Michigan governor kidnapping plot

[kadams767]

Oct 8, 2020 14:21:28 GMT -5 mbcdefg said:

Oct 8, 2020 14:15:08 GMT -5 @peep said:

As next-level nuts as this is, I'm just waiting for Trump and the right to defend them, ala Kyle Rittenhouse.

This is some next-level insanity.  Basically implying that her disagreement with Trump brought this on?  Unbelievable.  

[AAM2012]

Terrifying!

[Beeps (WOT?*)]

Gov. Inslee as well. There is a groundswell of support for his opponent, not just because Inslee mandated masks and closed businesses, but that didn't help.

The Governor debate last night between the two had an entire series of comments from Culp whistling to QAnon

SPOILER: Click to show

He was discussing child trafficking as something Inslee isn't handling, as the topic and hashtag have become synonymous with QAnon on social media.
He's a high school dropout that worked in construction then moved back to a small town to become sheriff of a department of three people, that eventually went down to a one-person department. He was also part of an investigation that is now the subject of a civil suit because of his and others failure to investigate; he never even reported the matter to the proper authorities - he simply dismissed the complaint and the person making it. He's trash and he's got people rooting for him and voting for him and excusing him. And he's supported by Proud Boys as well as QAnon type folks and others of that similar ilk.
Our new sheriff (currently facing a recall for re-hiring two officers terminated for cause for excessive force and a wrongful shooting) is also Proud Boy supported (if not one himself.)
As is the mayor of the neighboring town running against a very respected (Black) State Rep. former police officer and sheriff of one of the largest departments in our state. Also Proud Boy supported, armed and "ready to defend our small towns." As they proved over Memorial Day Weekend when they came out in force to "defend" our town from the "rioting anarchists" coming to burn down businesses in small town America. He just posted a meme a few days ago of a toy car running over protesters and tried to excuse it as "peaceful protesters climbing on the hood of a car."

These are scary times for anybody with a lick of sense.

[susquehanna]

They discussed it over Facebook. A private group, but still. How stupid can you be?

[Beeps (WOT?*)]

Oct 8, 2020 14:26:46 GMT -5 kadams767 said:

Oct 8, 2020 14:21:28 GMT -5 mbcdefg said:

This is some next-level insanity.  Basically implying that her disagreement with Trump brought this on?  Unbelievable.  

Well, in a way it did, because his supporters are as nuts as he is.
Not victim-blaming at all. There's no way to defend against their nuts without being complicitly silent and amenable, lest they come after you. Because they will if they are aimed that direction.

[taratru]

goldengirlz mentioned it upthread, but this is where my mind goes when I think about scenarios post-election. How many of these groups are out there? How many are "on call" to defend their leader? How many are going to take the first chance they get to do damage?

[Beeps (WOT?*)]

taratru

Per Wiki, about 165 per the SPLC. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_militia_organizations_in_the_United_States

And I think this list is *very* light. Idaho isn't mentioned as far as I can see, and it's a hotbed of militia. Several in WA are also not mentioned.

Oh, and our sheriff is a member of Constitutional Sheriffs iirc. He at least states he's a "Constitutional sheriff" because he follows the constitution rather than the unconstitutional dictates of a fascist governor. (His words, not mine.)

[goldengirlz]

Oct 8, 2020 14:21:28 GMT -5 mbcdefg said:

Oct 8, 2020 14:15:08 GMT -5 @peep said:

As next-level nuts as this is, I'm just waiting for Trump and the right to defend them, ala Kyle Rittenhouse.

The fuck???

This is ... not how you condemn terrorists. It’s like saying we brought 9/11 on ourselves by refusing to have love in our hearts for bin Laden.

ETA: Actually, no. It’s not like that all. It’s about the bright red lines we should never cross in our country because they’re how about who we are as a nation and our humanity. Those lines include hate crimes, violence against our country and fellow countrymen, and undermining the democratic process.

And Trump and his ilk have crossed ALL of them.

[cville]

This is the sort of thing that would occupy a news cycle for days and have me truly shaken in 2015.

This year, I'm so numb and news is happening so quickly, who knows for how long people will talk about it? It's also both appalling and wholly unsurprising. This is what you get when you have a leader who foments rebellion and white supremacy.

[cattledogkisses]

Oct 8, 2020 14:51:49 GMT -5 taratru said:

goldengirlz mentioned it upthread, but this is where my mind goes when I think about scenarios post-election. How many of these groups are out there? How many are "on call" to defend their leader? How many are going to take the first chance they get to do damage?

I've been thinking about this more and more lately, and also, how often do I unknowingly interact with someone who supports these alt-right terrorist groups?  It makes my skin crawl.

[Captain Catnip]

Oct 8, 2020 15:10:06 GMT -5 cattledogkisses said:

Oct 8, 2020 14:51:49 GMT -5 taratru said:

goldengirlz mentioned it upthread, but this is where my mind goes when I think about scenarios post-election. How many of these groups are out there? How many are "on call" to defend their leader? How many are going to take the first chance they get to do damage?

I've been thinking about this more and more lately, and also, how often do I unknowingly interact with someone who supports these alt-right terrorist groups?  It makes my skin crawl.

I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if the security guard at my workplace believes it all.

[lust2hart]

Beeps (WOT?*), can you please @ your long post?

This is disgusting. Reminds me of Gabby Giffords.

[Deleted]

Oct 8, 2020 15:12:28 GMT -5 lust2hart said:

Beeps (WOT?*), can you please @ your long post?

This is disgusting. Reminds me of Gabby Giffords.

Unfortunately, yes. That was local to me and I remember thinking the toxic, divisive rhetoric of the time was partly to blame, and hoping it would be a turning point back towards a more decent time. How.fucking.naive.of.me. 😢

[rubytue]

Oct 8, 2020 15:10:06 GMT -5 cattledogkisses said:

Oct 8, 2020 14:51:49 GMT -5 taratru said:

goldengirlz mentioned it upthread, but this is where my mind goes when I think about scenarios post-election. How many of these groups are out there? How many are "on call" to defend their leader? How many are going to take the first chance they get to do damage?

I've been thinking about this more and more lately, and also, how often do I unknowingly interact with someone who supports these alt-right terrorist groups?  It makes my skin crawl.

I have a coworker who we are all pretty sure does. He has BENGAZI!! Bumper stickers on his Jeep, which is fully decked out like a prepper. And he is a full on anti-government, “socialism” is scary.
 

ironically, we work at a regulatory agency, and his wife works at... wait for it....



social sercurity.

[susquehanna]

I read earlier that they planned to take her to Wisconsin.

Well, I just learned through Google that her summer home is on the Lower Peninsula. So, they would have had to take her to the Upper Peninsula in order to get to Wisconsin, unless they traveled by boat. Well, I bet that if the Governor of Michigan were kidnapped, one of the very first things that would happen is that they would shut down the Mackinac Bridge.

Edit: There is a summer residence for the Governor on Mackinac Island. But, again, they would need to have use of a boat. Or else, they would have to take her across to one of the peninsulas on the ferry!

[cap]

Oct 8, 2020 16:53:09 GMT -5 susquehanna said:

I read earlier that they planned to take her to Wisconsin.

Well, I just learned through Google that her summer home is on the Lower Peninsula. So, they would have had to take her to the Upper Peninsula in order to get to Wisconsin, unless they traveled by boat. Well, I bet that if the Governor of Michigan were kidnapped, one of the very first things that would happen is that they would shut down the Mackinac Bridge.

Edit: There is a summer residence for the Governor on Mackinac Island. But, again, they would need to have use of a boat. Or else, they would have to take her across to one of the peninsulas on the ferry!

You can go south and through IN and IL to get to WI from MI too. It’s how most people would drive between MI and WI given where the bulk of the population of both states is.

[susquehanna]

Oct 8, 2020 17:47:12 GMT -5 cap said:

Oct 8, 2020 16:53:09 GMT -5 susquehanna said:

I read earlier that they planned to take her to Wisconsin.

Well, I just learned through Google that her summer home is on the Lower Peninsula. So, they would have had to take her to the Upper Peninsula in order to get to Wisconsin, unless they traveled by boat. Well, I bet that if the Governor of Michigan were kidnapped, one of the very first things that would happen is that they would shut down the Mackinac Bridge.

Edit: There is a summer residence for the Governor on Mackinac Island. But, again, they would need to have use of a boat. Or else, they would have to take her across to one of the peninsulas on the ferry!

You can go south and through IN and IL to get to WI from MI too. It’s how most people would drive between MI and WI given where the bulk of the population of both states is.

Sure.

Hypothetically speaking, though, if one were to kidnap the Governor of Michigan, then wouldn't the hypothetical person want to AVOID the bulk of the population of both states?

(The only reason that I am thinking about this is because I travel almost every summer from Pennsylvania to the Upper Peninsula. So, I am just thinking about how I would personally get to Taq Falls in Western Michigan, and then to Wisconsin, by way of PA.)

[sparty04]

Oct 8, 2020 16:53:09 GMT -5 susquehanna said:

I read earlier that they planned to take her to Wisconsin.

Well, I just learned through Google that her summer home is on the Lower Peninsula. So, they would have had to take her to the Upper Peninsula in order to get to Wisconsin, unless they traveled by boat. Well, I bet that if the Governor of Michigan were kidnapped, one of the very first things that would happen is that they would shut down the Mackinac Bridge.

Edit: There is a summer residence for the Governor on Mackinac Island. But, again, they would need to have use of a boat. Or else, they would have to take her across to one of the peninsulas on the ferry!

Not the point, but I don’t think they were planning on taking her from Mackinac Island. That would be really, really difficult IMO. She has another home up near Traverse City.

[mbcdefg]

Michigan Attorney General's Office confirms that the first and third men (from left) in this April 30 photo of armed men in Senate gallery are among the 13 men charged in a plot to kidnap the governor.

[cap]

Oct 8, 2020 18:15:51 GMT -5 susquehanna said:

Oct 8, 2020 17:47:12 GMT -5 cap said:

You can go south and through IN and IL to get to WI from MI too. It’s how most people would drive between MI and WI given where the bulk of the population of both states is.

Sure.

Hypothetically speaking, though, if one were to kidnap the Governor of Michigan, then wouldn't the hypothetical person want to AVOID the bulk of the population of both states?

(The only reason that I am thinking about this is because I travel almost every summer from Pennsylvania to the Upper Peninsula. So, I am just thinking about how I would personally get to Taq Falls in Western Michigan, and then to Wisconsin, by way of PA.)

Maybe, but it’d be easier to blend in if you’re with a lot of other vehicles. It’s also a lot farther across the UP than a lot of people realize, and the roads aren’t the best.

[winecat]

Oct 8, 2020 14:21:28 GMT -5 mbcdefg said:

Oct 8, 2020 14:15:08 GMT -5 @peep said:

As next-level nuts as this is, I'm just waiting for Trump and the right to defend them, ala Kyle Rittenhouse.

Wouldn't it be a shame if he got COVID?  

[winecat]

Oct 8, 2020 15:11:38 GMT -5 Captain Catnip said:

Oct 8, 2020 15:10:06 GMT -5 cattledogkisses said:

I've been thinking about this more and more lately, and also, how often do I unknowingly interact with someone who supports these alt-right terrorist groups?  It makes my skin crawl.

I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if the security guard at my workplace believes it all.

There were people in one of my food truck groups discussion whether or not they could deduct the purchase of their guns as a business expense.  I'd bet those nut jobs believe it too.

[Deleted]

Oct 8, 2020 19:00:41 GMT -5 winecat said:

Oct 8, 2020 15:11:38 GMT -5 Captain Catnip said:

I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if the security guard at my workplace believes it all.

There were people in one of my food truck groups discussion whether or not they could deduct the purchase of their guns as a business expense.  I'd bet those nut jobs believe it too.

I am an accountant. You do not want to know how many times in my career I've been asked that very question. Or how angry and argumentative people get when you say no.

[mbcdefg]

[penelope]

Oct 8, 2020 18:45:23 GMT -5 cap said:

Oct 8, 2020 18:15:51 GMT -5 susquehanna said:

Sure.

Hypothetically speaking, though, if one were to kidnap the Governor of Michigan, then wouldn't the hypothetical person want to AVOID the bulk of the population of both states?

(The only reason that I am thinking about this is because I travel almost every summer from Pennsylvania to the Upper Peninsula. So, I am just thinking about how I would personally get to Taq Falls in Western Michigan, and then to Wisconsin, by way of PA.)

Maybe, but it’d be easier to blend in if you’re with a lot of other vehicles. It’s also a lot farther across the UP than a lot of people realize, and the roads aren’t the best.

Once you cross the bridge you could take US 2 to Marinette, WI. They just upped the speed limit on that stretch to 65. You could be in Wisconsin in just under 5 hours from Traverse City, only 3 of them in the UP and in very unpopulated areas. (I live in the UP and drive downstate a few times a year for sports.) Its really not that far.

[susquehanna]

So, one time I read a really, really bad murder mystery book called "Murder on the Mackinac." It was published in the 90's, I think, and it's out of print now. I got a copy for free because it was in a bag of books that they cleaned out of my in-laws house when my mother-in-law died.

It's about this guy who was some sort of spy for Eastern Europe in WWII or the cold war or something. Some people kidnap him as he was coming out of the Grand Hotel on Mackinac Island, and then they take him by boat to Mackinaw City, and then then throw him over the Mackinac Bridge. That's how they murder him. The person who solves the mystery finds out that the male Governor of Michigan is the illegitimate son of Hitler and that there is a secret group who is trying to re-establish the Third Reich in Michigan. They murdered this elderly spy because he figured this all out. 

As bad as the plot of that book was, it reminds me of this plot that was just busted. Not that I'm implying that Whitmer is related to Hitler or anything like that. Just that both plots seem like they were poor and half-baked.


Also, I'm terrified about all of the domestic terrorists out there that DIDN'T get busted yet. 

[TR]

omg to the detailing of MI geography and roads.

[litebright]

Beyond the immediate awfulness of this, how can it not having a chilling effect on who is willing to run for office in Michigan? My God, a woman making a good-faith effort to protect public health as a responsible leader, and people actively plan to kidnap her.

And although the complaint mentions that they "discussed murder" along with kidnapping, people still seem to be tiptoeing around it. These terrorists wanted to put her "on trial" for "treason" and you know exactly what they think the penalty for treason should be.

If I were a woman considering running for office in Michigan -- or hell, even a male Dem -- that is a huge and frightening calculus to make.

[mbcdefg]

She wouldn’t have made it alive far enough to consider how to get her out of the state, I’m sure

[was5]

Oct 8, 2020 18:24:31 GMT -5 sparty04 said:

Oct 8, 2020 16:53:09 GMT -5 susquehanna said:

I read earlier that they planned to take her to Wisconsin.

Well, I just learned through Google that her summer home is on the Lower Peninsula. So, they would have had to take her to the Upper Peninsula in order to get to Wisconsin, unless they traveled by boat. Well, I bet that if the Governor of Michigan were kidnapped, one of the very first things that would happen is that they would shut down the Mackinac Bridge.

Edit: There is a summer residence for the Governor on Mackinac Island. But, again, they would need to have use of a boat. Or else, they would have to take her across to one of the peninsulas on the ferry!

Not the point, but I don’t think they were planning on taking her from Mackinac Island. That would be really, really difficult IMO. She has another home up near Traverse City.

I agree. The news reports keep mentioning Gov. Whitmer's vacation home Up North, not the Governor's Summer Residence on Mackinac. I think if the plans revolved around the Governor's Residence on Mackinac they would have specified. Plus, the anti-Whitmer crowd liked to accuse her of hanging around TC bars even when all the other bars in the state were shut down so I'm sure they would get a bigger rush out of taking her from her private home in the area.

ETA: Of course she wasn't really hanging out at bars when everything was shut down. They used an old picture with their claims.