Post by underwaterrhymes on Mar 5, 2013 19:12:49 GMT -5
I'm all for people trying stuff, but the sweeping generalizations piss me off.
If you read The China Study, dairy and animal products are the devil.
If you read Atkins it's carbs.
If you read Wheat Belly it's wheat.
If you read The Raw Cure it's cooked food.
I am pescetarian and this way of living works incredibly well for me, but I don't for a second think it would work well for everyone.
I'm a big believer in moderation and I'm also a big believer in doing what works best for you health-wise. If gluten-free or dairy-free or vegetarian or raw has been life-changing for you, I can get behind it.
What I can't get behind, though, is saying that every single person absolutely shouldn't eat an entire food group no matter what. There are a host of reasons why human beings have health problems ranging from diabetes to gastrointestinal disorders and I don't believe that any one food group is to blame.
That's not to say that I wouldn't like to see HUGE changes in our food processing and junk food consumption, but that has more to do with FDA regulations, soybean subsidies, large-scale farming practices, etc. than with the ingestion of a little bit of pasta or some bacon here and there.
LOL. Yes, the only way we can feed the hungry with wheat is twinkies and ramen. Whole wheat pasta and multigrain bread implodes outside of wealthy enclaves.
Vegetarianism did change my life. I am one of a few non-diabetics (type 2) in my family. I don't have heart problems like they do, either. My cholesterol was high AS A VEGAN. I honestly think that if I did the paleo thing at 17 instead of going veg, I'd be on a cocktail of pills like my Atkins-loving, double bacon cheeseburger wrapped in lettuce eating, yoyo-ing between obese and just overweight family. You can take your sale meat and fuck right off, thanks.
Also, Pat Robertson says if the devil in is something, you can rebuke it and you'll be fine. I'll just rebuke my whole wheat pita tonight. That makes about as much sense as you do right now.
Sounds like someone could use a burger.
The fact that you had high cholesterol as a vegan should be extremely interesting to you...How do you explain that if you were avoiding the devil meat?
Genetics. Your body does make some cholesterol on its own. In my family, we tend to make too much. This is why people blindly pushing high-cholesterol diets on people without accounting for personal medical history pisses me off.
Some dickweed convinced my sister she should lose weight by quitting grains..in high school. She was on motherfucking lipitor her sophomore year because of that bullshit and pre-diabetic to boot, plus heavier than ever before. Six months of a balanced vegetarian diet and she was down over 30 pounds, off the lipitor, and had healthy blood sugar.
See, because I am a reasonable person, I wouldn't suggest my diet (high in grains) to somebody with celiac. I don't think it is right for everyone. I don't think everyone who doesn't eat like me is doomed. I do think you, however, can go Thelma and Louise with the batty Paleo Mom blogger.
Let's see the science on how gluten causes allergies (to something other than gluten), gout (which is usually caused by excessive meat consumption), diabetes, and arthritis, to start. In fact, pubmed isn't finding much on gluten causing anything in anyone who doesn't have celiac disease, period, so I'd love to see what you're finding.
Many auto-immune and immune disorders can be directly related to systemic inflammation. For a lot of people, gluten-containing grains in particular (I would also add seed oils in a strong second place) cause systemic inflammation.
They are very few good studies and trials out there because 1.) it's hard to get them funded and 2.) it's very difficult to control unless you lock people up like lab rats and control every ounce of food they consume.
No one likes this answer because "it can't be scientifically proven!!" but speaking as someone who used to take Claritin and Flonase 365 days a year with a Benadryl top-off when things were particularly bad, I don't need a frackin' study to tell me eating an anti-inflammatory diet somehow, some way eliminated my year-round allergies. That was an awful run-on sentence I will admit, oh well.
Oh and gout is not caused by excessive meat-consumption. Gary Taubes has a long-lost chapter on this in WWGF.
The fact that you had high cholesterol as a vegan should be extremely interesting to you...How do you explain that if you were avoiding the devil meat?
Genetics. Your body does make some cholesterol on its own. In my family, we tend to make too much. This is why people blindly pushing high-cholesterol diets on people without accounting for personal medical history pisses me off.
Some dickweed convinced my sister she should lose weight by quitting grains..in high school. She was on motherfucking lipitor her sophomore year because of that bullshit and pre-diabetic to boot, plus heavier than ever before. Six months of a balanced vegetarian diet and she was down over 30 pounds, off the lipitor, and had healthy blood sugar.
See, because I am a reasonable person, I wouldn't suggest my diet (high in grains) to somebody with celiac. I don't think it is right for everyone. I don't think everyone who doesn't eat like me is doomed. I do think you, however, can go Thelma and Louise with the batty Paleo Mom blogger.
If you're referring to who I think you are (I don't want to link her blog ;-),then yes, she's crazy. I can't even read her blog anymore.
The presence of a vegan diet does not necessarily indicate any causality as far as gluten goes; the increase in other foods to compensate for a lack of meat and gluten may well have restorative properties, but this is not the same as stating definitively that gluten "causes" arthritis.
Additionally, one can't isolate which changing variable is responsible for either the condition itself or its recovery.
i just stated that to be funny, because it had vegan AND gluten free stuff (because vegans and paleo folks are on completely opposites of the diet debate).
Well, no. Nobody likes this answer because it can't even be scientifically suggested. There is only anecdotal evidence and a whooooole lot of people waiting in the wings to sell you something.
I'm glad your diet works for you; however, suggesting it'll work for everyone, or should work for everyone, is so short-sighted it's staggering.
Additionally, it should be noted that while it seems you may think Mark Sisson is a God among men, he also says Viagra and Cialis should be taken off the market because he believes in eugenics, and people who can't get erections shouldn't be allowed to attempt to reproduce or have healthy sex lives. Darwinism, apparently. What a nice, brilliant guy.
I've never bought one book. I really should, huh? I checked out books from the library (Robb Wolf's and Mark Sisson's) but otherwise 100% of the info has been free from podcasts and their websites. So the whole huckster-selling something bit doesn't really make sense here. Both those guys do unbelievable amount of content for free. If they also make a profit from their books, then that's great for them.
Also, I never suggested this is for everyone. It could be great for you, it could not. But the uproar people get in when you tell them to put down the bagel and eat some eggs never seems to get old.
If Mark Sisson said that, it's news to me and also pretty funny.
Maybe the uproar is because most people are well aware of their eating habits, and telling them to "drop the bagel and eat some eggs" is both incredibly presumptive and horrifically rude.
I'm glad you find eugenics funny, though.
Who's getting told this? As I said earlier, I never evangelize friends /family about food. I started to when I first changed my diet and was so amazed by what was happening but then I realized if people really wanted to know, they would ask.
The OP was ASKING for people's opinions which spurred the debate.
Post by wrathofkuus on Mar 5, 2013 20:05:30 GMT -5
So people "know" this, somehow, but there isn't actually any science to back it up. There's just a chapter written by some guy in a book, that isn't actually included in the book.
If gluten-free is the way to go why is the medical community now backing (thanks to a scientific study!) the Mediterranean diet which *GASP* includes grains?
Lucy is right. From an anthropological perspective, paleo hasn't a leg to stand on as an everyday diet. Last I heard, scientists believed early man's diet varied widely by geography and season.
Early man also buried huge meat caches in the ground and came back to eat it later. Where are all the hardcore paleo people advocating that we stop refrigerating meat and start keeping it in dirt instead? Paleo man didn't have a refrigerator! Refrigerators are the devil!
Lucy is right. From an anthropological perspective, paleo hasn't a leg to stand on as an everyday diet. Last I heard, scientists believed early man's diet varied widely by geography and season.
Early man also buried huge meat caches in the ground and came back to eat it later. Where are all the hardcore paleo people advocating that we stop refrigerating meat and start keeping it in dirt instead? Paleo man didn't have a refrigerator! Refrigerators are the devil!
actually that crazy paleo blogger posted about eating rotten meat for that exact reason. And made sure I can never take the paleo diet seriously at the same time.
Lucy is right. From an anthropological perspective, paleo hasn't a leg to stand on as an everyday diet. Last I heard, scientists believed early man's diet varied widely by geography and season.
Early man also buried huge meat caches in the ground and came back to eat it later. Where are all the hardcore paleo people advocating that we stop refrigerating meat and start keeping it in dirt instead? Paleo man didn't have a refrigerator! Refrigerators are the devil!
actually that crazy paleo blogger posted about eating rotten meat for that exact reason. And made sure I can never take the paleo diet seriously at the same time.
If you want to cut out wheat, fine but please don't make some statement saying "there's no place of wheat in our diets". Really? Are you 100% sure about this? For the entire population of the world, we can't eat wheat? I don't think so. I'm going to enjoy my pain aux noisettes this morning and not guilty about it!
Lol that the people are cutting out gluten are also the people who were buying twinkles and ramen.
People who cut out gluten have the luxury and money to do so.
I wish there was a "you have got to be kidding me" button. If you think eating gluten free is luxurious, you are insane. And if you don't waste money on shitty replacements, and instead just avoid, it doesn't cost a dime.
I wish there was a "you have got to be kidding me" button. If you think eating gluten free is luxurious, you are insane. And if you don't waste money on shitty replacements, and instead just avoid, it doesn't cost a dime.
Beg to differ, there are some delicious replacements out there that cost many dimes. Eating gluten-free is cheaper, not cheap, if you have the time to bake your carbs from scratch.
:::whispering::; I think she means you shouldn't eat anything baked.
Beg to differ, there are some delicious replacements out there that cost many dimes. Eating gluten-free is cheaper, not cheap, if you have the time to bake your carbs from scratch.
:::whispering::; I think she means you shouldn't eat anything baked.
No, I mean that $12 on a loaf of GF bread that tastes like styrofoam is insane. Just don't eat bread. I am not GF because it is a fad and I have oodles of money to waste on crap like that. I just don't buy the shitty, expensive bread.
Post by fuckyourcouch on Mar 6, 2013 11:01:34 GMT -5
i have been told by multiple doctors that low/no carb and/or GF (for me because of other autoimmune issues, i don't think for everyone) is best for PCOS. i assume my medical community seems to be in agreement for some reason, but i haven't bothered to look up if there are 374923 medical papers about it. i'm a scientist, but my excuse is that i never liked life sciences anyway. rocks 4 lyfe.
ETA: i'm not saying this means it is the CURE FOR ALL THE PROBLEMS! just that i've been told it is a step towards curing the symptoms by someone other than mommy bloggers.
I have all the books I could need, and what more could I need than books? I shall only engage in commerce if books are the coin. -- Catherynne M. Valente
I find this whole argument to be weird. I'm sure wheat is not the healthiest thing in the world for you. But there are so many other things to focus on before you get to that. Red meat, the vast amounts of fucking SUGAR that is in our food supply. But nope, let's focus on wheat. And the reality is, you can eat gluten free and still have a really terrible diet. A lot of GF alternative foods are super processed and contain a lot of sugar and fat comparatively.
I have had to eat GF for the past five years because of an allergy. My last blood test showed a normal response to wheat and you better fucking believe I found some good chewy bread to eat immediately. Having done it long term, I can't imagine eating that way unless you have a medical issue that requires it.