Your own mom and guilt trips

[ProfessorArtNerd]

I’m not sure how well that title works, but anyway.

I have a sister, two years younger than me. We are very close. She works overnights, and I work part time. We make sister dates every so often, to go shopping or go out to eat, me, her and my baby. You know, while our kids are at school. We also chat a lot via text, Instagram dms, you know, friends stuff.

Whenever she and I have plans, our mom gets all huffy and “must be nice”. Like we ALWAYS have to include her. But we do make plans with her as well- this is just about her making us feel bad about our sister days. I think, objectively, I do more things with mom than my sister does- but sister lives there with my parents and her son (17).

Sister shakes it off, I have a harder time with it. I guess I’m just looking for commiseration? Maybe how you’d respond? I swear we aren’t being mean to my mom! She’s not really up to walking around like Buy Buy Baby and BBW and Target. It’s ok for us to just do things as sister-friends, isn’t it?

[W.T.Faulkner]

I'd try to shake it off like your sister does. I don't even know how much of a response it needs. You're very much entitled to time with your sister without your mom, especially since I know you are close with your mom, and your sister LIVES WITH HER(!?).

[smock]

Of course it's okay for you to do things with your sister without including your mom every time!

My mom can be passive-aggressive like this. It's almost like the closeness between me and my sister is somehow excluding her? I ignore her comments––I know that I'm not excluding anyone so I don't buy into her weird emotional manipulation tactics. That's easier said than done, of course.

If you want to respond, I would ignore her undercurrents and just say, "Yeah, I'm looking forward to some sister time." Or literally ignore. Your mom probably wants you to engage so she can act like a victim (at least that's how my mom responds!). As long as you know you're behaving respectfully toward her, then ignore her comments.

[noodleoo]

Yeah, you need to ignore it. That's crazy. My sister and I have always done lots of things together without our mom starting when we could drive. I think my mom is happy that we are close (as she should be!). I can't even imagine her making me feel bad about it. Sister time is very different than sister + mom time!  

[ECB]

As we deal with FIL trying to guilt us... all I can really say is "try to blow it off". DH will literally just ignore some of his comments.

I really don't know what else you can say to her that won't make it become an issue.

[lust2hart]

My mom gets very jealous when I do things with other family members without her. The ways that I manage it are: 1.) I don't tell her my plans ahead of time; and 2.) I remind myself that I am not responsible for her feelings. In your case, when she makes a comment like that, I'd honestly just ignore her and remind yourself that you don't need to feel guilty about the fact that you want to spend time with your sister.

[Susie]

When my mom was alive I sort of had the opposite.  My brother and I aren't close, and my mom used to try to manipulate situations to try to get us to do things together.  It felt super forced and meddling, and was probably in the end detrimental to our relationship.  She died 6 years ago, and we actually communicate more easily now that she isn't getting in the middle.

What she did wasn't ok, and neither is what your mom is doing.  You can only control your end, so I'd just do the best you can to defuse those situations, "yes, it will be a nice day out! [then change subject]" and KOKO.

[sproctopus]

This is my mom exactly. It's an insult to her that my sister and I are close. When we are all together, if my sister and I laugh, we're laughing at her. It's her own insecurity and jealousy and I can't fix it for her.She isn't willing to work on it-- it's either generational or that she doesn't believe she feels jealousy or whatever the emotion is happening there. Directly discussing it leads to a ridiculous spiral because she can't handle a conversation about her "wrongs" because she snowballs it and comes back harder with accusations.

It's negatively impacted our relationship because it's toxic. I wouldn't tolerate that behavior from a friend and I don’t give genetics a bigger break. So my way of dealing with it is to communicate less.

This probably isn't helpful, but so many people give parents a pass for doing hurtful things repetitively. You already have a lot of things in life going on and to take care of without worrying that 1 thing you might do for fun or self-care would hurt someone's feelings for absolutely no reason.

[wanderingback]

Ugh that’s annoying. Of course you don’t have to include her in everything!
I think you can either just ignore and let it roll off your back or say something strongly worded to get her to stop. I’ve had to do that once or twice with my mom who kept saying stupid stuff like that that was absolutely unnecessary. Thankfully it worked and she stopped doing it.

Whatever you decide to do just know you’re obviously not doing anything wrong!

[joy]

Are you my sister?

[joy]

Jul 19, 2022 13:15:32 GMT -5 sproctopus said:

This is my mom exactly. It's an insult to her that my sister and I are close. When we are all together, if my sister and I laugh, we're laughing at her. It's her own insecurity and jealousy and I can't fix it for her.She isn't willing to work on it-- it's either generational or that she doesn't believe she feels jealousy or whatever the emotion is happening there. Directly discussing it leads to a ridiculous spiral because she can't handle a conversation about her "wrongs" because she snowballs it and comes back harder with accusations.

It's negatively impacted our relationship because it's toxic. I wouldn't tolerate that behavior from a friend and I don’t give genetics a bigger break. So my way of dealing with it is to communicate less.

This probably isn't helpful, but so many people give parents a pass for doing hurtful things repetitively. You already have a lot of things in life going on and to take care of without worrying that 1 thing you might do for fun or self-care would hurt someone's feelings for absolutely no reason.

Oh wait, no. You are my sister.

This is my life.

[Patsy Baloney]

Have you ever said plainly, “Don’t guilt trip us, Mom.” Or even the more cheeky response to, “Must be nice,” of, “It is nice! I really enjoy spending time with my sister!”

I think a good balance of “let it roll” and “call Mom on her shit,” is needed. I don’t know who these people are who experience bad behavior that goes away when you ignore it. That doesn’t really seem to happen in my life. And I know you love your mom, so there’s no reason to be a huge snatch and tell her to take a walk.

But one of my favorite parts about being an adult is feeling like I can say things like, “Mom, I really don’t like it when you make me feel guilty for spending time with my sister. You may not even realize you’re doing it. But when you make comments like x, I feel y…” and feel like we’re on equal footing sitting at the same table.

[UMaineTeach]

This situation has an air of familiarity to it for sure.

[flex]

I have the same problem with my little sister (my mom passed away 6 years ago and middle sister passed last year). I have 2 cousins that are super close to me in age so we do chick stuff together a lot. Sometimes my aunts (their mothers) come along too. My little sister is 10 years younger than I and she DOES have cousins in her age group but never makes any effort to hang out with them. She gets all butt hurt when I post FB pics with my cuzzies. Ugh.

[cville]

For stuff like this (annoying guilt grumbling, random snark), I try to remember that RBG said that for a marriage to work sometimes it helps to be a little deaf. Same goes true for families. It's haaaaaard, but when I can do it I feel better.


If it's starting to fundamentally affect your relationship, then I say a gentle call out followed by a hard core "I can't hear you" may work better.

[waverly]

I might say something like "I do more with you, mom, than I do with sister. And we deserve some one on one time with sister too."

But, you could also invite her on 1 sister event and say oh yes we invited you on sister day. Let's do a girls day getting pedicures, or something like that.

But after all of that, I would definitely try the ignore approach. You addressed it, and she continued how she was, so there isn't anything left to say on the subject.

[waverly]

Jul 19, 2022 14:53:29 GMT -5 flex said:

I have the same problem with my little sister (my mom passed away 6 years ago and middle sister passed last year). I have 2 cousins that are super close to me in age so we do chick stuff together a lot. Sometimes my aunts (their mothers) come along too. My little sister is 10 years younger than I and she DOES have cousins in her age group but never makes any effort to hang out with them. She gets all butt hurt when I post FB pics with my cuzzies. Ugh.

I'm old school with social media, but I wouldn't post if I knew it was upsetting her.  I would still hang though.  

[ECB]

Jul 19, 2022 15:28:30 GMT -5 waverly said:

I might say something like "I do more with you, mom, than I do with sister. And we deserve some one on one time with sister too."

But, you could also invite her on 1 sister event and say oh yes we invited you on sister day. Let's do a girls day getting pedicures, or something like that.

But after all of that, I would definitely try the ignore approach. You addressed it, and she continued how she was, so there isn't anything left to say on the subject.

I feel like this could open the flood gates for MORE guilt trips.  "You invited me last time, why not this time too?".  But I do agree with your first sentence - I think it's a great way to remind her that you and your sister have a relationship to foster too. 

[magic]

Yes it’s okay that you do things just with your sister! You’re entitled to your relationship with her. This isn’t about your mom.

Having a close sibling relationship is really special for those of us lucky enough to have it. It’s actually my dream that my kids will remain friends in adulthood independently of me.

[jlt19]

Jul 19, 2022 13:15:32 GMT -5 sproctopus said:

This is my mom exactly. It's an insult to her that my sister and I are close. When we are all together, if my sister and I laugh, we're laughing at her. It's her own insecurity and jealousy and I can't fix it for her.She isn't willing to work on it-- it's either generational or that she doesn't believe she feels jealousy or whatever the emotion is happening there. Directly discussing it leads to a ridiculous spiral because she can't handle a conversation about her "wrongs" because she snowballs it and comes back harder with accusations.

It's negatively impacted our relationship because it's toxic. I wouldn't tolerate that behavior from a friend and I don’t give genetics a bigger break. So my way of dealing with it is to communicate less.

This probably isn't helpful, but so many people give parents a pass for doing hurtful things repetitively. You already have a lot of things in life going on and to take care of without worrying that 1 thing you might do for fun or self-care would hurt someone's feelings for absolutely no reason.

This is my MIL and DH/SIL’s exactly. The three barely talk to her now. In fact, in May, I went to Hamilton with DD, both SIL’s, nieces AND one SIL’s MIL. We didn’t let her know that bit.

[ProfessorArtNerd]

Jul 19, 2022 16:03:54 GMT -5 ECB said:

Jul 19, 2022 15:28:30 GMT -5 waverly said:

I might say something like "I do more with you, mom, than I do with sister. And we deserve some one on one time with sister too."

But, you could also invite her on 1 sister event and say oh yes we invited you on sister day. Let's do a girls day getting pedicures, or something like that.

But after all of that, I would definitely try the ignore approach. You addressed it, and she continued how she was, so there isn't anything left to say on the subject.

I feel like this could open the flood gates for MORE guilt trips.  "You invited me last time, why not this time too?".  But I do agree with your first sentence - I think it's a great way to remind her that you and your sister have a relationship to foster too. 

Yeah I think the next time we are all together I’ll try to point out like oooh we are all us “Maiden name” girls together! (Maiden name is such a weird word) (anyway). Or even better, when I have Lucy with me too, “three generations!”

I definitely feel the compounded guilt of my mom’s being a multiple cancer survivor thrown in there. And of COURSE there’s tension with my sister living there with my parents, which is a post for another day. Ah, good old Catholic guilt.

[Monica Geller]

Jul 19, 2022 13:15:32 GMT -5 sproctopus said:

This is my mom exactly. It's an insult to her that my sister and I are close. When we are all together, if my sister and I laugh, we're laughing at her. It's her own insecurity and jealousy and I can't fix it for her.She isn't willing to work on it-- it's either generational or that she doesn't believe she feels jealousy or whatever the emotion is happening there. Directly discussing it leads to a ridiculous spiral because she can't handle a conversation about her "wrongs" because she snowballs it and comes back harder with accusations.

It's negatively impacted our relationship because it's toxic. I wouldn't tolerate that behavior from a friend and I don’t give genetics a bigger break. So my way of dealing with it is to communicate less.

This probably isn't helpful, but so many people give parents a pass for doing hurtful things repetitively. You already have a lot of things in life going on and to take care of without worrying that 1 thing you might do for fun or self-care would hurt someone's feelings for absolutely no reason.

Are you my sister?

I could have written this for the most part. My sister is the one who has a harder time shaking it off. I know I can never make my mom happy and am better at not sharing my every thought and plan in order to avoid the drama.

[joy]

Jul 19, 2022 16:54:29 GMT -5 Monica Geller said:

Jul 19, 2022 13:15:32 GMT -5 sproctopus said:

This is my mom exactly. It's an insult to her that my sister and I are close. When we are all together, if my sister and I laugh, we're laughing at her. It's her own insecurity and jealousy and I can't fix it for her.She isn't willing to work on it-- it's either generational or that she doesn't believe she feels jealousy or whatever the emotion is happening there. Directly discussing it leads to a ridiculous spiral because she can't handle a conversation about her "wrongs" because she snowballs it and comes back harder with accusations.

It's negatively impacted our relationship because it's toxic. I wouldn't tolerate that behavior from a friend and I don’t give genetics a bigger break. So my way of dealing with it is to communicate less.

This probably isn't helpful, but so many people give parents a pass for doing hurtful things repetitively. You already have a lot of things in life going on and to take care of without worrying that 1 thing you might do for fun or self-care would hurt someone's feelings for absolutely no reason.

Are you my sister?

I could have written this for the most part. My sister is the one who has a harder time shaking it off. I know I can never make my mom happy and am better at not sharing my every thought and plan in order to avoid the drama.

We need a support group.

[tacokick]

My ILs were like this until one day my husband told them that they needed to talk to their therapists about it if they had a problem and not to bother him with passive aggressive comments anymore. If they tried again he got off the phone. They caught on.


Switching to not telling them what we are doing/who with/where ever or until after it happened helped a lot too. It’s a little tricker since your sister lives with her but the old, “Where are you going?” “Out” door slam is a classic for a reason. I’m very pro low info for people that doesn’t involve them. She’s not invited, she doesn’t need to know what you are doing. If she finds out afterward, just say it was sister time.

I know you do a lot with your mom so it’s not like you are neglecting her! She needs to accept you can do things without her. You guys are grown! She should be happy you want to spend time with your sister!

[goldengirlz]

My mom is the exact. same. way.

She’s gotten worse since my dad died because now she sees herself as “one of the girls.” Her passive aggressive comments always involve some form of, “You just want to go out together so you can complain about me.”

(Which, hey, is sometimes true. But also, like, this is why we complain about her.)

Anyway. We just ignore it. My therapist says this is about her and not about us. We’re not doing anything wrong. We’re allowed to develop our own relationships and set our own boundaries. It’s healthy!

[sproctopus]

goldengirlz Yes! I've talked forever about my mom with my therapist and finally he told me that it's just not an actionable item because it's one-sided work that will never get her to come around. It was hard because I don't want her to feel hurt by anything I'm doing because it's not my intention.Clarifying or being direct has never one time resulted in her even coming close to acknowledging that it wasn't intentional. I would even take her saying "Hey, I feel hurt when you guys laugh at jokes. I wish I could take them easier, but I'm sensitive about it." BUT NEVER. It's always some passive aggressive reaction from her and then a guilt trip.

Definitely give anyone that behaves like this a chance to fix it. After that, it's a them problem and I can't waste my life people pleasing someone who cannot be pleased.

[sproctopus]

goldengirlz And to that, my mom is even more horrified that my sister and I are in therapy. She is certain she's the hot topic there.

[goldengirlz]

Jul 19, 2022 17:26:58 GMT -5 sproctopus said:

goldengirlz And to that, my mom is even more horrified that my sister and I are in therapy. She is certain she's the hot topic there.

Oh yes. My mom is the same way about that too. I know it’s generational but it’s still frustrating. Not only is she convinced that all we do in therapy is talk about her, but she believes that we wouldn’t even need therapy if we just confided in her more.

Meanwhile, she CLEARLY would benefit from therapy herself.

[flex]

Jul 19, 2022 15:31:09 GMT -5 waverly said:

Jul 19, 2022 14:53:29 GMT -5 flex said:

I have the same problem with my little sister (my mom passed away 6 years ago and middle sister passed last year). I have 2 cousins that are super close to me in age so we do chick stuff together a lot. Sometimes my aunts (their mothers) come along too. My little sister is 10 years younger than I and she DOES have cousins in her age group but never makes any effort to hang out with them. She gets all butt hurt when I post FB pics with my cuzzies. Ugh.

I'm old school with social media, but I wouldn't post if I knew it was upsetting her.  I would still hang though.  

I get what you're saying, but my cousins who are also her "friends" on FB like to share photos of themselves and their mothers with their siblings.  

[Leeham Rimes]

My mother does the same and I just ignore it. She’s doing it for attention, control, whatever. I refuse to give her what she wants, so if she were to do this to me I’d say “yeah it is nice, so ____ insert other topic here” I just breeze right over it.