Just need to vent this somewhere...

[SwimDeep]

I don't make enough money...

And the money I do make all goes to bills. Student loans, a personal loan, medical bills, and credit card debt. I don't feel like I'll ever get out from underneath all of it.

We got our tax return back, and H and I had agreed that I would give him 25% of it and use the other 75% of it to pay down debt. Well, he asked last night if I had done that. And I said yes - but apparently I paid off the wrong debt. I paid off a credit card, paid down my student loans, and saved a good bit. Because I just wanted that security of having something in savings.

But that's not what we talked about doing. So H is upset with me.

And now I'm upset because I feel like no matter what I do it's not right. 

Damn it. I liked my little savings account. I guess I'll put it towards my personal loan.

Adulting sucks.

[mags]

Well, since you discussed what to do with it, why did you do something else? Did you forget or change your mind?

[WOUNDTIGHT]

I’m confused. Do you keep your finances separate? You “giving” him 25% of your return makes me think yes. But then if you do keep them separate, what business is it of is if you decide to save some? Either you make the decisions together or your don’t.

[SwimDeep]

Our finances are separate.

And I just forgot that's what we said we were going to do with the return. I'm just tired of being paycheck-to-paycheck...It was nice to have a little something extra in my account for a while.

I've straightened everything out this morning. And I realize I'm the one at fault here.

[tiramisu]

It's important to stick to what was discussed, but at the same time I'd like to hear how your husband handled what he said. Also, did you ever bring up before wanting to put some in savings? Or did you two discuss specifically what you were going to pay down? And does he give you any of his tax return? I understand your finances are separate, but does he live paycheck to paycheck, or is that only you?

[SwimDeep]

tiramisu... well...

I did not bring up putting anything into savings. I just did it. I got excited about my part of the tax return - completely forgetting what we had discussed, which was (apparently) paying down my personal loan (which has the highest interest rate). I'm managing my credit card debt by bouncing the balances from 0% card to 0% card and paying it off as I can, but I took the opportunity to pay off one of the lower balances, something I thought we had agreed on, but he doesn't remember that part of the discussion.

I'm trying to find a nice way to say this...my H didn't explode or anything, but he was upset that I didn't handle the money in the way that he thought we had discussed. Partly because of the movie we were watching (Ben Is Back), I felt like the dirty, lying addict. And I shut down. When I shut down, he panics and communicates harder, which pushes me deeper into my shell.

I recognize a couple of bigger pictures here.

First, our finances are separate, but he still gets to tell me what I do with mine. I do not get to tell him what he does with his. He is the furthest thing from paycheck to paycheck. He could pay off all my debt today. But he won't because he feels it would reinforce my bad behavior (his words).

Second, our communication...he's a bully, and I don't stand up for myself. I don't communicate my needs/wants, and I don't participate in difficult (emotional) conversations. I'll sit there and cry. But I won't talk.

I'm trying not to bring too many of my feelings into this, because really finances shouldn't be about feelings. If I had followed through with what we discussed, this wouldn't even be an issue. I need to be better at communicating my needs (needing to have something in savings to feel better about my personal finances) and remembering major discussions about things like finances (I tend to tune them out because they cause me anxiety).

...I'm making excuses for him...one of these days I'm just going to let loose...

[lexus]

I’m a lurker but... have you heard of EFT? Emotionally Focused Therapy really helped my h and I to understand our patterns of communication. I wish we had heard of it sooner!

[SwimDeep]

Mar 25, 2019 0:12:35 GMT -5 lexus said:

I’m a lurker but... have you heard of EFT? Emotionally Focused Therapy really helped my h and I to understand our patterns of communication. I wish we had heard of it sooner!

Haven't heard of it, but I'm going to look it up now. Thanks!

[tiramisu]

SwimDeep I told you this a long time ago, I think, but I don't like what you've told us about your husband. What you're describing sounds like emotionally abusive behavior. He's treating you like a child and I don't know whether you've ever gotten the message from anyone that you're allowed to be and okay enough to be an adult on your own. Yes, you struggle. Yes, there are things you need help with. Yes, you don't do the right thing all the time. No one does! But the way you describe his financial treatment of you is infantilizing. He makes you live paycheck to paycheck *and* makes you give him some of your tax return because he thinks you've made such poor choices you need to be punished with this struggle instead of helping you and truly planning together (which would not leave you feeling so damn shamed). That 25% you gave him could've gone into your savings instead. It's almost like he doesn't really want you to get back on your feet financially, at least not enough to be independent. Does he give you any of his tax return? And was this truly a discussion, or was he dictating to you what he wanted you to do and you went with it because it was easier.

I consistently see you place all of the blame on yourself and very little, if any, on him. I know there are a lot of complicating factors, but this is a guy who has tried to dictate your relationships with and even reactions to your family.

[mags]

100% tiramisu

[tiramisu]

Some information for you, SwimDeep, just to see if any of it resonates:

nnedv.org/content/about-financial-abuse/

www.verywellmind.com/financial-abuse-4155224

[downtoearth]

I am not an expert at finances. I did handle almost all of the finances and bills for STBXH and I and I would get frustrated if we were out of money due to something he spent a bunch on or if he wanted to spend a tax return or bonus on something I deemed "non-necessary" - that being said. What you have described seems really unhealthy - you shouldn't feel like a lesser just b/c you make less and don't manage money the same way (even if it's seen as poorly). The finances should be something you both have to compromise on AND you should not be punished to keep debt if he can pay it off and help handle your money from here on out. He's wasting both your (collective) money by making debt something that is basically a punishment for you AND he's missing the point of a partnership where he could be taking the lead and growing your (collective) assets/money if he has the skills to do that. I think he has his own money issues he needs to work through also. I hope you find a counselor/therapist who can help you two get on the same page so you can reduce your anxiety and he can reduce his own neurosis around finances.

[SwimDeep]

tiramisu, thank you for the resources... I've read them, and I do see some signs of financial abuse in my relationship.

I'm feeling a little defensive. I feel like I should clarify that the 25% of the tax return that H took was his part of the tax return - we filed jointly. He wasn't taking "my" money.

Everything else I'm very mixed up about...and defensive, so I'm going to take some time to think about all this.

Thanks guys

[tiramisu]

SwimDeep thank you for clarifying that. I knew when I said it that there was a chance it could make you feel defensive. That's not my intent. I've just seen so many signs for so long and something recently happened that makes it hard for me to hold my tongue. No woman deserves to be abused. Emotional and is so often not taken seriously as a form of abuse because there are no bruises, but it's a very damaging form of abuse. From what I remember, he treats you better than your family of origin (or at least your parents?). But you deserve to be treated well, not just better than you were. This really does come from a place of care and concern. I appreciate that you recognize your defensiveness and are trying to not react from that. My PMs are always open for you.

[mags]

First, our finances are separate, but he still gets to tell me what I do with mine. I do not get to tell him what he does with his.

This says so much!