Ghetto. The word.

[hannamaren]

Is this word off limits?
I dont think I ever use it. I am being honest.

This is not an accusatory post, it is a real question.

[Deleted]

I would never use it.

[Deleted]

No, it is not off-limits. For instance, it is perfectly fine to talk about the Jewish ghettos in Europe from way back when.

But to call someone ghetto or to say that you don't want to live in a neighborhood because it is ghetto is where you get into trouble.

[runblondie26]

I consider it off limits.

[Deleted]

Oct 15, 2012 9:15:32 GMT -5 v said:

No, it is not off-limits. For instance, it is perfectly fine to talk about the Jewish ghettos in Europe from way back when.

But to call someone ghetto or to say that you don't want to live in a neighborhood because it is ghetto is where you get into trouble.

This.

[bunnysmom]

Oct 15, 2012 9:15:32 GMT -5 v said:

No, it is not off-limits. For instance, it is perfectly fine to talk about the Jewish ghettos in Europe from way back when.

But to call someone ghetto or to say that you don't want to live in a neighborhood because it is ghetto is where you get into trouble.

Exactly this. Also I think that when you call something a ghetto you're dismising the real origin of the word and minimizing the reality of the people that ACTUALLY lived in a ghetto.

I see it like calling someone a nazi. If you call everyone a nazi then you have no idea what a real nazi was and you only show your ignorance and disrespect to the people that actually had to deal with the nazis.

They are serious words that shouldn't be used lightly.

[carfar]

Oct 15, 2012 9:21:18 GMT -5 @blessed said:

Oct 15, 2012 9:15:32 GMT -5 v said:

No, it is not off-limits. For instance, it is perfectly fine to talk about the Jewish ghettos in Europe from way back when.

But to call someone ghetto or to say that you don't want to live in a neighborhood because it is ghetto is where you get into trouble.

This.

It is really one of my bigger pet peeves and I cringe when people use it in a derogatory way.

Exactly!

[bronxgirl]

Oct 15, 2012 9:26:13 GMT -5 bunnysmom said:

Oct 15, 2012 9:15:32 GMT -5 v said:

No, it is not off-limits. For instance, it is perfectly fine to talk about the Jewish ghettos in Europe from way back when.

But to call someone ghetto or to say that you don't want to live in a neighborhood because it is ghetto is where you get into trouble.

Exactly this. Also I think that when you call something a ghetto you're dismising the real origin of the word and minimizing the reality of the people that ACTUALLY lived in a ghetto.

I see it like calling someone a nazi. If you call everyone a nazi then you have no idea what a real nazi was and you only show your ignorance and disrespect to the people that actually had to deal with the nazis.

They are serious words that shouldn't be used lightly.

Very well stated.

[h]

I think its like gay, retarded, or a host of other words that have an acceptable place in the English language but should not be used in a derogatory manner. v's reference to historical discussion of Jewish ghettos is an example of acceptable use.

[whitepicketfence]

Oct 15, 2012 9:16:51 GMT -5 runblondie26 said:

I consider it off limits.

As do I.

[Deleted]

Oct 15, 2012 12:15:58 GMT -5 whitepicketfence said:

Oct 15, 2012 9:16:51 GMT -5 runblondie26 said:

I consider it off limits.

As do I.

But, like, what word would you use then to talk about the Jewish ghettos? They're a real, historic thing, and that's a real word for them. They were a bad thing, but using the word "ghetto" to describe them is accurate and not derogatory -- that's what they were called.

[dr.girlfriend]

Am I the only one who has had "In the Ghetto" stuck in my head since yesterday? I keep alternating between that and "Harlem Blues."

On a cold and grey Chicago morn, another little baby child is born in the ghetto...

[Deleted]

Oct 15, 2012 9:23:32 GMT -5 @booby said:

i use it. but i have a whole vocabulary of 'off limits' words. whatev. know your audience, as they say...

This. I used it over the weekend to describe where I went to high school.

[agnes]

I personally wouldn't say it (especially on here) because I don't want to offend anyone and start a shit storm.

IRL I know plenty of people who use ghetto, retard, gay, etc. and no one has gotten up in arms over it.

[childofhiphop]

I think it is all in context.

I think because of the negative origins (first as areas where Jews were confined for living and later as thickly populated slums resulting from social and/or economic pressures and hardships) that people are hesitant to use the word even where appropriate.

This country seems to avoid poverty as a problem and in conversation.

In the personal derogatory sense, I don't use it.

I think people say ghetto when they really mean someone is tacky, uncouth or lacking manners. I also think that every person fails into part of those descriptions at some point (no one is perfect), so who I am to judge or name call?

[Deleted]

Oct 15, 2012 15:51:52 GMT -5 @songforyou said:

I don't use it. I'll also add that when non-Black people use it, it's usually a code word for "someplace where Black people live that I want no parts of", like "inner-city" or something totally effed up, derived from the former. Either way, it makes alarms sound in my head and I have to do everything to practice restraint.

What about black people using it?

I'll be honest, I use it. A lot. So do a lot of my friends, especially when I tell them where I went to school. UT doesn't have an "inner city" by any means but we do have ghetto pockets if you will.

I think it really depends on context and the audience.

[Deleted]

Oct 15, 2012 16:24:20 GMT -5 @songforyou said:

Oct 15, 2012 16:04:43 GMT -5 blissanity said:

What about black people using it?

I'll be honest, I use it. A lot. So do a lot of my friends, especially when I tell them where I went to school. UT doesn't have an "inner city" by any means but we do have ghetto pockets if you will.

I think it really depends on context and the audience.

I don't like that either, but at least I know they're not saying it, like, ew, gross, I hate those Blacks. It's like the n-word. I don't use it. I don't want other people to use it, but the reality is, if another Black person says it, I'll probably look at them like . If someone else says it, I may bust them in the head with a bottle lolol. It's just different. I would tell you not to act like you know don't know, but your experience is not like the normal Black experience, so I don't really know what you know.

The bolded made me LOL. Black people are always telling me something to that extent. I just can't help but giggle. What is the "normal Black experience?" Is there such a thing?

[Deleted]

Hmm. I have never really thought about it.

There is a part of my town in Iowa that I would refer to as the ghetto. I don't know what races live there - when I first moved here, I looked at renting a couple of places there (before I knew the area) and the people showing the places were white, but I have no idea of that was a fluke or not. I associate it with being an area that is more likely to have crime and where I am probably not as safe walking around at night by myself because there are kids or others hanging around who may or may not be dangerous. I don't think the Iowa ghetto is the stereotypical ghetto though so it is probably a more sarcastic name for it than anything else.

I realize that in many areas ghetto = black and I can see why that would bother people. Maybe I should be more careful about calling an area ghetto.

[Deleted]

Oct 15, 2012 17:05:32 GMT -5 @songforyou said:

Oct 15, 2012 16:40:33 GMT -5 blissanity said:

The bolded made me LOL. Black people are always telling me something to that extent. I just can't help but giggle. What is the "normal Black experience?" Is there such a thing?

LOL ok, that's true, but honestly, there are definitely some common experiences. Maybe they're not any different from being Jewish or being from Brooklyn or whatever, but I live in a city full of transplants and yet, I can meet a Black person from almost anywhere and there ARE certain shared experiences that I might not share with a non-Black person from the same city as me.

Part of those shared experiences DO mean that I could say to barefootbarista, for example, "You know how you might bust a non-Black person in the head with a bottle for saying that?" I would not have to question, does this girl know what I mean? Does she think I might really bust someone in the head with a bottle? Does she get the difference between when a Black person and a non-Black person says it? Now, I wouldn't necessarily say that to you, because you're biracial (and to pull out the cliche, this singular part is totally irrelevant because my best friend is biracial lolol, but along with the other parts, well, I just don't know), you have mentioned/implied that you identify as white and you're from Utah. Like you and I have no shared Black experience lol. I wouldn't--and didn't--just assume that you know what I'm talking about when I say that.

Trust me, I do understand what you are saying, though, because I'm quick to throw up my hands in frustration and shriek, "Black people are not a monolith!" Still, there are undeniably some commonalities and all I'm saying is that I don't know that I share those with a biracial girl from Utah raised who's had little contact with her Black family.

Oh I realize that. However, there are a lot of experiences that we do share but people don't realize it because it's not the typical "Black experiences." If that makes sense. I bet if we sat down we'd have a lot more in common than you'd think.

Just because I personally don't have contact with my Black family doesn't mean that I don't have contact with Black people and/or the race itself. I know you weren't talking about me specifically, but I do know the difference between when a Black person says something and a non-black person says it. IE - ghetto or the N-word.

The Black people I do know are transplants and are often surprised with how much I do have in common being a "white-washed girl from Utah." There's just some inherit "Black" tendencies that I do have.

It's just frustrating for me as a biracial person because I feel forced to calm either white or black. If I say identify as white then Black people are typically "oh, I feel so sorry for you not knowing your Black side." And if I say I'm Black then non-Black people are typically "oh, you're too white-washed to be Black." I just can't win. I don't know if it's different outside of Utah. Which is one of the reasons I'm desperately trying to get out of here. LOL.

[Deleted]

Oct 15, 2012 17:11:03 GMT -5 @barefootbarista said:

Oct 15, 2012 16:40:33 GMT -5 blissanity said:

The bolded made me LOL. Black people are always telling me something to that extent. I just can't help but giggle. What is the "normal Black experience?" Is there such a thing?

No snark intended, and maybe I am not remembering correctly, but I thought you don't identify as black? I don't really care, but I do think there are common threads that bind folk, and having experienced certain things would at leasbe part of "the black experience".

I don't claim either race. I really hate having to claim either or and it's something I try and stay away from. There's several "black experiences" that I do experience. I just may not experience them the same way you (or someone else) have.

Honestly, though you'd be surprised what I have experienced and how "common" it is.

I still experience things even if I don't claim to be a specific race. I'm biracial and share more "black experiences" with those that are biracial over those who are full black/white/whatever.

[Deleted]

Oct 15, 2012 17:29:09 GMT -5 @songforyou said:

Oct 15, 2012 17:19:27 GMT -5 blissanity said:

Oh I realize that. However, there are a lot of experiences that we do share but people don't realize it because it's not the typical "Black experiences." If that makes sense. I bet if we sat down we'd have a lot more in common than you'd think.

Annnndd with the bolded...I know this is a conversation we should not have and certainly not here lol. I'll just say this. What I'm talking about is not about anything "typical". It's also not about us merely having things in common. I have plenty in common with most of MM. That's not what I mean. Anyway, I don't want to further hijack the thread, sorry for the tangent, hanna!

I know what you meant. I'm just saying that we have more "typical Black experiences" in common than you think. I'm not sure what else we'd have in common other than that.

And this definitely isn't the stage for this discussion. I, too apologize for the thread jack.

[Deleted]

Oct 15, 2012 17:31:12 GMT -5 jenny1980 said:

Oct 15, 2012 17:19:27 GMT -5 blissanity said:

Oh I realize that. However, there are a lot of experiences that we do share but people don't realize it because it's not the typical "Black experiences." If that makes sense. I bet if we sat down we'd have a lot more in common than you'd think.

Just because I personally don't have contact with my Black family doesn't mean that I don't have contact with Black people and/or the race itself. I know you weren't talking about me specifically, but I do know the difference between when a Black person says something and a non-black person says it. IE - ghetto or the N-word.

The Black people I do know are transplants and are often surprised with how much I do have in common being a "white-washed girl from Utah." There's just some inherit "Black" tendencies that I do have.

It's just frustrating for me as a biracial person because I feel forced to calm either white or black. If I say identify as white then Black people are typically "oh, I feel so sorry for you not knowing your Black side." And if I say I'm Black then non-Black people are typically "oh, you're too white-washed to be Black." I just can't win. I don't know if it's different outside of Utah. Which is one of the reasons I'm desperately trying to get out of here. LOL.

What is an "inherent black tendency"?

Whatever you wish to think it is.

This isn't really a discussion that can be had over a message board. It's also something that I can't take back. So I'll let you read into it however you'd like. Again, I apologize for running off on a tangent here.

[Deleted]

Oct 15, 2012 17:33:59 GMT -5 @songforyou said:

Oct 15, 2012 17:31:12 GMT -5 jenny1980 said:

What is an "inherent black tendency"?

See what I'm saying? You're white and live in Seattle (which come on, we all know that's an extra layer of white, am I right ?) and you get it! This is why I had to pull the plug.

Because I'm some silly, white UT girl who doesn't get it? 8-D Come on. ^o)

[orangeblossom]

In general, I dislike the word. However, I really, really dislike if when a someone who believes their station in life is better than that of someone in the ghetto (be they white, asian, etc) person says it. I mean really dislike it.

Like others have said, I think people may mean uncouth, tacky, or what have you, but it is cringe-inducing hearing when used in a negative context.

[Deleted]

Oct 15, 2012 17:50:54 GMT -5 @songforyou said:

Oct 15, 2012 17:44:00 GMT -5 blissanity said:

Because I'm some silly, white UT girl who doesn't get it? Come on.

Don't go getting all GDIAF on me. I didn't say that. Further, I support your quest to bond. I just don't think you know how and that is evidenced by saying things like "typical Black experience" (which whether you realize it or not, truly is very different from "shared Black experience") and inherent (because I'm certain that's what you meant) Black tendencies. I'm not saying that with any judgment. We are all products of our environments.

That was FAR from "going all DIAF" on someone. But you'll read the tone how you want.

Well, yes typical and shared are different. I think we have shared experiences but I may not have typical experiences. Yes, I meant inherent; what did I type? (Oh I put inherit )

My views will likely change once I leave this god forsaken bubble. I'm actually looking forward to it.

[hannamaren]

DIAF?
Die in a fire? Is this a saying?

[orangeblossom]

Oct 15, 2012 19:01:50 GMT -5 hannamaren said:

DIAF?
Die in a fire? Is this a saying?

Yes, you are a correct on both accounts.