Out-earning your H no longer problematic

[agnes]

May 12, 2023 15:21:21 GMT -5 bee20 said:

This is great to see. I have always outearned my partners and I sort of wonder if that's on purpose. I really dislike the idea of being "stuck" with someone and have focused on financial stability for myself over other goals. I also think I'd be really frustrated if I got "overruled" financially...the example above of "oh, if we don't want to pay for it I'll just cover it" from a partner would be really annoying to me.

I think that scenario is lack of communication, boundaries, and respect.  Right now, since H makes more money, we still have to agree on a big purchase.  Yes, we can veto one another, but the other person can' be like hey I want this and I'm going to buy it anyways! That's not how a partnership works with us. 

[wanderingback]

Yeah if I stayed home I still wouldn’t do the domestic tasks and my partner knows that…and still loves me

We just moved and he’s done most of the unpacking and organizing and deciding if we need a new bookshelf or whatever. I scheduled the movers and coordinated when they were coming.

Not saying that things are perfect but it is possible to have 2 partners be career oriented and share the household tasks and mental load. We both recognize our strengths and weaknesses and when someone might need more help with something.

I do think it helped we kind of set those expectations from the beginning of our relationship and we both haven’t tried to change each other.

[bee20]

wanderingback , getting all the domestic tasks done would be very difficult for me. @deleted

[BlondeSpiders]

May 12, 2023 10:10:37 GMT -5 bears said:

May 12, 2023 9:08:11 GMT -5 gt7301b said:

I make more than my husband and he has always been supportive of me making more money because ultimately it helps our family.  

When MH and I were dating, I asked him how he would feel if I made more than him and his response was, "Awesome! Then we would have more money!"

What's the husband equivalent of "wifey material?" <3 

[audette]

I outearn DH now, although for the first 15-ish years of our marriage, he outearned me, and my career had little to no progression (we discussed this prior to marriage). I also worked part time for much of the time when I was earning less, so had more time available to handle things.


While I sometimes feel a bit frustrated with the amount of work DH does at home, in reflection, he has taken some tasks off my plate pretty much completely - as in, I don't have to think about it, even. The split is probably still not even, but it's better than it was earlier in our marriage.

DH grew up with his mom working, and she was a single parent from his early years.

[somersault72]

My dad is behind the times in a lot of ways but he was thrilled the day my mom started outearning him (I believe they were in their late 40s). His thought has always been more money is money no matter who it's coming from. He is now retired and she is still working (at least 50 hours a week) and the "division" of labor is laughable but at least there's that....

[heygrey]

May 12, 2023 15:33:59 GMT -5 agnes said:

May 12, 2023 15:21:21 GMT -5 bee20 said:

This is great to see. I have always outearned my partners and I sort of wonder if that's on purpose. I really dislike the idea of being "stuck" with someone and have focused on financial stability for myself over other goals. I also think I'd be really frustrated if I got "overruled" financially...the example above of "oh, if we don't want to pay for it I'll just cover it" from a partner would be really annoying to me.

I think that scenario is lack of communication, boundaries, and respect.  Right now, since H makes more money, we still have to agree on a big purchase.  Yes, we can veto one another, but the other person can' be like hey I want this and I'm going to buy it anyways! That's not how a partnership works with us. 

Agreed. I would not be happy in a relationship where my partner felt they could overrule me based on our income contributions. H outlearns me 3:1, but all of our financial planning, goal setting, and big spending are joint decisions. I made a lot of sacrifices to support our family (not the least of which was immigrating and setting my career start back by several years), I'd be pissed if H held his income over my head. 

That said, if I outearned H, he would be absolutely delighted. More money is more money for both of us. If I earned enough that he could scale back and work less hours, even better. 

[mrsukyankee]

My H definitely never tells me I can't buy something I would like. And I'm the same with him. We do talk about big budget items but not the smaller ones. I would not be married to him if he tried to hold my income over my head (though he does like to pretend like he's doing it as a laugh).

[basilosaurus]

I'm pretty sure this was the dream of everyone I've dated. Wannabe gold diggers

[simpsongal]

May 11, 2023 21:09:30 GMT -5 goldengirlz said:

May 11, 2023 20:06:11 GMT -5 @villainv said:

I think men who grow up with mothers who worked outside of the home and contributed significantly to household income also feel less threatened by a working wife, especially one who might make more than them.

Anecdotally, my first husband was extremely threatened by my career and my income, and his mom didn’t work outside of the home, and made no income. Neither he nor his family were supportive of my career. My second husband (of the same age and generation) has a mom who worked a long career outside of the home earning a significant amount (maybe 30-40% of the HHI) and he and his family are both very supportive.

Really good point about how it’s been normalized for many men. And not just the idea of women earning more. But also contributing to more of the housework that’s then required from them.

Also anecdotal, but the happiest couples I know are the ones that feel like equal partners. A lot of ink gets spilled on how men feel about higher-earning wives, but less discussed is those 1970s high earners who were also doing an outsized share of the domestic labor. That breeds resentment. And it’s definitely getting better.

This is interesting but I’ve seen multiple reports recently that even breadwinning wives are doing more in the home: www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/women-breadwinners-tripled-since-1970s-still-doing-more-unpaid-work/

You’d hope it would be more equal, but maybe there’s some societal pressure at play, or a feeling you have to do it all, or make your spouse feel better about having a high earning yet still domestic rockstar.

[underwaterrhymes]

@@@@


H and I have a fairly good balance. He does most of the dishes and laundry, changes the litter boxes, scoops dog poop, takes out trash and recycling, does kid drop off and pick up, sweeps / mops, and walks the dogs. I make kid lunches and help get them ready in the AM, cook dinner, vacuum, clean the bathrooms, do the general tidying, and carry most of the mental load (remembering birthdays, buying teacher gifts, etc.) We both pay the bills.

H is MUCH better than I am about getting motivated and since he was a terrific caregiver when I was recovering from my mastectomy-related surgeries and my hysterectomy, I am confident he would rock being a SAH partner. However, we definitely are a dual income family.

I’m super aware, though, that we are privileged and fortunate to have jobs that give us both great work-life balance. We don’t live near family and things would be a lot more challenging if one or both of us had jobs that were more demanding.

[ssmjlm]

I've pretty much always made more than DH. It's just ebbed and flowed by how much. Last year I made 50% more than he did. He was fine with it.

His mom didn't work growing up, so I can't attribute his confidence in my career from his home life. Honestly, his home life was kind of crappy with very traditionally expected roles.

@@@
DH would be a fantastic SAHP. He would get into a schedule and I would be living the dream. As it is, we split 50/50 most of the time for all activities, etc.


We're planning for him to retire at 60 in 10 years. I am looking forward to my years with a house husband.

[livinitup]

I keep thinking about my mother who graduated nursing school
in the ‘70s. At the time, it was clear to her that it was one of 3 educational paths available to women for solid employment and a good income (nursing, teaching, admin assistant). She has often remarked that it was an open secret that it was called a “divorce degree” because wives would go to nursing school with the goal to be financially secure enough to divorce. My mom has been happily married for 50+ years, no divorce for them.

It does seems like we view these trends as the husband “doesn’t mind” having a wife who equals or out-earns him. Maybe the discussion should really be centered on the wife who “doesn’t mind” because once a wife has any income stability, she can leave a marriage.

[wildrice]

My H at long last out-earns me - for the first several years of our relationship I was the main income while he was a PhD student, and then we both earned roughly the same amount for a couple of years. Now he's around 35k more than me and it honestly for the first time in my adult life feels like a relief. I actually have arrived at a point where I am happy in my career, but it's taken a long time to feel that way and I felt the pressure that I couldn't make a change without significantly impacting my/our finances. Now it's nice to know that if I decide I don't want to do this anymore, I actually could make a change to a lower paying role without it being a problem.

It never bothered my H that I earned more, but things do feel a little more fair now I guess? He's always had demanding work and gets very stressed about it, so I've always shouldered more of the housework/mental load and that can feel very unfair when I'm also the one earning more/the same. Ultimately though he and I have always been on the same page financially and so it kind of hasn't mattered who earned more. Since I do the budgeting he generally defers to me anyway.

I am thankful that I've never been in a position where I had to rely on a man. I out-earned my XH by quite a bit so although it was obviously a hit to HHI to divorce, it never had to be a question of whether or not it was possible. I don't see any problems like that occurring my current marriage, but I am glad to know that I always have an "out" if I were to ever need it.

[trentcrimm]

I've been the primary breadwinner in our household for about 8 years now, and it's ideal because I can't cook or manage money very well so he takes care of all that. 

I think he gave a Costco clerk something to think about last week when he was exchanging a meat purchase and they joked asking him if the wife had sent him back because he got the wrong thing. He rightly told her that my involvement is limited to eating and then cleaning up after. 

[okla]

Back about 17 years ago when I was 23 or 24 and married to my first H, we had a counselor (Christian counseling center) tell me that the reason he was emotionally abusive to me was because I emasculated him by earning more. Literally told him to get a second job so he’d be the breadwinner and could feel like a man again. Jesus fuck, I haven’t thought about that in years. We divorced soon after.

My now-H and I have been married almost 5 years and we’ve spent most of that time going back and forth with who is earning more, but it’s always pretty close. He has never cared if I made more or felt any kind of way about it expect that having more money is cool.

[trentcrimm]

May 22, 2023 22:50:30 GMT -5 okla said:

Back about 17 years ago when I was 23 or 24 and married to my first H, we had a counselor (Christian counseling center) tell me that the reason he was emotionally abusive to me was because I emasculated him by earning more. Literally told him to get a second job so he’d be the breadwinner and could feel like a man again. Jesus fuck, I haven’t thought about that in years. We divorced soon after.

Leave it to the church to make a woman feel guilty for being more successful than a dude.

I'm sorry they treated you that way. My mom got ostracized from our church because she divorced my dad instead of forgiving and forgetting his extramarital affair. Aren't they precious. 

[shauni27]

trentcrimm I liked for solidarity, not because of the way the church treated your mother.

[pinkdutchtulips]

May 22, 2023 22:50:30 GMT -5 okla said:

Back about 17 years ago when I was 23 or 24 and married to my first H, we had a counselor (Christian counseling center) tell me that the reason he was emotionally abusive to me was because I emasculated him by earning more. Literally told him to get a second job so he’d be the breadwinner and could feel like a man again. Jesus fuck, I haven’t thought about that in years. We divorced soon after.

My now-H and I have been married almost 5 years and we’ve spent most of that time going back and forth with who is earning more, but it’s always pretty close. He has never cared if I made more or felt any kind of way about it expect that having more money is cool.

I was told the same thing by 'christian' counselors only he wasn't working and had zero desire to work. I didn't bother asking how we were to avoid homelessness with both of us not working. 

That was another nail in the divorce coffin.