I can’t speak for all hospital systems, but I know we had several months of supply available. We are down Significantly and burning through inventory at way faster rates. Manufacturers sent everything they had to China in early January when we were putting in our orders to stock up in prep for the pandemic. Our orders have been waiting and we having been offering premium amounts and lobbying HAS been done - Cheeto head has been making comments about pressing manufacturers to increase supply with incentives.
If the lobbying has been done, then my trade organizations are not doing a good job of keeping me informed. I get it though, their emails have all been about how we are going to save our livelihoods. Everyone I know is panicking about how they are going to keep their practices afloat and owners are crying about having to lay off their staff. I've lived through some previous financially damaging traumatic times prior to this so I am somewhat already prepared to handle this emotionally and financially. That stuff isn't phasing me right now so I'm sitting here thinking about other issues and how we have failed as a country. So much so that I am ready to go out and vote D down the ballot. I have never felt that way before.
I would like to see an email from Aetna et. al. about how they are responding to this healthcare crisis, the industry that they insure. And real efforts on how they are helping the doctors on the front lines, not some lame email about how they are protecting their workers so they sent everyone to work from home (is this why people from the US have suddenly been answering my calls when I call the provider hotline when previously it was people in the Philippines?). My inbox has been radio silent while everyone else from Starbucks to my credit card processor keep me in the loop about how they are responding.
Unions are absolutely allowed in Texas as others have stated.
But (unwelcome comment on this board), fully research what unions will help you with and what they won’t.
The flexibility my employer has in trying to help workers would go away if we had to negotiate with unions, because then every decision would have to go through contract terms.
Over 500 ADA requests at this point so we are mandating you managers : find a safer option for this person. If it means floating them to a safer unit, do it, and let us know what you and the employee decided.
Floating nurses from one unit to another is often a contracted item for unionized nurses. So if the contract says floating out has to go through X process, we would have to tell nurses that want to work that they need to go home and use their PTO until we go through their ADA process AND the contracted process before we could find them a place to work. That would easily be two weeks because the normal ADA process takes several days PER REQUEST in order to meet all the provisions of the law. Our practice of saying that we will believe you without physician certification for now in order to fast track a safe assignment, and deal with people who abuse the process and don’t have valid medical conditions later - that would have to go. And we DO have nurses who are pissed that it is taking us a day or two to get to their request and they can’t just work it out with their manager.
That is just one example.
I can’t speak for all hospital systems, but I know we had several months of supply available. We are down Significantly and burning through inventory at way faster rates. Manufacturers sent everything they had to China in early January when we were putting in our orders to stock up in prep for the pandemic. Our orders have been waiting and we having been offering premium amounts and lobbying HAS been done - Cheeto head has been making comments about pressing manufacturers to increase supply with incentives.
We have shut down all elective services, which are the money makers, to preserve equipment. We have employees who are pissed about that. They may want to unionize so in the future we can’t so quickly shut down their operations for the benefit of inpatient units.
I absolutely get the desire to unionize when you feel your employer doesn’t care about protecting you. And it may be the right decision for some. But definitely consider ALL the factors that would come into play if every staffing decision had to be managed through a contract. There are pro’s and con’s on both sides. And as I listed up thread, you have a lot of legal rights available for you to exercise without a union too. Consider what a union contract would help with and hurt at this time and make the right decision for yourself.
I've walked away several times when you've talked Michelle, because I want to think your heart is in the right place. But THIS is why you cannot trust HR. HR is NOT there to protect the worker. HR exists to protect the company and the bottom line. Their job is not to serve the human resources of a company, their job is to keep the human resources in line. No matter how an individual may feel, the concept of HR is to serve the bottom line.
Find a union, join it, and get every.single.person. you can to join it with you. Then you will take the power away from the company and put it in your hands. "your" employers are putting you at risk to save others, and while that is noble, and important, and we need you, and we respect you and are eternally grateful for all of you, you can't save someone if you're dead.
*disclaimer I am not a health care professional, I am a teacher, and in one of the strongest unions in the country next to the teamsters.
I've walked away several times when you've talked Michelle, because I want to think your heart is in the right place. But THIS is why you cannot trust HR. HR is NOT there to protect the worker. HR exists to protect the company and the bottom line. Their job is not to serve the human resources of a company, their job is to keep the human resources in line. No matter how an individual may feel, the concept of HR is to serve the bottom line.
Find a union, join it, and get every.single.person. you can to join it with you. Then you will take the power away from the company and put it in your hands. "your" employers are putting you at risk to save others, and while that is noble, and important, and we need you, and we respect you and are eternally grateful for all of you, you can't save someone if you're dead.
*disclaimer I am not a health care professional, I am a teacher, and in one of the strongest unions in the country next to the teamsters.
*clap clap clap*
I am not union. ND doesn't really do nursing unions. Except I think Bismarck might be part of the MN union? Idk, something like that. But I'm from MN where we have a *very* strong nursing union and I have many friends who work in CA with an even stronger nursing union.
Let me tell you what it's like to not have a union...as a nurse.
The last time I had a meal break was December 2018.
The last time I had a truly unsafe assignment was....last week.
The last time we had enough staff for any given shift was....July 2017. We regularly have candidates decline the position because they want to work in a union hospital.
Whereas staffing ratios exist in MN, we have none. Our norm is a 2 vent assignment. In many places in MN, a vent is a 1:1 assignment. We are threatened that our usual 1:1 assignments, such as CRRT, are going to be doubled.
Any time we submit a safety report (i.e. daily), we're harassed for doing so.
This month's mandatory education and staff meeting was spent coaching us on how to complete the NDNQI (national database of nursing quality indicators) because our scores have been so awful for as long as I've worked in the ICU.
We have the same COL/profile as the MSP area, but are paid 10-15 dollars less per hour
Don't come in here and say that this is solely due to MY hospital system. Because it's not.
Nurses are regularly shit on by their hospital system. No one ever has enough nurses, I get that. But UNIONS help prevent all of the above issues.
Unions are absolutely allowed in Texas as others have stated.
But (unwelcome comment on this board), fully research what unions will help you with and what they won’t.
The flexibility my employer has in trying to help workers would go away if we had to negotiate with unions, because then every decision would have to go through contract terms.
Over 500 ADA requests at this point so we are mandating you managers : find a safer option for this person. If it means floating them to a safer unit, do it, and let us know what you and the employee decided.
Floating nurses from one unit to another is often a contracted item for unionized nurses. So if the contract says floating out has to go through X process, we would have to tell nurses that want to work that they need to go home and use their PTO until we go through their ADA process AND the contracted process before we could find them a place to work. That would easily be two weeks because the normal ADA process takes several days PER REQUEST in order to meet all the provisions of the law. Our practice of saying that we will believe you without physician certification for now in order to fast track a safe assignment, and deal with people who abuse the process and don’t have valid medical conditions later - that would have to go. And we DO have nurses who are pissed that it is taking us a day or two to get to their request and they can’t just work it out with their manager.
That is just one example.
I can’t speak for all hospital systems, but I know we had several months of supply available. We are down Significantly and burning through inventory at way faster rates. Manufacturers sent everything they had to China in early January when we were putting in our orders to stock up in prep for the pandemic. Our orders have been waiting and we having been offering premium amounts and lobbying HAS been done - Cheeto head has been making comments about pressing manufacturers to increase supply with incentives.
We have shut down all elective services, which are the money makers, to preserve equipment. We have employees who are pissed about that. They may want to unionize so in the future we can’t so quickly shut down their operations for the benefit of inpatient units.
I absolutely get the desire to unionize when you feel your employer doesn’t care about protecting you. And it may be the right decision for some. But definitely consider ALL the factors that would come into play if every staffing decision had to be managed through a contract. There are pro’s and con’s on both sides. And as I listed up thread, you have a lot of legal rights available for you to exercise without a union too. Consider what a union contract would help with and hurt at this time and make the right decision for yourself.
I've walked away several times when you've talked Michelle, because I want to think your heart is in the right place. But THIS is why you cannot trust HR. HR is NOT there to protect the worker. HR exists to protect the company and the bottom line. Their job is not to serve the human resources of a company, their job is to keep the human resources in line. No matter how an individual may feel, the concept of HR is to serve the bottom line.
Find a union, join it, and get every.single.person. you can to join it with you. Then you will take the power away from the company and put it in your hands. "your" employers are putting you at risk to save others, and while that is noble, and important, and we need you, and we respect you and are eternally grateful for all of you, you can't save someone if you're dead.
*disclaimer I am not a health care professional, I am a teacher, and in one of the strongest unions in the country next to the teamsters.
As a child of a union Cooper mine welder on strike for 2 years when I was a toddler and preschooler, who was grateful for canned beans when we could afford them because the union wasn’t doing shit for us, who ate meat maybe once a month because my mom’s second job helped pay for it, and whose dad later decided to cross a picket line due to union corruption (the company wanted a brand of welding gloves with higher safety ratings; the union officials wanted a brand that just happened to be owned by his brother’s company, and hundreds were on strike over it) I have VERY personal experience with the downside of unions. My family had to relocate because of violence threatened on us because my dad put his family before the corrupt union boss. He moved the family to a decertified mine where there are no unions.
If you read my post, you see I said READ ALL SIDES AND MAKE THE DECISION RIGHT FOR YOU.
And fuck that person that said my post was BS. Ask the UB40 nurses in Houston who didn’t know their rights on both sides and sued their hospital for not making sure they knew their rights, and who got roped into being in a union when they didn’t want one.
You are stupid if you don’t consider all of the impact before jumping on a bandwagon - either way.
FFS, Michelle,would you just stop? As frontline clinicians we are stressed out enough dealing with this crisis. We are trying to support each other in this thread and the last thing we need is a fight with HR. I don't disagree with everything you said and, in fact, where I work many of us oppose unionization for some of the reasons you mentioned. But we're working our asses off, stressed as hell and you coming in here with your "I know better than you " attitude is NOT helping.
FFS, Michelle,would you just stop? As frontline clinicians we are stressed out enough dealing with this crisis. We are trying to support each other in this thread and the last thing we need is a fight with HR. I don't disagree with everything you said and, in fact, where I work many of us oppose unionization for some of the reasons you mentioned. But we're working our asses off, stressed as hell and you coming in here with your "I know better than you " attitude is NOT helping.
read into it how you want. I am not saying I know better - but I do know a different side. I am going to back out because every damn thing I say gets twisted and HR as a whole profession is defamed when a lot of us are in it to do the right thing and that is fucked up when there are clearly questions I have answered so people know their rights.
Post by wanderingback on Mar 22, 2020 12:16:01 GMT -5
So it seems like things are getting worse and worse here, but at least it's to be expected. Our inpatient and ICUs are filling up. My friend said they are at the capacity they usually see at the height of flu season. I think PPE is getting sent in to the city, so at least that's a sense of hopefulness, but we'll see how much actually arrives and how long it lasts.
As far as my clinic goes, I'm not in administration, but it seems like we're adapting ok. Telemedicine should start full swing this week. I think I'll only go in to the clinic once a week and then do my other job providing abortion care 1-2x per week. Abortion clinics have consolidated services.
I can walk to 1 of my jobs, but the other one I typically take the subway. Last week the subway was completely empty in the morning, so I was feeling good about that, but by the evening when I returned home it was full and I certainly wasn't socially distanced. I don't know if I should consider taking a lyft on those days, but we're in hardcore not spending any money mode right now since my SO has no income and don't have enough to cover our bills.
As far as telemedicine goes we've set up some pretty good protocols for reproductive health care like prescribing birth control, how to do medication abortions and prenatal care with as little in-person visits as possible, so feeling good about that. If anyone wants some of our documents just PM me and I'll gladly share.
I think PPE is getting sent in to the city, so at least that's a sense of hopefulness, but we'll see how much actually arrives and how long it lasts.
That's good to hear. My husband's hospital is supposed to be an epicenter for COVID patients in the area and they are woefully under stocked. His department (radiology) has enough supplies at the moment, but in the ED apparently everyone is given one gown at the beginning of shift and expected to where that same gown for the entire shift. he is able to walk or bike to work, so ayt least transportation is not an issue. I work in the suburbs so I drive. I normally work in an outpatient clinic which is temporarily shifting to telehealth. Unfortunately, while my colleagues are doing that, I've been deployed to inpatient coverage. I had a few days off, so I'm not sure what to expect when I return tomorrow. Our administration has been having daily virtual town halls. I haven't been able to watch any yet, but maybe i can find time this week.
I think PPE is getting sent in to the city, so at least that's a sense of hopefulness, but we'll see how much actually arrives and how long it lasts.
That's good to hear. My husband's hospital is supposed to be an epicenter for COVID patients in the area and they are woefully under stocked. His department (radiology) has enough supplies at the moment, but in the ED apparently everyone is given one gown at the beginning of shift and expected to where that same gown for the entire shift. he is able to walk or bike to work, so ayt least transportation is not an issue. I work in the suburbs so I drive. I normally work in an outpatient clinic which is temporarily shifting to telehealth. Unfortunately, while my colleagues are doing that, I've been deployed to inpatient coverage. I had a few days off, so I'm not sure what to expect when I return tomorrow. Our administration has been having daily virtual town halls. I haven't been able to watch any yet, but maybe i can find time this week.
The constant changes have been hard to keep up with. Good luck on switching to inpatient for now! I hope it's an easy (ish) transition.
Yeah, they are really powerless in this situation. No protection and do get thrown under the bus as well. At least RNs have the union.
Not all hospitals are union. I am not at a union hospital.
ETA: I see that's been mentioned many times. I am not in Texas though.
Sorry! I should have said I was talking about Washington/local hospitals. Thank you for letting me know. I'm really bad at thinking something and not putting it into words
Just to be clear, my comment about unions in Texas was specifically to refute the statement “unions aren’t allowed in Texas.” The rest of this thread is certainly above my pay grade. Good luck to all our healthcare workers and providers here. Y’all have been handed a shitty deal and I respect your positions and the work you’re doing. ❤️
wanderingbacktacocatSaudade and any other healthcare provider I'm missing. This article in the New Yorker is fantastic. Even though it has been said that surgical masks aren't enough protection, this article says otherwise. My institution is telling us we can't wear masks, but I will be wearing one for all patient interactions.
Summary-- Hong Kong and Singapore have flattened the curve by various methods that we are not using. A big one is wearing a surgical mask for all patient care.
wanderingbacktacocatSaudade and any other healthcare provider I'm missing. This article in the New Yorker is fantastic. Even though it has been said that surgical masks aren't enough protection, this article says otherwise. My institution is telling us we can't wear masks, but I will be wearing one for all patient interactions.
Summary-- Hong Kong and Singapore have flattened the curve by various methods that we are not using. A big one is wearing a surgical mask for all patient care.
I skimmed it and want to go back and read it more later but I wonder how this would work specifically on my unit.
@@@@ I work in pediatric oncology and what we do on our unit varies from the rest of the hospital. We have really strict policies about staff not wearing masks unless we are in a viral room or doing a procedure that requires them. This comes from the theory that if you think you need a mask you shouldn't be there. It would be such a huge culture shift from a group that is not great at change, lol. I will read it again later tonight, thanks for posting!
wanderingback - thank you for all you are doing! I hope you guys get the PPE that you need. The commute thing is hard, how often is it?
Well our schedule is still in flux with all the changes, so I'm trying to get clarity on that. Sometimes it's up to 3 times per week, but I think it'll be down to 1-2 times per week for now. Right now I'd only have to take public transport on Sat this week. I think 1 way with lyft would be about $35 which I guess in the grand scheme of things is ok to protect my health instead by putting on my credit card.
For now I think our clinic is sticking with no PPE except for gloves for healthy patients to preserve things, but we'll see if that changes once more supplies hopefully arrive throughout the city.
Two big hospitals here in town are moving towards PPE at all times when in the hospital. My institution has said they will alter their guidelines in the next couple of days. H isn't waiting and is already is having his department do so.
He made that decision based on the article I posted and info from colleagues across the world and country.
Two big hospitals here in town are moving towards PPE at all times when in the hospital. My institution has said they will alter their guidelines in the next couple of days. H isn't waiting and is already is having his department do so.
He made that decision based on the article I posted and info from colleagues across the world and country.
Wear a mask. Wash your hands. Be safe everyone.
One of our faculty tried to implement that in our department and admin came down swiftly saying there was no need and it was wasteful/to stop immediately.
He also was reported by a nurse for wearing an N95.
And Delta Dental of NJ just emailed us to remind us that the state dental association has asked dentists to submit your inventory. This is the first peep from them about anything related to this crisis.
My reaction to this is just a string of unkind expletives. They are the worst.
My husband said his hospital just got more PPE, so that's a good thing. Unfortunately people are calling out left and right so they're working with a limited workforce. At my job we're doing okay staffwise (for now). Today each employee was given a surgical mask and we were told we each get this one and that's it, so we must choose wisely when we use it. I feel like I'm in a dystopian video game.
My husband said his hospital just got more PPE, so that's a good thing. Unfortunately people are calling out left and right so they're working with a limited workforce. At my job we're doing okay staffwise (for now). Today each employee was given a surgical mask and we were told we each get this one and that's it, so we must choose wisely when we use it. I feel like I'm in a dystopian video game.
Holy crap. I’m sorry you have to make such a tough decision. More power and all the good thoughts for you to make it through this.
My husband said his hospital just got more PPE, so that's a good thing. Unfortunately people are calling out left and right so they're working with a limited workforce. At my job we're doing okay staffwise (for now). Today each employee was given a surgical mask and we were told we each get this one and that's it, so we must choose wisely when we use it. I feel like I'm in a dystopian video game.
Glad your husband's hospital got more PPE. Sorry that you have to re-use surgical masks What a mess.
Next week I start seeing patients specifically with respiratory complaints. I think our clinic is ok with PPE for now, but not sure how long that's going to last. I assume I'll be wearing the same N95 throughout the day.
The past 2 weeks I've been doing mostly phone and video visits and only seeing "healthy" patients in-person. My SO is back at our other house for now, so I don't have to worry about him. I think my family is more freaked out about this, so I'm not sure if I'm even going to tell them that I'm going to start seeing respiratory patients going forward. I don't want their anxiety to transfer to me.
My husband said his hospital just got more PPE, so that's a good thing. Unfortunately people are calling out left and right so they're working with a limited workforce. At my job we're doing okay staffwise (for now). Today each employee was given a surgical mask and we were told we each get this one and that's it, so we must choose wisely when we use it. I feel like I'm in a dystopian video game.
Yup, I was given two n95 masks and told to read the instructions before I was allowed to wear them. But no guidance about when we should choose to wear it. It does feel like you described.
Got an email from our leadership today about emailing them re: potential exposures and the wording sounded a bit "victim blame-y" for lack of a better way to phrase it. Things like asking us to say what protective measures we did take, which ones we weren't able to take and why. We were also told that we're considered at low risk because we're not expected to physically touch clients.
I had my first orthodontic "emergency" procedure. I had my assistant cut a poking wire on a current patient. It took her like 2 seconds. She wore her usual level 1 mask and gloves and face shield in lieu of goggles. The only thing extra she did was a use a gown because we happened to have one hanging in our lab. It took me longer to have the patient sign a special "don't sue me because I saw you during COVID" consent form and had to go through the "do you have a fever or cough, have you been traveling, etc." screening questions. I've seen colleagues out there dressing up in what look like hazmat suits to cut a pokey wire while our physicians who are seeing people who might actually have COVID are working without PPE. Others are claiming they are just solving all their problems remotely. I weighed my choices and decided this particular wire would have been difficult for the patient to cut by herself via a "remote consult." I also stopped by a patient's house on my way home to drop off some wax. She said her mom had foot surgery last week and couldn't drive so could we please mail her some and I said I'll do you one better.