@ (teens) OH sports law: genital exams

[NewOrleans]

This is one of their more depraved laws to date, which says a lot. They are utter perverts.

TW: this law is medical sexual assault 

Late at night on Wednesday, June 1, a bill meant to modify Ohio’s teacher residency program suddenly acquired an unrelated amendment. Under the Save Women’s Sports Act, a student athlete’s gender can be questioned, requiring that student to bring a note from their doctor to verify their sex.


If a participant’s sex is disputed, the participant shall establish the participant’s sex by presenting a signed physicians statement indicating the participant’s sex based upon only the following:

1) The participant’s internal and external reproductive anatomy;

2) The participant’s normal endogenously produced levels of testosterone;

3) An analysis of the participants genetic makeup.

The bill does not include any language limiting who may dispute the athlete’s gender, under what conditions, nor when such disputing can occur. 

(Also, if a student says they have been harmed athletically / competitively by having a trans student on their team they can sue the school and everyone).

www.forbes.com/sites/petergreene/2022/06/03/ohio-legislators-want-to-check-childrens-gender/?sh=568371563ad0

[NewOrleans]

Like, I’m still on these mental Gymnastics. We must protect our girls! By subjecting them to pelvic exams! And blood tests for testosterone and DNA!

[Deleted]

Aside from the fact that this is just disgusting, it puts a huge financial burden on the families of athletes whose gender might be “disputed.”

[Jalapeñomel]

This is so disgusting , and if anyone want to do this to my child or someone on their team, I’d probably Hulk out on them (and I wouldn’t feel the least bit sorry about it).

[erbear]

I’d like to see someone try this on one of my girls. Fuck this. Girls’ bodies don’t belong to the government.

[rubytue]

This is so sick and wrong. But, what are they gonna do if someone comes back XXY?

[Deleted]

Jun 5, 2022 19:11:31 GMT -5 rubytue said:

This is so sick and wrong. But, what are they gonna do if someone comes back XXY?

Or if their genitalia doesn’t match their chromosomes?

[sonrisa]

Jun 5, 2022 18:49:55 GMT -5 erbear said:

I’d like to see someone try this on one of my girls. Fuck this. Girls’ bodies don’t belong to the government.

No one's body does. This wouldn't be any better if it were aimed at boys (trans or not), non-binary people, intersex people, men, women or anyone else.

[erbear]

Jun 5, 2022 19:44:32 GMT -5 sonrisa said:

Jun 5, 2022 18:49:55 GMT -5 erbear said:

I’d like to see someone try this on one of my girls. Fuck this. Girls’ bodies don’t belong to the government.

No one's bodies do. This wouldn't be any better if it were aimed at boys (trans or not), non-binary people, intersected people, men, women or anyone else.

Obviously. But it never is.

[sonrisa]

Jun 5, 2022 19:46:35 GMT -5 erbear said:

Jun 5, 2022 19:44:32 GMT -5 sonrisa said:

No one's bodies do. This wouldn't be any better if it were aimed at boys (trans or not), non-binary people, intersected people, men, women or anyone else.

Obviously. But it never is.

Take a moment before you double down on this.

Trans, non-binary and intersex people have their bodies disrespected and mistreated all the time.

Our country is built on a deep history of demeaning, disrespecting and mistreating black men's bodies. And not just during slavery. (and indigenous people, and other people of color, and, and)

If we look at this in isolation and see only how it targets girls (which it does) we miss the bigger pattern of dehumanization of people and their bodies. Whether we are talking about modern girl athletes, or poor, indigenous and disabled people who were sterilized a century ago, or people in correctional facilities, or so many other examples. "But it never is" dismisses a hell of a lot of people.

And I don't think you meant to do that.

[erbear]

Jun 5, 2022 19:56:36 GMT -5 sonrisa said:

Jun 5, 2022 19:46:35 GMT -5 erbear said:

Obviously. But it never is.

Take a moment before you double down on this.

Trans, non-binary and intersexed people have their bodies disrespected and mistreated all the time.

Our country is built on a deep history of demeaning, disrespecting and mistreating black men's bodies. And not just during slavery. (and indigenous people, and other people of color, and, and)

If we look at this in isolation and see only how it targets girls (which it does) we miss the bigger pattern of dehumanization of people and their bodies. Whether we are talking about modern girl athletes, or poor, indigenous and disabled people who were sterilized a century ago, or people in correctional facilities, or so many other examples. "But it never is" dismisses a hell of a lot of people.

And I don't think you meant to do that.

You don’t know me if you think I don’t know all of this. This particular law is aimed at trans girls and we all know it. I’m not really in the mood for this today.

Btw, it’s intersex. Not intersexed.

[sonrisa]

Jun 5, 2022 20:08:44 GMT -5 erbear said:

Jun 5, 2022 19:56:36 GMT -5 sonrisa said:

Take a moment before you double down on this.

Trans, non-binary and intersex people have their bodies disrespected and mistreated all the time.

Our country is built on a deep history of demeaning, disrespecting and mistreating black men's bodies. And not just during slavery. (and indigenous people, and other people of color, and, and)

If we look at this in isolation and see only how it targets girls (which it does) we miss the bigger pattern of dehumanization of people and their bodies. Whether we are talking about modern girl athletes, or poor, indigenous and disabled people who were sterilized a century ago, or people in correctional facilities, or so many other examples. "But it never is" dismisses a hell of a lot of people.

And I don't think you meant to do that.

You don’t know me if you think I don’t know all of this. This particular law is aimed at trans girls and we all know it. I’m not really in the mood for this today.

Btw, it’s intersex. Not intersexed.

I messed up. I apologize and will correct that.

And apparently you *are* doubling down on "But it never is." I actually thought I *did* know you as someone who wouldn't intentionally say that.  But I guess I'm wrong and don't "know" you. So a second apology there. I wouldn't have written the follow up if I'd thought you had said exactly what you meant. I am sorry.  

[erbear]

This particular law, which is called Save Women’s Sports, is aimed at policing trans girls’ bodies, as this is the topic in question. I have a pretty well versed awareness of the government’s flaws in policing others’ bodies. I don’t really want to take away from the actual travesty of this particular law that we’re discussing here.

But yes, of course, American laws (and global laws) regularly police the bodies of BIPOC and non-cis people all the time.

[bronxgirl]

I find myself frequently responding with the phrase 'it's horrifying", to the point where I wonder if I'm watering it down. But I can't think of any other word to describe this law, which is nothing other than state sanctioned sexual assault. I started to read a twitter thread that explained the procedure and I was so upset/ nauseated by it that I couldn't finish reading. WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON HERE?? I grew up in Ohio, but in an extremely liberal area. I knew the rest of the state was much more conservative, but I can't even wrap my head around this.

[curbsideprophet]

Everything I have read about this is so disturbing.

Are these politicians okay with their own daughters going through this?

[sonrisa]

Jun 5, 2022 21:34:44 GMT -5 curbsideprophet said:

Everything I have read about this is so disturbing.

Are these politicians okay with their own daughters going through this?

They think no one would ever challenge *their* kid. 

[estrellita]

This is just horrifying. As others mentioned, these things can vary. And these poor kids. Not only to have someone question your sex, but need to go through all of that to prove it, as a child! I swear conservatives have just gone all in on who can come up with the worst ideas.

[mrsukyankee]

And you know it's going to have an impact more on POC because the viewpoint of many white people are that they are already "too muscular" to be feminine (see how many described Michelle Obama).

[livinitup]

In watching coverage on this law, it was noted that Ohio has exactly ONE trans female athlete in the state that sparked this law.

One

One citizen. A child.

What a perfect example of mass hysteria.

[CallingAllAngels]

This is heartbreaking. She isn't trans, but Abby Wambach talked on the We Can Do Hard Things podcast about how people often misgender her because she is tall, muscular, has short hair, and doesn't dress feminine. She said she often has people redirect her out the women's room, thinking that she is in the wrong place. She also talked about the pressure early in her career that she felt to look feminine, and how she finally felt that her insides matched her outsides when she cut her hair short. It was really eye-opening to me to hear the pain in her voice, especially coming from someone who has achieved so much and been the best in the world at her sport. If just living in this world is this painful, can you imagine being subjected to a genital exam? This is going to drive a lot of talented athletes out of sport.

[bears]

This is going to hurt so many people, particularly transgender girls, girls, and POC (who I anticipate will be targeted the most by these sorts of laws).

I read a lot on gender/sex/sport when people were losing their minds over Caster Semenya. Everything I read and it was apparent that sex is not binary and that humans have a spectrum of chromosomes, anatomy, and hormones. It would be very difficult to sort everyone into a "male" and "female" bucket using these factors.

I also am really frustrated on how children's sports are being used a kudgel in these conversations and I think it's in this position because people have lost their damn minds when it comes to kids sports. In my mind, kids should do sports to learn teamwork, gain coordination, and be physically active. The hyper-competitive nature that has emerged serves privileged kids most of all; in my view, as a society we should be focused on kids learning the value of physical activity for lifelong health. These sorts of laws will be terrible for supporting that aim.

[Velar Fricative]

Jun 6, 2022 8:23:22 GMT -5 livinitup said:

In watching coverage on this law, it was noted that Ohio has exactly ONE trans female athlete in the state that sparked this law.

One

One citizen. A child.

What a perfect example of mass hysteria.

And I can't imagine there is much funding allocated for the mental health services this athlete will need knowing that her mere existence has caused this much hysteria and hateful legislation. I hope she and her family have the resources and ability to move somewhere else. And if they don't, I hope they have a circle of trusted people and local organizations who can help. 

[NewOrleans]

Jun 6, 2022 8:52:11 GMT -5 bears said:

I also am really frustrated on how children's sports are being used a kudgel in these conversations and I think it's in this position because people have lost their damn minds when it comes to kids sports.

This is happening because they are bigoted perverts, not because they are sports fans.

[Deleted]

Jun 6, 2022 8:23:22 GMT -5 livinitup said:

In watching coverage on this law, it was noted that Ohio has exactly ONE trans female athlete in the state that sparked this law.

One

One citizen. A child.

What a perfect example of mass hysteria.

Many states enacting these laws have single-digit numbers of trans athletes competing in school sports. Can you imagine the toll it must take on those kids knowing that people are spending so much time and money to enact laws so that single out so few people.

And of course, the people who are working so hard on these laws, that affect such a small number of people, like to complain about “big government.” Then stop fucking making it the government’s business what kind of genitals a high school athlete has!

[aurora]

I was a competitive athlete as a youth. I can't even imagine the mental health damage I would have suffered if I had to prove myself through invasive exams (assaults).

What kind of monsters think it's OK to require this of our children?

[bears]

Jun 6, 2022 9:02:39 GMT -5 NewOrleans said:

Jun 6, 2022 8:52:11 GMT -5 bears said:

I also am really frustrated on how children's sports are being used a kudgel in these conversations and I think it's in this position because people have lost their damn minds when it comes to kids sports.

This is happening because they are bigoted perverts, not because they are sports fans.

Not at all what I was saying. The state legislatures certainly don't give a shit about kids sports, let alone girls sports. What I was saying is that the hyper-competitive atmosphere of kids sports give a good foundation for these bigots to hang their moral panic on. If it wasn't girls sports, they would find something else.

[foundmylazybum]

Jun 6, 2022 9:02:39 GMT -5 NewOrleans said:

Jun 6, 2022 8:52:11 GMT -5 bears said:

I also am really frustrated on how children's sports are being used a kudgel in these conversations and I think it's in this position because people have lost their damn minds when it comes to kids sports.

This is happening because they are bigoted perverts, not because they are sports fans.

Hopefully everyone in this conversation here knows that this is happening because of bigotry. Something that is additionally frustrating/harmful is that this argument is being cast around "Saving Women's Sport." 

WTF? Women's sports are not at risk here and it is absolutely disgusting and inaccurate and none of these people are interested in doing anything at all that actually uplifts women in sport, especially youth sport.  Every time I read any type of commentary on the "threat to women's sport," I can feel my rage boil over. 

EDIT: 
Also, the people talking rambling on about this have (probably obviously) absolutely zero interest in uplifting trans. non-binary or intersex people in sport and these groups need care, concern and advocacy. It's utter nonsense and the definition of a sham at it's baseline that this argument is being cast around some sort of care about pushing the boundaries of sport and athletics to the next level of excellence. 

[NewOrleans]

Jun 6, 2022 9:18:12 GMT -5 bears said:

Jun 6, 2022 9:02:39 GMT -5 NewOrleans said:

This is happening because they are bigoted perverts, not because they are sports fans.

Not at all what I was saying. The state legislatures certainly don't give a shit about kids sports, let alone girls sports. What I was saying is that the hyper-competitive atmosphere of kids sports give a good foundation for these bigots to hang their moral panic on. If it wasn't girls sports, they would find something else.

Gotcha, thanks. You are saying they are using an existing culture (youth athletics) as the inroad to recruit more parents to the bigoted cause, parents who might not otherwise have feelings against trans rights but do have especially strong feelings about their kids’ athletic prospects, so the bigots capitalize on that. 

[NewOrleans]

Jun 6, 2022 9:32:35 GMT -5 foundmylazybum said:

Jun 6, 2022 9:02:39 GMT -5 NewOrleans said:

This is happening because they are bigoted perverts, not because they are sports fans.

Hopefully everyone in this conversation here knows that this is happening because of bigotry. Something that is additionally frustrating/harmful is that this argument is being cast around "Saving Women's Sport." 

WTF? Women's sports are not at risk here and it is absolutely disgusting and inaccurate and none of these people are interested in doing anything at all that actually uplifts women in sport, especially youth sport.  Every time I read any type of commentary on the "threat to women's sport," I can feel my rage boil over. 

It’s like a few years ago with the bathroom stuff.  Protect our girls from men in the bathroom! (But not in actual legal processes when they’ve been assaulted!)

 

[foundmylazybum]

NewOrleans, 100%. This isn't the strongest example, but when the NCAA basketball tournaments demonstrated visible disparities in facilities between men's and women's weight and lounge areas, it was a huge example of how there are glaring disparities in access to a lot of things between men's and women's sports.

I GUARANTEE that some of the same people who are all about "saving women and girls" from the "Trans People" who want to "override Title IX" were in the comments and talking at lunch about how the women basketball players didn't deserve equal access to facilities because their sport just isn't popular like men's basketball so why give them nice things. And that WAS a Title IX violation!!! AND (sorry now I'm on it lol) the reasons why women's sports aren't as "popular" as men's is completely rooted in misogyny from top to bottom at every. single. level. But no fucking way are people willing to examine and change that.

Instead we want to "Save Women's Sports" by invading bodies.

:::Rage cup over filled:::