PhD.

[rikkiandjulie]

Julie just told me that when she is done with her masters (Dec) she hopes to start working on a PhD. After hearing some of you on this board talk about how much you miss them during this journey, I'm scared. I'll support her 100% but Id be lying if I told you I wasn't worried about the distance this may create between us.


Rikki-iPhone

[2brides]

I am not sure that all people who do a PhD, have the same experience as L and I have had. L has always worked full time (meaning 50+ hrs), had a long commute (2-3 hrs/day), and is an extreme perfectionist (it takes her forever to write.) Plus had a couple of kids in the midst of it. When you compound those things, it just makes time scarce and drags the process out.

But I know at least 3 people who have finished their PhD recently. They don't have kids and didn't work as many hours and were able to complete it in a few years.

It is doable, but it really does take commitment from not only the person getting the PhD, but the entire family.

[twotrue]

Don't be scared. I would do it again in a heartbeat. But, my relationship with K is one in which we are both very independent. I wholeheartedly believe that taking time away for each of us makes us stronger individuals and that in turns makes us a stronger couple.

I think a lot of it will depend on what type of student she is and how intensely she goes after the Ph.D. Truthfully, I look back now and I can't even imagine how her going to classes impacted me (in a negative way). I got to watch what tv shows I wanted (if she was studying late), I visited her on campus, and I got to meet some pretty cool people from her classes.

The writing of the dissertation is a different beast but again, approach will matter. K wrote a lot right after work, or she would take a whole Saturday and write. She also wrote a ton when she was training for her time in Afghanistan, and then of course while she was over there.

I think going through it is probably easier pre-kids but if K wanted to go and get a second PhD I'd help her apply.

[thiswillbe]

If she wants to do it, I'd encourage her to do it now vs. later. I left my Ph.D. program before I finished (to work), and while I've done well at work and am proud of my accomplishments, the unfinished Ph.D. bugs me. It would be really hard to go back and finish it now, though.

[twotrue]

Sept 10, 2012 8:40:37 GMT -5 thiswillbe said:

If she wants to do it, I'd encourage her to do it now vs. later. I left my Ph.D. program before I finished (to work), and while I've done well at work and am proud of my accomplishments, the unfinished Ph.D. bugs me. It would be really hard to go back and finish it now, though.

Why don't both you and N2A go back and finish together? I realize it would be a challenge but I still totally believe N2A should finish her dissertation. At the same time I get the reasoning behind not doing it.

[2brides]

[quote author=twotrue board=lgbt thread=55788 post=894380 time=1347282588 but if K wanted to go and get a second PhD I'd help her apply. [/quote]

You are a better woman than I am. But then again, L has been in her PhD class our entire 12y relationship (sans the first year of the kids' lives.) I am interested to know what we look like with that PhD under our belt and not having newborn twins.

[never2amazing]

Sept 10, 2012 9:30:45 GMT -5 twotrue said:

Sept 10, 2012 8:40:37 GMT -5 thiswillbe said:

If she wants to do it, I'd encourage her to do it now vs. later. I left my Ph.D. program before I finished (to work), and while I've done well at work and am proud of my accomplishments, the unfinished Ph.D. bugs me. It would be really hard to go back and finish it now, though.

Why don't both you and N2A go back and finish together? I realize it would be a challenge but I still totally believe N2A should finish her dissertation. At the same time I get the reasoning behind not doing it.

I am glad you understand the reasoning...that means a lot to me. A co-worker saw my chair just a month ago and my chair said how much she wished I would still finish, that I am so close and that the subject is interesting. While that was very nice to hear, I always think back to the reasons I stopped. It does take a lot of time away from C and the Kiddos, it puts more burden on C, it stresses me out by not having the time to interact with the family like I would like to, but most of all, I just don't want to miss any time with the Kiddos as they grow.

[ct]

I could not imagine having 2 parents working full time and going to school with young children. I can't even see how that schedule would work, logistically.

[twotrue]

Sept 10, 2012 11:49:42 GMT -5 ct said:

I could not imagine having 2 parents working full time and going to school with young children. I can't even see how that schedule would work, logistically.

I agree. But N2A doesn't have to 'go to school', she just needs to write. So in that case there is flexibility in the hours. It's not determined by class schedules. So if TWB took night classes, N2A could write on the weekend. I'm not saying this is practical, or that I even think they should. I think N2A knows where I stand because I've teased her about it and kind of encouraged her to do it (in a lovely friendly way).

[ct]

but when would the laundry get done? the cooking? cleaning? when would twb do her homework? when would the family time happen?

i understand that pursuing higher ed with children will always require sacrifice and it can be worth it, but both parents at the same time with more than 1 child just seems crazy to me

[thiswillbe]

I'm loving the back-and-forth! Rikki, as you can tell, it's a can o' worms, this Ph.D. business!

My biggest problem with me finishing up is that I just don't know if I have the energy to run my brain 24/7 again. I like having my downtime and time to think about (and play with!) the kids, and I think it'd be awfully hard to get back into the swing of things. That said, I really value higher education, and I was sorta unconsciously counting on S to check the "one of my parents has a Ph.D." box for the kids, so if she stays in the "not finishing" camp, I may try to find a program to finish in. I'm not sure I'd go back to my same university. It's local and I'm basically "ABCD" (all but comps and a dissertation), but I don't know if I could go back, now 10 years later, and actually remember all that stuff for comps. It's an interesting proposition, though.


ETA: I'm not saying that every family should have a parent with a Ph.D. It's totally just a little weird hangup of mine. I feel like I'd be letting down my parents to not try to achieve at least as much as they did (my dad has a Ph.D.).

Oh, and "ABCD" is totally not a real status-- I just made it up.

[never2amazing]

Sept 10, 2012 14:01:40 GMT -5 thiswillbe said:

I'm loving the back-and-forth! Rikki, as you can tell, it's a can o' worms, this Ph.D. business!

That said, I really value higher education, and I was sorta unconsciously counting on S to check the "one of my parents has a Ph.D." box for the kids, so if she stays in the "not finishing" camp, I may try to find a program to finish in.
quote]

[llama]

My wife is in a PhD program right now (3rd year of 5, she went straight from undergrad into an interdisciplinary social science field) and I don't think it's as bad as all that, but if there is one thing I know being surrounded by PhD students it's that everyone's experience is different and there are a lot of factors that determine whether it's a crazy or manageable experience.

As a relatively young couple, sans kids, we've had a pretty easy go of it. S also doesn't work full-time, she is on fellowship for writing with some TAing and associate professor-ships thrown in along the way. She has a very flexible schedule now that she is done with classes and doing the research and writing part. Then again, she also has an AMAZINGLY supportive advisor and since she went right through with school we haven't been used to the extra income of a "real" full-time job. This year I am starting an MSW program, so we will both be in grad school full time the next two years. That, in particular, requires a lot of sacrifice, both economic and time together. I've always wanted to get a PhD but I am not sure it will be practical for both of us to have them given our fields.

[joyseattle]

As someone who may be applying to PhD programs this year, I've enjoyed reading this thread.

[clickerish]

I'm not certain why a PhD should be a harbinger of doom for a relationship--my partner and I are both PhD students. Yes, sometimes the constant brain-on gets tiresome. Yes, we get tired of people not understanding that we actually work very hard even though it seems like a relaxing job. And yes, sometimes it creates different stresses that other types of relationships might have. But, honestly, it works pretty well. The question is whether you have the same priorities, whether your partner is able to make a work-life balance and so forth. Whether your partner will respect you even if you don't have the PhD (this is HUGE).

I have met neurotic PhDs who even treat other PhDs with disrespect. I have met really calm, family-oriented PhDs who respect their partners and see it as a team effort. It's about the person, not necessarily the job.

The financial aspect, though, is definitely the hard one IMO. Two people in a PhD program, even with RAs, teaching, grants...it gets tight. This is why we are childless still.

[hlke]

I agree with previous posters that there are a huge variety of experiences for people in PhD programs. How has Julie handled her Masters' program? Has it created a lot of stress for her or difficulty in your relationship?

C and I were both in grad school when we started dating, and she just finished her PhD in December. C is not a particularly stressed out student and is quite good at managing work life balance. We had some tension over my feeling that she sort of defaulted to working unless we had other plans, but we were able to resolve it just by setting clearer expectations.

I, on the other hand, definitely am not as good a student, and me being in school was sometimes difficult for us. In particular I had a lot of trouble with time management, and so schoolwork always took longer than I expected and I'd bail on a lot of plans and responsibilities. I may want to do a PhD program to advance my career at some point, but I know that it would be harder for me to go back to school and that it would put some stress on our relationship.

I also think it's a pretty different ballgame if the PhD student is working full time, or if you have kids, or both. Then the balancing takes superhuman powers and is difficult for everyone.