Gas tax — yea or nay

[goldengirlz]

One of the big issues on the California ballot this year is whether to repeal a recent gas tax. The money raised is supposed to go toward fixing roads and public transportation but we also have some of the highest gas prices in the country. And it’s become a rallying cry for the CA GOP.

H believes that anything that pushes people to drive less and allows investment in public transportation is a good thing.

I’m generally pro-tax for the greater good, but I feel like this one is particularly regressive. The people who are hardest hit often don’t have a choice but to live far from job centers and they may have jobs that can’t be done remotely or that involve lots of driving.

The fact that the GOP is making a big push around its repeal is giving me pause, but I feel like there are legitimate reasons to dislike it. What say you, CEP?

And since we like outside sources: www.google.com/amp/s/www.sfchronicle.com/politics/amp/Gas-tax-repeal-made-California-ballot-because-of-13279638.php

[pantsparty]

I don't agree with it, and I'm as Dem as they come. This is one of those taxes that hits the working class really hard. I've seen a lot of anger around it and people stating it's the sole reason they're voting for John Cox. I think most people know and agree that taxes are high in California, but something like a gas or sales tax sticks out like a sore thumb. Dems should be pushing for more taxes on higher earners.

[andwhat]

Nay. For the reasons pantsparty mentioned. It is completely regressive. The House voted to make the tax cuts for corporations permanent while everyone was absorbed with Kavanaugh and then they want to go raise a tax that will affect working class and middle class. We are quickly moving to a nation of poor and wealthy. period.

[penguingrrl]

I was in favor when NJ raised theirs a few years ago despite having concerns about the impact to those earning the least, but had a few reasons, including that our rate was the lowest in the nation, hadn’t gone up in 25+ years, and we’re still among the lowest. In CA, where there’s far less public transit infrastructure and often far greater commutes and the tax is already high I think it’s a terrible plan despite the possibility of discouraging driving.

[pantsparty]

I also think as Californians we're used to high taxes. We pay a lot of taxes, and I honestly don't mind. But we also hear California is operating under a budget surplus, so the natural reaction for many people is, "Well, why can't THAT money be used for roads? We pay enough in taxes!"

I'm aware that's not how the budget works, but it's a salty rub in a wound when prices on everything are rising.

[agnes]

My understanding is that if you vote yes on 6, it will also repeal SB1 and stop construction of the high speed rail

[agnes]

This article was interesting. In addition to the gas tax, there’s a surcharge that no one knows what it’s for?Repealing the gas tax won’t effect the surcharge.

www.google.com/amp/www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la-oe-borenstein-gas-tax-and-mystery-surcharge-20181011-story.html%3foutputType=amp

[mrs.jacinthe]

I'm ok with the gas tax, but I wish that they'd use the money to increase spending on good, reliable public transit, especially to the more outlying areas where low-wage-earners tend to live.

I'm not a fan of the repeal because they're using it to sneak other things by, like agnes pointed out. You want to repeal the gas tax? FINE. But don't try to sneak other shit into the measure without being up front about it. For that reason, I'm a no. But I understand why others would vote yes.

[gretchenindisguise]

I'm just annoyed because the only Diane Harkey sign I've seen also references the gas tax and ties them together, even though they are separate issues.

[suburbanzookeeper]

PDQ, may delete later.

POOF

[pinkdutchtulips]

Nay ... it's regressive and penalizes those who can't afford to live close to work.

I commuted 2 hrs one way bc I couldn't afford to live closer to my job. The amount of money I spent on gas was INSANE!

[heyjude]

Yay. Ca roads are falling apart and already many good projects have been funded from the revenue, from critical road repair to green alt transportation projects.

[tiramisu]

Yea because I've seen the road work that's finally started since this passed and also see how much more there still is to do, too. Even though it's regressive, I think we have to find a way to support infrastructure funding. This isn't a perfect answer, but I think it's the best we have right now. Especially with the add ons in the repeal.

[sillygoosegirl]

I'm all for gas taxes. I think it's really important, because otherwise we are further subsidizing urban sprawl and climate change. Yes, it's regressive, which is an unfortunate truth, but the solution to that, IMO, is to make other taxes, like the income tax, more progressive, with negative tax rates for the lowest income people.

Also, cutting public transportation budgets is *also* regressive as it disproportionately hurts poor people, who are less likely to have other options for getting around if service to their area is reduced or eliminated.

[heyjude]

The tax is also pumping a ton of money into the economy already, creating jobs due to all the projects, and eventually will save drivers money in car repair costs due to less shitty roadways. I don’t think you can just write it off as a regressive tax because it does so much for the state.

[heyjude]

Final thought, Ca has always had gas taxes. It’s how the state has paid for transportation infrastructure throughout the decades. So the tax is nothing new. The problem is that as cars have improved fuel efficieny the revenues from the gas tax have decreased. Leaving less money to pay for roads. Which is why the roads are a mess.

[goldengirlz]

Oct 14, 2018 14:30:03 GMT -5 heyjude said:

Final thought, Ca has always had gas taxes. It’s how the state has paid for transportation infrastructure throughout the decades. So the tax is nothing new. The problem is that as cars have improved fuel efficieny the revenues from the gas tax have decreased. Leaving less money to pay for roads. Which is why the roads are a mess.

You and agnes have convinced me, but this point could also support the argument that the tax is increasingly regressive. Perhaps it’s because I live in a part of the state where the number of Teslas on the road is astounding, but it seems like wealthier people are the ones most easily skirting the tax through their car purchases, leaving poorer people with the most pain at the pump.

Either way, if people are using less gas overall (which is a good thing), then paying for transportation infrastructure through gas taxes is going to be increasingly unsustainable and the state is going to need to rethink its budget strategy. But it does seem to be the best option in the short-term.

[tiramisu]

The other thing is that Prop 6 isn't just about repealing the gas tax. It also makes it harder for any vehicle-related fees to be set or raised. From the brief review at the event I attended today, it sounds really problematic.

[heyjude]

Oct 14, 2018 14:49:04 GMT -5 goldengirlz said:

Oct 14, 2018 14:30:03 GMT -5 heyjude said:

Final thought, Ca has always had gas taxes. It’s how the state has paid for transportation infrastructure throughout the decades. So the tax is nothing new. The problem is that as cars have improved fuel efficieny the revenues from the gas tax have decreased. Leaving less money to pay for roads. Which is why the roads are a mess.

You and agnes have convinced me, but this point could also support the argument that the tax is increasingly regressive. Perhaps it’s because I live in a part of the state where the number of Teslas on the road is astounding, but it seems like wealthier people are the ones most easily skirting the tax through their car purchases, leaving poorer people with the most pain at the pump.

Either way, if people are using less gas overall (which is a good thing), then paying for transportation infrastructure through gas taxes is going to be increasingly unsustainable and the state is going to need to rethink its budget strategy. But it does seem to be the best option in the short-term.

Oh there has definely been other ideas tossed around: plans to pay extra registration based on mileage, higher taxes on 0 emissions cars, etc.

And it’s not just all the Tesla’s on the road. It’s that ALL cars are more fuel efficient today than they were in say the 1970s.