]

Sept 9, 2012 18:36:42 GMT -5 rugbywife said:

What is a 504?

504 is about accommodations/non-discrimination for disabilities under civil rights laws. It is for the kids who can do school, but need an accommodation (digital text, large print, text to speech reader, a ramp) or a kid with an IEP could also have a 504, but usually the IEP covers the bases.

To get an IEP under IDEA, education law, you have to have a disability and show that there is an adverse effect on educational performance.

docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:ZaDHmrdoZlcJ:www.hhs.gov/ocr/504.html+&hl=en&gl=us&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESg7PsZCk386qC59SDPsSz_aOMO4uO_xRvcjRUIa0QeAR__RSQhySBmZO5O4K5ne2uf5oANC5DZn5jbvwgFjYrKvwQ-ZQwkJEQL2UXtNk2Bqyq2546fjLIUyPBIh-gvS3F6qznhb&sig=AHIEtbSqoMqc3bh1tne8G5N_fI1fq0VS1A

idea.ed.gov/

[rugbywife]

Okay, I don't think we have the equivalent of a 504. If you need any type of accommodation you get an IEP. If a student has a medical need such as being hard of hearing, visual impairment, or a physical disability that would limit their ability to participate in the curriculum or that requires any type of accommodation then there is an IEP.

Allergies are dealt with separately, as are most medical conditions (diabetes, seizures in most cases, heart condition). Those just involve a piece of paper that goes home to get filled out by parents and is then posted in the office/staffroom and in a duotang that is found in each classroom. The sheet outlines the process to take if that specific student encounters a medical emergency. These don't have a specific name but there is a process that must be followed (including yearly EPI pen training - tomorrow at our first staff meeting!).

[UMaineTeach]

Sometimes I like to think of the difference between 504 and IEP as the difference between an athlete participating in the Paralympics and an athlete participating in the Special Olympics.

[fussybreeches]

I teach 6th grade math resource room. I see a total of 37 students, my classes vary in size from as small as 3 to 10 depending on the period.

[milkrations]

Sept 9, 2012 18:58:07 GMT -5 rugbywife said:

Okay, I don't think we have the equivalent of a 504. If you need any type of accommodation you get an IEP. If a student has a medical need such as being hard of hearing, visual impairment, or a physical disability that would limit their ability to participate in the curriculum or that requires any type of accommodation then there is an IEP.

Are you in the US? If so, a school (or anybody else) can't opt out of 504 plans. It is illegal and unethical to serve a kid under an IEP if their needs can be met under a 504. Even with thing like deafness, it is possible that some students may be served under 504.

I understand the push by parents and school admin to get an IEP, but there are specific criteria that must be met. A need for accommodations =/= automatic IEP. We need to serve students in the least restrictive enviornment and special ed is restrictive.