How long do we make her go?

[traveltheworld]

DD (2.5) is extremely shy.  She has a very bubbly personality, but as soon as she is in a new environment, she clamps up. As an example, we've been going to the same music class for 6 months and she has yet to leave my lap or sing/clap along.

About 3 months ago, we put her in DC 2 days a week to try and get her more used to other children.  The DC is great.  The teachers are all warm and friendly, they have music, art, their own dedicated gym, and lots of activities.  We've dropped by unannounced numerous times and have talked to the other parents and all the other kids in her room love it there.  DD hates it - as in, as soon as she realizes that the next day is daycare day, she starts crying and would sulk for the rest of that evening.  Getting her to get dressed in the morning and out the door for DC is near impossible and half the time, we end up just carrying her and strapping her into her car seat.  When we ask her, she just says that she's scared.  The teachers have asked me if she talks at home, because in 3 months, she has yet to say a single word.

We still have our nanny, so technically she doesn't have to go to DC.  We just thought it'd be good for her.  But how much longer do you think we should keep making her go when she is clearly so miserable?  DH thinks we should do at least 6 months; and that was my plan originally too, but it's just too heart-breaking and I'm almost inclined to pull her and try again when she is 3.

[sdlaura]

The part time kids usually have more trouble adjusting at my kids' daycares/preschool, so I bet that's part of it - that she's only going twice a week.

We had tough drop offs for DS for several months around the same age, and then suddenly a switch flipped and he loved it. Since you know she's safe and well cared for there, I would stick with it.

[waverly]

Hmm I'm not sure if it worth the hassle. However if she is that shy she does need exposure to other kids. That's a tough one. I think I'm leaning towards pulling her and maybe have the nanny take her to another class.

[mommyatty]

Nov 7, 2017 19:58:01 GMT -5 sdlaura said:

The part time kids usually have more trouble adjusting at my kids' daycares/preschool, so I bet that's part of it - that she's only going twice a week.

We had tough drop offs for DS for several months around the same age, and then suddenly a switch flipped and he loved it. Since you know she's safe and well cared for there, I would stick with it.

All of this. When I taught preschool, the only kids like this were part time kids. I would up her to 5 days per week unless she truly seems scared, not sulky. If she really seems scared, I would take her to a therapist. Because 6 months of still even refusing to clap isn’t okay. 

[traveltheworld]

Unfortunately sending her 5 days a week would be prohibitively expensive as we still need our nanny. DS's kindergarten is only half day so we need coverage. We also want to keep our nanny because come next September, we'd like to send DD to the Montessori preschool that DS went to, which was terrific but also only half day. I know going 2 days a week is not great but I can't find any programs that take children that are younger than 3 and are half days for 5 days a week, so that's why we ended up going with this daycare. She already goes to all sorts of classes with our nanny and us but I feel she needs the independent interactions.

[freezorburn]

What is your gut telling you? You know your child best.

Some kids may just need more time to be ready for DC/preschool. Other kids, like mine, may be showing early signs of some kind of developmental challenge. It's not always easy to know.

I second mommyatty's suggestion that if something seems off, to look into whether a therapist, developmental pediatrician or developmental psychologist might be able to help. At the very least it might be worth bringing up with your regular pediatrician. Has she had a hearing screening recently? It doesn't hurt to start bringing up your concerns. Either you can rule things out, or a specialist might cue into things you wouldn't know to look for. If something is off, the sooner you find out, the sooner you can help your child get support and intervention. Maybe she's just an anxious kid, and if you find the right therapist or coach you might be able to come up with some strategies/tools to help her deal with it. Or, maybe she just needs more time. (Do you prefer to be more proactive? Do you prefer to wait and see? Only you can answer that)

In my own experience, DS was very anxious at that age, and preschool was checking off the boxes on their developmental checklist and he seemed fine (if at the low end of the bell curve). There were idiosyncracies in his speech but we all thought he would grow out of it eventually. A year later I was consulting early childhood development specialists for advice on how to help DS with the emotional ups and downs of his dad's MLC, and one of them saw red flags for autism that no one else had noticed. He could hear just fine, but he didn't respond (or responded slowly) when addressed. He was reluctant to make eye contact. And the tonality of his speech was not normal. It wasn't flat, which is what people usually think of -- but it wasn't normal, either. It was sort of like an exaggerated iambic pentameter, almost musical. The things he said were repetitive and scripted. And he couldn't get his pronouns right. When we wanted to be carried, he would say, "Mommy, can I pick you up?"

In any case, there was never a reason to withdraw DS from preschool. Having social opportunities with peers became that much more important, once we knew what was going on with him. We eventually figured out a drop-off routine that helped him to transition and settle in, and over time he felt more comfortable and confident in the preschool environment. We had a few setbacks and regressions from time to time, but thankfully his preschool teachers never gave up on him. It was so great to have their support ... and eventually I think therapy started to click for him and he began to figure out how to apply skills from therapy to the preschool environment.

Ironically, if not for the destructive and aggressive behaviors that arose when DS's dad left, I probably would not have sought help for DS's speech and social deficits for another 6 months to a year. And then we would have lost valuable therapy time, and then he might not have been as ready for kindergarten as he turned out to be.

TL; DR: It never hurts to have a conversation with someone who can either reassure you that everything is fine, or hm ... there's a red flag, let's see if we can connect you with some resources.

[judyblume14]

When you send DD to Montessori next year, how many days per week will it be? If it's going to be five half-days a week, I'd just cut your losses with the current pre-school and try again next fall.

[2chatter]

DD cried every day she went until she was 4 - she was in a part time program. She warmed up after 2, but until 2 most days did some variation of cry all day. Our ped said she was just slow to warm up and he was right. She’s the most well adjusted 13 year old i have ever met.

We did role plays at home and that helped. I also talked with her teachers and gave her a reason to be excited about the next day - a new book, sparkly crayons - something. Hang in there, and talk to your ped for reassurance and about the need for possible screening.

[xctsclrx]

If you are not willing to go to full time daycare I would pull her until she is ready to go to the Montessori school. This wasn't meant to be a learning thing just something to allow her to interact with other kids and have fun. She is not having fun.

I would talk to her pediatrician about the lack of participation though. That sounds off. My DS is shy and cautious, but he is not that shy. Dh and I have also been forcing the issue a bit. Pushing him to test his limits, because I don't want fear to prevent him from having fun even if it is my fear.

[librarychica]

We had this issue with DD1 who is now almost 6 and goes to school without issue. Most people here told me what you are mostly hearing — up her to 5 days (we couldn’t because nanny and baby at home), keep at it, she will get used to it. We muscled through but, honestly, she never really improved. She was sobbing and hiding in a corner and chasing daddy back down the hallway until the last day. We regret not pulling her so much.

We took the summer off and 3 months later she started 5 half days at a Montessori like your son’s at almost 4 years old. It still took her several months to adjust but adjust she did and she was making clear progress. So, short version, pull her and wait until she is a little older and has the consistency.

[erinshelley21]

Can she go 3 days a week so that way she is there a little bit more but you can still keep the nanny?

Also, I feel like Daniel Tiger usually has good episodes to help with these types of things. I'm sure there is one about playing, going to school, etc.

[mommyatty]

I concur that if you can’t do 5 days a week, pull her.

[librarychica]

If you decide to keep sending her, we had decent luck roll playing school at our second school attempt. Roll playing generally was a big hit at that age. She and i would take turns being the teacher or daddy and roll play separating at the door, laying down for nap, etc.

[justcheckingin73]

I’m a complete softy and would probably pull her with the hopes that she grows out of it. DS was/is an anxious kid in new situations. The transitions were brutal for him. But he eventually got over it; he didn’t cry day after day so I really feel for you. The only exception was when he was in part-time Kindergarten and had to go to part-time care which would pick him up from school. The drop offs were so bad. He never got used to that place. Every year he gets more and more used to things changing and can handle them better. He had to be dragged in for the first couple of days of 1st grade; this year, he barely looked back at me.

[freezorburn]

Here's a book that you could maybe read with DD. The text is variations on "You go away ... and you come back." Situations in the illustrations show parents going to work and coming home, kids playing hide and seek, parent stepping out of child's sight at the store to get something (but the parent can see the child), drop off at school, etc. I'm sure there are other books like this. I think the book is pretty nifty. DS refused to look at it with me. But I might try again now that he is a beginning reader. 

You Go Away by Dorothy Corey

[2chatter]

The book that helped here was “I Love You All Day Long”. Good idea freezorburn. Side note - I am giving that book to DD when she graduates high school. She reads it to her siblings when they are having a hard time - like she read it to DS when I was in Chicago last weekend.

[olenka]

My D was very socially anxious around that age. She would also freeze up like a statue at any sign of conflict (if a kid took her toy...she would just freeze and let them). We ended up getting her evaluated through our school district's early childhood program. We ended up getting a therapist come in to her DC one day a week and work on role play in social situations. That went on for about 6 months, as when she turned 3 it was a different eval and she no longer qualified for services. But we see a marked improvement. She doesn't socialize with every kid in the room, but she has a handful of buddies. And the teachers tell me that she is the go-to kid when other kids want a hug or to get away from a stressful situation.

[traveltheworld]

Thanks everyone. I'll talk to our pediatrician and seek an evaluation/advice to see if there's a bigger underlying issue.

The thing is - she totally understands that we will come pick her up. She even asks at drop off who will do so and makes specific requests about who she wants to come get her and which stuff animal to bring when that person does. She stops crying once we leave, but she doesn't join the other kids and just plays by herself. She does engage with the teachers if one of them actively engages just her; but she's not great in a group setting. The teachers tell me that other than being very quiet, she does fine. It's just at home she's always upset if we mention "school".

olenka, do you remember what kind of therapist was it that you used? We used a child psychologist for DS at age 4 to get over some anxiety issues and I found it very helpful, but I'd think DD is too young for that as she wouldn't have the necessary language skills to communicate effectively how she's feeling.

[akafred]

Check out www.anxioustoddlers.com

[olenka]

traveltheworld, I looked the person up and she was actually an early childhood special ed teacher. We spoke with a number of people in the course of the eval, so they get a bit jumbled in my head.

[traveltheworld]

Nov 8, 2017 12:35:10 GMT -5 akafred said:

Check out www.anxioustoddlers.com

Thanks akafred!  The site looks interesting.  Now I'm dying to get home so I can listen.

[akafred]

Nov 8, 2017 14:44:22 GMT -5 traveltheworld said:

Nov 8, 2017 12:35:10 GMT -5 akafred said:

Check out www.anxioustoddlers.com

Thanks akafred!  The site looks interesting.  Now I'm dying to get home so I can listen.

Honestly the podcasts are more for older kids, but she has info for all ages on the site. I halfway want to move to Arizona to worship her...I mean have her be my kid's therapist.

[k3am]

I'm finding myself moving into very lazy parenting. She hates going to school, it sounds obnoxious and miserable for you guys. You have no compelling reason to send her, let alone send her full time for the sake of socializing her.

If I were you, I'd cut my losses and try again later. They're only little for so long. If she's fine and she's comfortable with the nanny and the nanny is working for you, let it work for a little longer.

[traveltheworld]

Nov 8, 2017 18:22:31 GMT -5 k3am said:

I'm finding myself moving into very lazy parenting. She hates going to school, it sounds obnoxious and miserable for you guys. You have no compelling reason to send her, let alone send her full time for the sake of socializing her.

If I were you, I'd cut my losses and try again later. They're only little for so long. If she's fine and she's comfortable with the nanny and the nanny is working for you, let it work for a little longer.

I hear ya.  I fretted so much with DS and he turned out fine.  The million dollar question is if DS turned out fine BECAUSE we did do all types of interventions and sought therapy, or whether he would have been fine regardless.  And if it's the former, my mom guilt makes me think we can't just drop the ball and let nature take its course when it comes to DD, so to speak.  I also have tremendous amounts of mom guilt because we moved because of my job, and we don't know any families with young kids here, so unlike it was with DS, unless I send her to DC, I have no other way to expose her to other kids other than paid  parented activities.

[freezorburn]

Does DD join in activities if it's just one or two other kids? Is the nanny able to help facilitate play dates when she is with her?

[traveltheworld]

freezorburn, I'm not entirely sure. I haven't had a chance to observe her with other kids in an unorganized activity for the past few months. Back in the summer she'd join other kids in the sand pit and play along-side the other child. Unfortunately our nanny hasn't found anyone that's the same age as DD yet. LOL - we've been so desperate to find "friends" for DD that I even asked DS to confirm which of his kindergarten friends have younger siblings. So far no luck.

[waverly]

Parallel play is still really common before 3. If you are wondering about early intervention and therapy I think they help a great deal, and if you did for your son I would do for your daughter.

You may want to hold off pulling her if you plan to see a therapist.

Otherwise I don't see daycare/ socializing as the same as early intervention/ therapy. I am sure with a kid in K and one entering preschool next year you will start making friends soon.

We've met people through class birthday parties, school events and cub scouts. You just have to put yourself out there and ask for that play date / phone number. Or send a note through the daycare.

[freezorburn]

Agree with everything waverly said.

Plus, keeping her in DC means more eyes on her, possibly in a variety of situations, that could provide helpful information for a therapist, if you decide to go that route.

[k3am]

If you think she's developmentally delayed/effected to the point of needing interventions, by all means, go for it. But if you think it's just a case of being shy? Even extremely shy? I'd be less inclined to make any big changes.