April Covid Thread

[erbear]

Apr 19, 2022 12:22:35 GMT -5 Saudade said:

I'm in Europe right now where they've completely removed all covid requirements. No one wears a mask....literally maybe less than 5% of people at any given time. I've been wearing my KN95 the entire time because of having to test to return. I'm so paranoid my test will be positive (granted, I have no symptoms, but still)

I'll still continue wearing my mask on the plans and anywhere else I go. I want to go as long as possible without having covid.

I was in Portugal a few weeks ago and almost everyone masked outside and everyone did inside.

[erbear]

Philadelphia is making news by bringing back the mask mandate but today, they dropped mask requirements for public transportation. Make it make sense.

[TR]

Apr 19, 2022 16:26:19 GMT -5 erbear said:

Philadelphia is making news by bringing back the mask mandate but today, they dropped mask requirements for public transportation. Make it make sense.

I saw this was because Septa falls under the federal ruling on mass transit so that's why it's only been dropped there.

[Velar Fricative]

Apr 19, 2022 16:28:55 GMT -5 TR said:

Apr 19, 2022 16:26:19 GMT -5 erbear said:

Philadelphia is making news by bringing back the mask mandate but today, they dropped mask requirements for public transportation. Make it make sense.

I saw this was because Septa falls under the federal ruling on mass transit so that's why it's only been dropped there.

Why would it though? NYC's mass transit system is still requiring masks (basically anything overseen by the MTA, which includes suburban railroads). The federal ruling, from my understanding, still allows for local entities to require masks if they wish. Like, airlines could have made the company decision to still require them if they wanted (though I don't think any have).

ETA: Er, never mind, saw the part about how Philly doesn't control the mass transit system.

[wawa]

Apr 19, 2022 16:26:19 GMT -5 erbear said:

Philadelphia is making news by bringing back the mask mandate but today, they dropped mask requirements for public transportation. Make it make sense.

Septa isn't under sole control of the city government. Philly doesn't get to decide.

[penguingrrl]

Apr 19, 2022 17:04:45 GMT -5 Velar Fricative said:

Apr 19, 2022 16:28:55 GMT -5 TR said:

I saw this was because Septa falls under the federal ruling on mass transit so that's why it's only been dropped there.

Why would it though? NYC's mass transit system is still requiring masks (basically anything overseen by the MTA, which includes suburban railroads). The federal ruling, from my understanding, still allows for local entities to require masks if they wish. Like, airlines could have made the company decision to still require them if they wanted (though I don't think any have).

ETA: Er, never mind, saw the part about how Philly doesn't control the mass transit system.

That’s interesting, NJ Transit lifted its mask requirement.

[dulcemariamar]

Apr 19, 2022 12:22:35 GMT -5 Saudade said:

I'm in Europe right now where they've completely removed all covid requirements. No one wears a mask....literally maybe less than 5% of people at any given time. I've been wearing my KN95 the entire time because of having to test to return. I'm so paranoid my test will be positive (granted, I have no symptoms, but still)

I'll still continue wearing my mask on the plans and anywhere else I go. I want to go as long as possible without having covid.

I guess it depends on where you are at in Europe but I just got back from Spain and they are only lifting the mask mandate tomorrow. You still have to wear it on all transportation, pharmacies, hospitals, medical centers, nursing homes and taxis. I saw a lot of people still wear a mask even outside. And 100% indoors.

The country was hit really bad the first year of the pandemic and they have an aging population so generally they seem still quite cautious

[calmcosmo]

Apr 19, 2022 12:17:25 GMT -5 wildrice said:

I sure hope they drop the testing requirement to re-enter the US if they can't even mask on the plane anymore. So I am going to get COVID flying to my destination, and then be banned from returning home and have to pay a ton of money to stay in another country and quarantine?

I think we will still wear masks for any upcoming travel. Maybe forever. Planes were germ factories even prior to COVID.

This is where I am. I am taking 18 teenagers to New Zealand in June (senior trip I am chaperoning). Having to get 20 negative tests to return has me incredibly stressed out . And that's before the masks were lifted. Either keep both or take both away. This combo isn't sustainable. 

[wanderingback]

I’m going to a writing retreat on Friday morning through the weekend with a friend. There are 5 rooms in the inn and they provide 3 meals a day. Anyway, they require vaccine proof and a negative Covid test. So I went and just got my rapid pcr. Totally free though the health department. They also test for flu and rsv. I got the results back in 3 hours. It’s so so shitty that public health infrastructure is so poor in so many places and I wish people had such easy access to services everywhere.

[jeaniebueller]

I don't know if this will make any of you feel better about flying but this article indicates that the ventilation systems on airplanes is superior to other indoor spaces. So I tend to think that if you are wearing an N95 or KN95, you are in pretty good shape.

Officially, certified HEPA filters “block and capture 99.97 percent of airborne particles over 0.3 micron in size,” says Tony Julian, an air-purifying expert with RGF Environmental Group. The efficiency of these filters, perhaps counterintuitively, increases for even smaller particles. So while the exhaled globs that carry SARS-CoV-2 can be quite small, HEPA filters effectively remove the vast majority from the air.



“Typically the number of particles in the air are [sic] really low, the plane is almost a clean room, because there’s so much ventilation, and very few sources of particulate generation within a plane,” says Liam Bates, CEO and co-founder of Kaiterra, an air-quality monitor manufacturer. “[Planes] are actually safer than virtually any other confined space.”


www.nationalgeographic.com/travel/article/how-clean-is-the-air-on-your-airplane-coronavirus-cvd#:~:text=%E2%80%9CAir%20is%20pumped%20from%20the,in%20from%20outside%20the%20plane.

And on subways, its obviously much better if everyone is masked but they do have better ventilation systems than a lot of places. but yeah the graphic is a little :/


www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/08/10/nyregion/nyc-subway-coronavirus.html

[estrellita]

jeaniebueller That does make me feel a lot better. Granted I'm also worried about the airport itself, not just the plane. I'll just try to distance and mask as much as possible and hope for the best!

[sillygoosegirl]

Apr 20, 2022 18:05:02 GMT -5 jeaniebueller said:

I don't know if this will make any of you feel better about flying but this article indicates that the ventilation systems on airplanes is superior to other indoor spaces. So I tend to think that if you are wearing an N95 or KN95, you are in pretty good shape.

Officially, certified HEPA filters “block and capture 99.97 percent of airborne particles over 0.3 micron in size,” says Tony Julian, an air-purifying expert with RGF Environmental Group. The efficiency of these filters, perhaps counterintuitively, increases for even smaller particles. So while the exhaled globs that carry SARS-CoV-2 can be quite small, HEPA filters effectively remove the vast majority from the air.



“Typically the number of particles in the air are [sic] really low, the plane is almost a clean room, because there’s so much ventilation, and very few sources of particulate generation within a plane,” says Liam Bates, CEO and co-founder of Kaiterra, an air-quality monitor manufacturer. “[Planes] are actually safer than virtually any other confined space.”


www.nationalgeographic.com/travel/article/how-clean-is-the-air-on-your-airplane-coronavirus-cvd#:~:text=%E2%80%9CAir%20is%20pumped%20from%20the,in%20from%20outside%20the%20plane.

And on subways, its obviously much better if everyone is masked but they do have better ventilation systems than a lot of places. but yeah the graphic is a little :/


www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/08/10/nyregion/nyc-subway-coronavirus.html

Aren't all those "studies" showing that airplanes are so clean and safe commission by airlines? I remain skeptical because I was sick ALL THE TIME when I had to fly a lot for work. Airplanes are gross.

[gardengal]

Apr 20, 2022 18:59:44 GMT -5 sillygoosegirl said:

Apr 20, 2022 18:05:02 GMT -5 jeaniebueller said:

I don't know if this will make any of you feel better about flying but this article indicates that the ventilation systems on airplanes is superior to other indoor spaces. So I tend to think that if you are wearing an N95 or KN95, you are in pretty good shape.

Officially, certified HEPA filters “block and capture 99.97 percent of airborne particles over 0.3 micron in size,” says Tony Julian, an air-purifying expert with RGF Environmental Group. The efficiency of these filters, perhaps counterintuitively, increases for even smaller particles. So while the exhaled globs that carry SARS-CoV-2 can be quite small, HEPA filters effectively remove the vast majority from the air.



“Typically the number of particles in the air are [sic] really low, the plane is almost a clean room, because there’s so much ventilation, and very few sources of particulate generation within a plane,” says Liam Bates, CEO and co-founder of Kaiterra, an air-quality monitor manufacturer. “[Planes] are actually safer than virtually any other confined space.”


www.nationalgeographic.com/travel/article/how-clean-is-the-air-on-your-airplane-coronavirus-cvd#:~:text=%E2%80%9CAir%20is%20pumped%20from%20the,in%20from%20outside%20the%20plane.

And on subways, its obviously much better if everyone is masked but they do have better ventilation systems than a lot of places. but yeah the graphic is a little :/


www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/08/10/nyregion/nyc-subway-coronavirus.html

Aren't all those "studies" showing that airplanes are so clean and safe commission by airlines? I remain skeptical because I was sick ALL THE TIME when I had to fly a lot for work. Airplanes are gross.

I think these data are true for when you’re in the sky. Boarding, deplaning & taxi’ing don’t have nearly the air exchange. And if the person next to you is sneezing all over you, air exchange isn’t going to do much for you. YLE recently discussed masks on planes. 

[fuckyourcouch]

Apr 20, 2022 19:17:09 GMT -5 gardengal said:

Apr 20, 2022 18:59:44 GMT -5 sillygoosegirl said:

Aren't all those "studies" showing that airplanes are so clean and safe commission by airlines? I remain skeptical because I was sick ALL THE TIME when I had to fly a lot for work. Airplanes are gross.

I think these data are true for when you’re in the sky. Boarding, deplaning & taxi’ing don’t have nearly the air exchange. And if the person next to you is sneezing all over you, air exchange isn’t going to do much for you. YLE recently discussed masks on planes. 

Yep, when the engines are off this circulation isn't happening. And that's a decent amount of time, especially with gate delays.

[neverfstop]

Apr 20, 2022 19:17:09 GMT -5 gardengal said:

Apr 20, 2022 18:59:44 GMT -5 sillygoosegirl said:

Aren't all those "studies" showing that airplanes are so clean and safe commission by airlines? I remain skeptical because I was sick ALL THE TIME when I had to fly a lot for work. Airplanes are gross.

I think these data are true for when you’re in the sky. Boarding, deplaning & taxi’ing don’t have nearly the air exchange. And if the person next to you is sneezing all over you, air exchange isn’t going to do much for you. YLE recently discussed masks on planes. 

Sample size of one, but I was on a plane (roundtrip, so at least 2 flights) almost every single week in from June 2020 through Jan 2022.  I was pretty good about masking, but most people take it off regularly to eat/drink and I am shocked that I never had COVID being in such a high exposure environment repeatedly without very good masking.  At least, I kept telling myself that the ventilation was working and doing its job. So maybe it's true? {shrug}

[breezy8407]

Apr 20, 2022 20:35:34 GMT -5 neverfstop said:

Apr 20, 2022 19:17:09 GMT -5 gardengal said:

I think these data are true for when you’re in the sky. Boarding, deplaning & taxi’ing don’t have nearly the air exchange. And if the person next to you is sneezing all over you, air exchange isn’t going to do much for you. YLE recently discussed masks on planes. 

Sample size of one, but I was on a plane (roundtrip, so at least 2 flights) almost every single week in from June 2020 through Jan 2022.  I was pretty good about masking, but most people take it off regularly to eat/drink and I am shocked that I never had COVID being in such a high exposure environment repeatedly without very good masking.  At least, I kept telling myself that the ventilation was working and doing its job. So maybe it's true? {shrug}

Yep. I've been flying monthly if not more since April of 2021. So many people drag out the eating/drinking thing and spend a lot of time with them off. 

I got covid last week of December and I can pretty much tie it directly to being exposed from a work trip since it was the only place I had been before testing positive. I was masked 100% of the time indoors and wore KN95s on the planes. My coworkers were not masked the entire time, and weren't wearing KN95s like I was, and none of them got it. Its a total crapshoot. 

[ny96]

I’m anxiously awaiting the appeals court ruling (if by chance it’s quick). We flew on Monday morning before the first ruling came down and are flying again tomorrow evening.

[keweenawlove]

One of my staff members just flew home from spring break yesterday afternoon. Started felling sick when he got home and tested positive right after being on a plane.

[wanderingback]

Apr 21, 2022 10:50:30 GMT -5 keweenawlove said:

One of my staff members just flew home from spring break yesterday afternoon. Started felling sick when he got home and tested positive right after being on a plane.

This means they were exposed and infected while on the trip (depending on how long the trip was), not while on the return flight. The incubation period for covid is still 2-14 days as far as I’m aware.
There are def people flying with covid all the time!

[noodleoo]

Apr 21, 2022 11:14:36 GMT -5 wanderingback said:

Apr 21, 2022 10:50:30 GMT -5 keweenawlove said:

One of my staff members just flew home from spring break yesterday afternoon. Started felling sick when he got home and tested positive right after being on a plane.

This means they were exposed and infected while on the trip (depending on how long the trip was), not while on the return flight. The incubation period for covid is still 2-14 days as far as I’m aware.
There are def people flying with covid all the time!

I think the point is more that this person was probably contagious while on the flight, not that they caught it on the flight. Hence why everyone should mask! You don’t always know when you are contagious.

[wanderingback]

Apr 21, 2022 11:17:33 GMT -5 noodleoo said:

Apr 21, 2022 11:14:36 GMT -5 wanderingback said:

This means they were exposed and infected while on the trip (depending on how long the trip was), not while on the return flight. The incubation period for covid is still 2-14 days as far as I’m aware.
There are def people flying with covid all the time!

I think the point is more that this person was probably contagious while on the flight, not that they caught it on the flight. Hence why everyone should mask! You don’t always know when you are contagious.

Oh yes, that’s why I said there are def people with covid all the time. I know people with positive tests who have flown.

[keweenawlove]

Apr 21, 2022 11:14:36 GMT -5 wanderingback said:

Apr 21, 2022 10:50:30 GMT -5 keweenawlove said:

One of my staff members just flew home from spring break yesterday afternoon. Started felling sick when he got home and tested positive right after being on a plane.

This means they were exposed and infected while on the trip (depending on how long the trip was), not while on the return flight. The incubation period for covid is still 2-14 days as far as I’m aware.
There are def people flying with covid all the time!

I get that. This was just the first time I've thought about potentially sitting next to someone positive unmasked. I've been lucky on flights so far and most people I've seen had been good about masking. 

[estrellita]

Apr 21, 2022 14:14:17 GMT -5 jennyparnassus said:

Apr 21, 2022 10:17:39 GMT -5 ny96 said:

I’m anxiously awaiting the appeals court ruling (if by chance it’s quick). We flew on Monday morning before the first ruling came down and are flying again tomorrow evening.

What's a realistic expectation for a ruling such as this? Does anyone know? I know nothing about law, so I'm curious as to when realistically we could expect to hear either way about this. 

Also, if the mask is reinstated on appeal, would the crew of in-process flights then make an announcement mid-flight that the passengers are supposed to resume wearing masks effective immediately?

This seems to me as if one one lets the horse out of the barn, it's going to be very difficult to corral said horse and put it back into the barn. 

I feel this way too. I doubt the anti-maskers will cooperate, even less so than they already did. Most sane people will do whatever is expected regarding masks, but the insane ones will push back even harder. I have a coworker that posted that the unqualified judge is his new "hero". Ridiculous.

[lilac05]

Apr 21, 2022 14:14:17 GMT -5 jennyparnassus said:

Apr 21, 2022 10:17:39 GMT -5 ny96 said:

I’m anxiously awaiting the appeals court ruling (if by chance it’s quick). We flew on Monday morning before the first ruling came down and are flying again tomorrow evening.

What's a realistic expectation for a ruling such as this? Does anyone know? I know nothing about law, so I'm curious as to when realistically we could expect to hear either way about this. 

Also, if the mask is reinstated on appeal, would the crew of in-process flights then make an announcement mid-flight that the passengers are supposed to resume wearing masks effective immediately?

This seems to me as if one one lets the horse out of the barn, it's going to be very difficult to corral said horse and put it back into the barn. 

I don’t know about the timing of it all, but I agree on your final sentence. I REALLY feel for the flight attendants if it is reversed. Return to a hostile work environment. I saw a video earlier of a flight attendant crying from relief that masks are no longer required. It seemed like her message was purely relief that she no longer had to enforce it and deal with all of that drama vs relief that she personally didn’t need to wear one anymore.

This judge REALLY messed things up. There’s no win from here.

[babsbunny]

DH and I are watching the Formula One series on nexflix and just started season 3 which is the 2020 race season. It feels surreal to watch the covid events unfold.

[breezy8407]

Anecdote report. I flew for work Monday and back home yesterday. If I had to guess, I was one of maybe 10 people on each flight that were masked. On a Boeing 737-900ER for both.

[af1212]

Apr 28, 2022 8:58:53 GMT -5 breezy8407 said:

Anecdote report. I flew for work Monday and back home yesterday. If I had to guess, I was one of maybe 10 people on each flight that were masked. On a Boeing 737-900ER for both.

I counted on my flight last Thursday.

70 in economy out of 175
11 out of 20 in first class

When I flew back again this Monday I didn’t count first class but there were about 40 out of 222 in economy.

[fernweh]

Do international flights still require masking? This rule is just for domestic flights correct?

[taratru]

Apr 28, 2022 9:34:27 GMT -5 fernweh said:

Do international flights still require masking? This rule is just for domestic flights correct?

We are flying on Emirates tomorrow to Germany - masks required.

[wanderingback]

Apr 28, 2022 9:34:27 GMT -5 fernweh said:

Do international flights still require masking? This rule is just for domestic flights correct?

It totally depends on where you’re going. If you’re flying a US airline that dropped the mask mandate and you’re going to a country that doesn’t have a mask mandate then from what I’ve read masks won’t be required. But if you’re going to a country that does have a mask mandate then it would be required. I know British Airways and Virgin also dropped their masks mandates so if you’re flying in to London for example on those airlines, then no, masks aren’t required.