TW: Anyone else following the mess with Ulta/Kate Spade?

[Deleted]

What a cluster fuck. I don't understand how no one in the chain of command knew how she died and didn't realize how horrendously insensitive the email would be. 

[af1212]

I do think it’s awful but doesn’t have anything to do with @@@pregnancy/children@@@ to my knowledge?

[Deleted]

May 2, 2022 15:02:00 GMT -5 af1212 said:

I do think it’s awful but doesn’t have anything to do with @@@pregnancy/children@@@ to my knowledge?

Sorry - that was my mistake. Because it was about suicide I didn't know if I had to have the tag. 

[Velar Fricative]

May 2, 2022 15:04:13 GMT -5 @rebeccawelton said:

May 2, 2022 15:02:00 GMT -5 af1212 said:

I do think it’s awful but doesn’t have anything to do with @@@pregnancy/children@@@ to my knowledge?

Sorry - that was my mistake. Because it was about suicide I didn't know if I had to have the tag. 

You could add "TW" to the title.

[gardengal]

May 2, 2022 15:04:13 GMT -5 @rebeccawelton said:

May 2, 2022 15:02:00 GMT -5 af1212 said:

I do think it’s awful but doesn’t have anything to do with @@@pregnancy/children@@@ to my knowledge?

Sorry - that was my mistake. Because it was about suicide I didn't know if I had to have the tag. 

You’d want to say “tw” or trigger warning.

Here’s an article for those like me that didn’t hear anything about this: amp.tmz.com/2022/05/02/ulta-kate-spade-email-refer-suicide-hang/

I must live under a rock bc I didn’t know she died.

[Saudade]

I didn’t know how she died so I was confused when I got their apology email.

[Velar Fricative]

I knew she died by suicide but had forgotten how she died. So I went from "Damn, did they forget she's dead???" to "Holy shit, who's getting fired for this???" The language used really makes me wonder if someone sent it out as a sick joke.

[Susie]

OMG.  I remembered that she died by suicide, but I didn't remember how.  I don't even think you need to know how precisely, to know that email is no good.

[bronxgirl]

How awful!

[Deleted]

May 2, 2022 15:11:05 GMT -5 Susie said:

OMG.  I remembered that she died by suicide, but I didn't remember how.  I don't even think you need to know how precisely, to know that email is no good.

This is where I was at while fighting about this with someone else who kept saying it was an honest mistake, people shouldn't be fired, etc. 

I said that even if you didn't know how, most people probably knew she was gone. That email went through multiple approvals. Someone knew she had died. Even if they didn't know how, it's not appropriate. The wording just makes it all the more awful. 

[wildrice]

Oh, yikes. I saw something about this on TikTok but I thought it was just because she died and obviously, you can't hang with someone who is dead. I totally missed the inappropriate use of the word "hang".

[cville]

May 2, 2022 15:11:05 GMT -5 Susie said:

OMG.  I remembered that she died by suicide, but I didn't remember how.  I don't even think you need to know how precisely, to know that email is no good.

Me either. But I'm not in charge of marketing at a beauty company. One would presume those who are, do.

[kadams767]

Wow. What a clusterfuck. On the first day of Mental Health Awareness Month, nonetheless.

[rubytue]

May 2, 2022 15:06:43 GMT -5 gardengal said:

May 2, 2022 15:04:13 GMT -5 @rebeccawelton said:

Sorry - that was my mistake. Because it was about suicide I didn't know if I had to have the tag. 

You’d want to say “tw” or trigger warning.

Here’s an article for those like me that didn’t hear anything about this: amp.tmz.com/2022/05/02/ulta-kate-spade-email-refer-suicide-hang/

I must live under a rock bc I didn’t know she died.

Thank you for the link!!

[erbear]

That's pretty awful; intentional or not, that hurt her family. Someone should probably lose their job over that.

[dancelnow]

There is no way that is a mistake. It’s not even a typical way they phrase their email headlines. Someone wanted to see if they could slip in through

[wawa]

May 3, 2022 0:55:14 GMT -5 dancelnow said:

There is no way that is a mistake. It’s not even a typical way they phrase their email headlines. Someone wanted to see if they could slip in through

I don't know what you mean by a typical way they phrase their email headlines. 

I think this could have been somebody being fucking weird and if so, I bet 10000000000000000000 internet dollars that their supervisor knows that they're a complete fuckhead and they'll be fired because nobody is that icky on the DL for long, but it doesn't actually feel far fetched to me that this could have happened by accident. 
They try to have cutesy/fun/casual email headlines all the time. 

Just in the past batch that havent' been deleted out of my promotions folder yet:
Your makeup bag is typing
Peeking allowed
This deal is calling your name!
Major add-to-bag alert
Tula, we see you!

And so forth.  (also my god they send a lot of emails...that was just april, and skipping all the boring ones about my points balance or order confirmations) 

"Come hang with x brand" fits right into that "well hello my fellow youths" vibe that a lot of the others have, and when you send like 3 a week you use a lot of lame phrases.

It's really a shame it wasn't caught either way though, and I'm glad they immediately issued a straight up "that was wrong and we're sorry" apology.

[Pilsy]

I'm not convinced there were nefarious intentions here. Regardless, it is extremely unfortunate.

[ECB]

wawa I fully agree with you. I doubt it was done on purpose. And honestly- if they are sending that many emails with "cute" taglines, that probably means they have a HUGE list already created that they cycle through and constantly add to it as they go. I doubt these taglines go through any real vetting process.

[aspentosh]

May 2, 2022 15:09:01 GMT -5 Saudade said:

I didn’t know how she died so I was confused when I got their apology email.

I'm glad I am not the only one. I even went back to the email and didn't understand what the problem word was. This makes a lot more sense now. 

[icedcoffee]

May 3, 2022 0:55:14 GMT -5 dancelnow said:

There is no way that is a mistake. It’s not even a typical way they phrase their email headlines. Someone wanted to see if they could slip in through

I’m here. I think it was intentionally proposed and slipped through other people who didn’t notice. I don’t think everyone at Ulta is an intentional ass but there’s at least one very bad egg in that marketing department.

[outnumbered]

May 2, 2022 15:21:03 GMT -5 @rebeccawelton said:

May 2, 2022 15:11:05 GMT -5 Susie said:

OMG.  I remembered that she died by suicide, but I didn't remember how.  I don't even think you need to know how precisely, to know that email is no good.

This is where I was at while fighting about this with someone else who kept saying it was an honest mistake, people shouldn't be fired, etc. 

I said that even if you didn't know how, most people probably knew she was gone. That email went through multiple approvals. Someone knew she had died. Even if they didn't know how, it's not appropriate. The wording just makes it all the more awful. 

Emails like this probably do not go through multiple approvals.   Probably some low level newish person writing boring copy every day.  They should be fired whether it was intentional or not.  

[tacokick]

May 3, 2022 9:54:09 GMT -5 ECB said:

wawa I fully agree with you. I doubt it was done on purpose. And honestly- if they are sending that many emails with "cute" taglines, that probably means they have a HUGE list already created that they cycle through and constantly add to it as they go. I doubt these taglines go through any real vetting process.

Yes! I’ve written a lot of copy and newsletters for companies over the years and you’d be surprised how little oversight there is. Especially when there is such a high volume of emails. As long as it makes reasonable sense and has the right info, it goes out. That’s why you get the occasional “oops, that link didn’t work” email. No one is fussing over these things.

The subject lines are often almost auto generated with stock phrases; it’s like pulling from a hat. This one was an awful fit but I bet it was equally likely it could have been “come hang with Kylie or Bobbi Brown” or any other cosmetic brand name that was named after a person.

This was awful but I agree there is most likely no deeper issue of intent here. Just over worked and under paid writers.


ETA: I remember when her death was announced but I don’t recall the focus being on the method TBH, I actually can see how someone might not be aware of all the details. www.nytimes.com/2018/06/06/style/kate-spade-husband-andy-spade.html

[Deleted]

To add to [mention]tacokick [/mention] ‘s point, I receive some emails from the same company on two different email addresses (guess I signed up twice, too lazy to unsubscribe one), and I’ll often get the same sale email with completely different subject lines at the two addresses. I don’t know if Ulta does this (I don’t get their emails…at either address), but it wouldn’t surprise me if it was auto-generated and some people got different subject lines.

Regardless, the result was horrifying, and I feel very bad that her family had to see that.

[jane6672]

@villainv the two different subject lines isn’t an auto-generation thing, it’s an A/B test. They are tracking to see which subject line prompted more people to open the email.

[wawa]

May 3, 2022 20:05:11 GMT -5 jane6672 said:

@villainv the two different subject lines isn’t an auto-generation thing, it’s an A/B test. They are tracking to see which subject line prompted more people to open the email.

well that's fascinating.  

[AJL]

I'm giving the social media intern the benefit of the doubt for this. It was a gross misstep but I don't think it was intentional.