50k Training Plan Thoughts?

[wawa]

campermom reginaphalange72  and any other folks who have done an ultra/do ultras still hanging on here!  

I'm signed up for a deferred 50k in January.   I've got a 70.3 in one month, and then I'm going to need a week of taking it easy for my brain and legs, and then I guess it rolls right into 50k training with 14 weeks to go. I'll be starting from a medium sized base (not super high run milage weekly since it's only 3 runs but - 2 5-6 mile weekday runs, 8-10 mile long runs - plus the biking and the swimming) so I reserve the right to drop to the 25k, but I want to give it a shot.  

A google gave me quite a few different options for free plans. 

Good ole Hal Higdon - www.halhigdon.com/training-programs/more-training/ultramarathon-50k/
assorted blogs:
www.podiumrunner.com/training/going-longer-how-to-train-for-your-first-50k/
relentlessforwardcommotion.com/free-beginner-50k-ultramarathon-training-plan-guide/
rockay.com/blog/50k-training-plan/

etc  Most seem manageable to pick up midstream from where i'm starting (or actually are 14 weeks or less long).  Some more than others.

Any recommendations for me to pick one over the other?

Also I usually start my runs in the dark because that's what works for my schedule.  Should I just get brave and figure out how to run trails in the dark so I can do my weekend runs on the trail?  Run the first half of my long runs on pavement and then hit the trail once it lightens up?  I've got some good trail options close to home, so I can be flexible with it I think. I did NOT do enough trail running last time I tried a trail race (marathon) and it was fucking brutal. What shoudl I be aiming for in terms of trail to pavement ratio here minimum?  it's easier to get running company on pavement, so...it's tempting to run most of my miles like that because I like friends.  But...yeah. 

[campermom]

Oh GOD I signed up for that too didn’t I!! I wasn’t divorced at the time lol. Lofty goals. I might still try. They have the 25 option and they are super chill about that.

Ok I would do Hal Higdon if I were you just bc I’m used to his plans. I really only followed his long run schedule though, I didn’t stress about what the midweek runs said.

Do not run trails at night. I’ve done it once for a race and it’s a completely different situation. There’s too much risk for getting hurt. I never realized how much I zone out during a daytime trail run or even a daytime road run…or even a nighttime road run. Even with lights you are on constant alert, scanning. So I would start off on road until it gets light then move to trail.

I only ran trails on the weekend (ETA weekends plural!) before my 50k and that worked for me. I’m excited for you!! I decided that training starts to stress me out, I’m out. I skip almost all the short midweeks as of now anyway, and some long runs.

I came in second to last for this race when I did it FYI I am no expert!

[wawa]

Sept 9, 2021 5:08:00 GMT -5 campermom said:

Oh GOD I signed up for that too didn’t I!! I wasn’t divorced at the time lol. Lofty goals. I might still try. They have the 25 option and they are super chill about that.

Ok I would do Hal Higdon if I were you just bc I’m used to his plans. I really only followed his long run schedule though, I didn’t stress about what the midweek runs said.

Do not run trails at night. I’ve done it once for a race and it’s a completely different situation. There’s too much risk for getting hurt. I never realized how much I zone out during a daytime trail run or even a daytime road run…or even a nighttime road run. Even with lights you are on constant alert, scanning. So I would start off on road until it gets light then move to trail.

I only ran trails on the weekend before my 50k and that worked for me. I’m excited for you!! I decided that training starts to stress me out, I’m out. I skip almost all the short midweeks as of now anyway, and some long runs.

I came in second to last for this race when I did it FYI I am no expert!

LOLOLOLOL, yes, yes you did.  Maybe we can get together for a long run or two... 

[reginaphalange72]

Ooo, fun! What race is it?

Any of those training plans would be totally fine, so whatever one seems the most appealing to you would work. You're already starting from a good base, so 14 weeks with your long run already solidly in the double digits would be a comfortable amount of time to get yourself ready.

When it comes to trails vs road, the most important thing is just time on feet - no matter what the surface. Ideally, you would run on trails as much as you can, but it's also perfectly reasonable to just do a few trail runs beforehand and do the bulk of it on the road (or even a treadmill - Sally McRae, who is a total badass ultrarunner, trained for her first ultra almost entirely on a treadmill just due to life circumstances). What you're really trying to do with that trail time is condition all those little stabilizer muscles that you don't need as much when you run on roads. You don't have to run exclusively, or even predominantly, on trails to do that. At this point, I've been doing the bulk of my runs on the treadmill and then throwing in one longer run on the weekend that's on trails (sometimes, but even then some weekends it's on the treadmill depending on what I feel like doing), and that's been working great.

Don't worry about running on trails in the dark. I 100% agree with campermom that you really shouldn't. You're doing a 50k, so it's highly unlikely that you will be running in the dark anyway (maybe a little bit at the start/finish depending on how much daylight you get wherever the race is). If you aren't super comfortable on trails yet, there's a much higher chance of tripping/falling/whatever and injuring yourself unnecessarily.

Most importantly - have fun with your training! It's easy to get a little overwhelmed with ultra training. Remember that it should be fun, and you will never hit every single prescribed workout, no matter what training plan you're following. Just aim to get in the ballpark of the prescribed long run as often as you can, get in some shorter runs or other cross training workouts during the week, and have fun on race day. Ultras are FABULOUS and the community is amazing. It's incredible how enjoyable a suuuuuuper long day of pushing yourself can be.

[Wines Not Whines]

I’m not close to being an expert, but I’ve trained for 3 trail 50ks and run 2 of them (one was cancelled at the last minute). For each of them, my training was very similar to marathon training, except I ran almost all of my miles easy (significantly less emphasis on faster paces), and I did most of my long runs on trails. I don’t think you need much higher mileage for a 50k vs a marathon.

I think it was helpful to do most of my long runs on trails, because I got more comfortable as the weeks went on. The trail runs were also a lot slower and took more time than road runs. I know people who run trails in the dark, but I wouldn’t do it if you’re not an experienced trail runner. I definitely wouldn’t do it alone. I’m paranoid and I don’t like running trails alone at all, even though the ones around here are fairly well-traveled.

[campermom]

Sept 9, 2021 8:19:30 GMT -5 wawa said:

Sept 9, 2021 5:08:00 GMT -5 campermom said:

Oh GOD I signed up for that too didn’t I!! I wasn’t divorced at the time lol. Lofty goals. I might still try. They have the 25 option and they are super chill about that.

Ok I would do Hal Higdon if I were you just bc I’m used to his plans. I really only followed his long run schedule though, I didn’t stress about what the midweek runs said.

Do not run trails at night. I’ve done it once for a race and it’s a completely different situation. There’s too much risk for getting hurt. I never realized how much I zone out during a daytime trail run or even a daytime road run…or even a nighttime road run. Even with lights you are on constant alert, scanning. So I would start off on road until it gets light then move to trail.

I only ran trails on the weekend before my 50k and that worked for me. I’m excited for you!! I decided that training starts to stress me out, I’m out. I skip almost all the short midweeks as of now anyway, and some long runs.

I came in second to last for this race when I did it FYI I am no expert!

LOLOLOLOL, yes, yes you did.  Maybe we can get together for a long run or two... 

Id love to! I have a ton near me!

[mrshandy]

Hello!

I don't have very good training plan recommendations. I actually haven't done a 50K. But I did do a 50-miler. Google provided me a plan that looked doable. Some training plans are beyond my capacity. Ultra goals are usually just to finish and I want a plan that will allow me to do that.

I "think" we're signed up for the same race though! I'm contemplating bumping up to the 50 miler which will be in line with a big goal that I have for the spring. But I'm still on the fence about that big goal. Not quite ready to write it out yet. LOL. I have a trail marathon this weekend that I want to see how it goes.

I haven't really done too many trail runs in the dark. And I really wouldn't do them solo in the dark. But I wouldn't go crazy trying to get them done. I haven't really done as many trail runs as I should for this trail marathon. Most of them have been on the road. But my general philosophy is to get on the trails when you can. Perhaps start on the road in the dark, then go to the trails in the light. Maybe it only works for your schedule every few weeks? Or maybe every other week? Get the miles done and mix in trails when you can.