Post by awkwardpenguin on Sept 23, 2015 13:48:23 GMT -5
This is a bit of a ramble, so bear with me.
DD is 14 weeks old. DW went back to work 4 weeks ago on a reduced schedule and I've been home with DD. This week DW is working M-Th.
Things were a little rough to start. DD refused the bottle and it took about two weeks to get that figured out. But then I felt like we were finding a good rhythm and we were enjoying our time together.
She's never been a great sleeper, but starting last Tuesday she started waking 5-8 times a night. Most of the wake ups are short, but usually at least one is longer. DW and I have split the night into shifts so we each get some uninterrupted sleep. I take 10-2 and she takes 2-6. But we're both still exhausted even with that and going to bed early.
Not sleeping also seems to be affecting DD. She's had several super fussy days in the last week. She seems tired, but often her naps have been short and fitful. It's totally possible this is the 4MW coming early, although it's also possible her sleep will get even worse at 4 months.
Anyway, all that backstory is to say today has been awful. DD is incredibly fussy, constantly rubbing her eyes 15-20 minutes after she wakes up from a nap. It's 1:15 and she's fed 5 times since 7:30 but will only take an ounce or two at a time before she spits the bottle out and cries. She's taken 3 40 minute naps, which is actually not so bad. But I am at my wits end. I cried earlier, and somehow that triggered banshee screaming in DD, and I had to put her down and regroup.
After her sleep went to shit, I read Healthy Sleep Habits, Happy Child. It has this huge emphasis on protecting your child's sleep schedule and ensuring they are not overtired. So the last two days I haven't left the house because I've been trying to get her to nap so that she won't be overtired. I feel like the book has made me incredibly stressed about her sleep and feeling like I'm doing everything wrong. It also really pushes CIO for older babies, which is something we hope to not do.
Before this I was feeling really good about things. Even with her general fussiness and bottle refusing, I was able to roll with it and not worry because she's a baby being a baby. I didn't stress at 12 weeks when she was still fussy even though most babies are past that by 12 weeks. But this sleep thing has me seriously doubting myself and feeling like we must be doing something wrong. I feel like if I'd never read that book and just trusted my instincts I'd be so much happier.
TLDR, my baby stopped sleeping and it's making me crazy.
Ok. First of all, you're a great mom. I found that when I actually used that book (instead of reading it and ignoring it lol) it worked.
I don't think I would do full CIO at that age, but it probably wouldn't hurt to let the baby fuss for a few minutes before you go in. See if they can self-soothe a bit.
They definitely sound overtired so I would try swaddling, white noise and naps within 1-2 hours of their last wake up for the daytime. at this point I'd put them wherever they will sleep longer - a swing, crib or even a car ride??
At night it really helped when I had a night "routine" -bath, book, nurse. Swaddle then bed.
Post by dulcemariamar on Sept 23, 2015 14:01:09 GMT -5
(((hugs))) where does she nap? The first six months my DD took her naps in my arms. I felt like I was glued to the sofa. The other 10% were in the stroller and only if I was constantly pushing.
The whole sleep thing with a baby can be a total mindfuck. It can be pretty horrible having to be responsible for getting your LO to fall and stay asleep several times a day.
You are doing a great job. Don't worry about her sleep habits in the future. CIO is not for everyone or every child but it worked great for us.
I would really try to work on lengthening her naps.
Health Sleep Habits is the worst book to read. It's full of guilt and short on useful advice. Burn it, get Ferber. If you REALLY want to avoid CIO, get No-Cry Sleep Solutions.
Sleep deprivation is the pits. It's not about "doing something wrong". It's just the hardest thing ever. It will get better. Keep trying things. Try bedsharing if you're not totally against it. Try the swing. Try vibration. Try LOUD white noise. Try all of it at once.
Health Sleep Habits is the worst book to read. It's full of guilt and short on useful advice. Burn it, get Ferber. If you REALLY want to avoid CIO, get No-Cry Sleep Solutions.
Sleep deprivation is the pits. It's not about "doing something wrong". It's just the hardest thing ever. It will get better. Keep trying things. Try bedsharing if you're not totally against it. Try the swing. Try vibration. Try LOUD white noise. Try all of it at once.
So for me, Ferber sucked and healthy sleep was good! But I definitely think after 2 weeks or so of consistently using one method, if it's not working, try something else.
Health Sleep Habits is the worst book to read. It's full of guilt and short on useful advice. Burn it, get Ferber. If you REALLY want to avoid CIO, get No-Cry Sleep Solutions.
Sleep deprivation is the pits. It's not about "doing something wrong". It's just the hardest thing ever. It will get better. Keep trying things. Try bedsharing if you're not totally against it. Try the swing. Try vibration. Try LOUD white noise. Try all of it at once.
So for me, Ferber sucked and healthy sleep was good! But I definitely think after 2 weeks or so of consistently using one method, if it's not working, try something else.
I didn't find a "method" to healthy sleep. It was "if your kid doesn't sleep, he'll be a serial killer. Have you tried throwing him in the crib and coming back in 12 hours?"
Magic Merlin Sleep Suit. Miracle. Love the thing, worked for us, we had great naps and decent overnight sleep with DD. Try it - 2 day shipping on Amazon.
Also, bedshare if you're open to it- that also helped settle DD. Hang in there.
this sounds exactly like the 4 month wakeful period. it's pretty common but that doesn't make it easier to endure I'm sorry. Both of mine slept well until 4 months of age then went completely mad.
I hope it passes quickly for you, and if not you can try sleep training in a few weeks. Even at 4 months, Ferber says it is ok but I wasn't comfortable with letting them CIO until closer to 6 months.
You may not have to do CIO at all, I believe many babies pass through the 4MW after a couple of weeks or a month.
Don't let the book make you crazy! I've never read it but I loved Ferbers book, even if you don't plan to do CIO, it has a lot of great information.
Post by awkwardpenguin on Sept 23, 2015 14:21:11 GMT -5
She's napping in the bouncer and sleeping overnight in the RNP. Lying flat has been a no-go, even before this. So far bedsharing hasn't worked, but I think we'll try it again.
I have a Merlin Magic Sleep Suit on the way!
We definitely need to be better about a bedtime routine and a consistent bedtime. She's so unpredictable, it's been hard to set a bedtime.
We've tried EASY, but again she's really unpredictable, especially with eating. She still eats about every two hours, and sometimes will wake up mid-nap needing to eat and then go back down.
Post by jeaniebueller on Sept 23, 2015 14:21:38 GMT -5
Hugs to you. Its so tough. WHat are you doing right now and what has not worked? I don't want to give suggestions if you have already tried everything. Is she sleeping on you, in a RNP, in a crib? Is she swaddled? Does she like white noise? Are you doing bicycle legs and gas drops?
Hugs to you. Its so tough. WHat are you doing right now and what has not worked? I don't want to give suggestions if you have already tried everything. Is she sleeping on you, in a RNP, in a crib? Is she swaddled? Does she like white noise? Are you doing bicycle legs and gas drops?
At night she's swaddled in a Miracle Blanket and sleeping in the RNP.
For naps she's swaddled in a SwaddleMe and sleeping in the bouncer. This seems to be working better than the nighttime setup.
She loves loud white noise and we use that at night and for naps.
We've tried cosleeping, putting her in the cosleeper, and putting her in the crib all unsuccessfully. We've also tried regular swaddle blankets (broke out) and a Woombie (hated it).
We haven't tried gas drops. She resists bicycle legs so I feel like I've never really done them successfully.
Post by turtlegirl on Sept 23, 2015 14:39:20 GMT -5
Newborn naps are the worst. All my kids have been cat nappers who will only nap for long periods of time by being held or worn. So I try to do that as much as possible.
And keep trying the whole drowsy but awake thing, even though I knew it wouldn't work 95% of the time.
But we also sleep trained both boys right at 4 months old using Ferber. Pedi was supportive of it.
When you get her from 10-2 are you trying to feed her? Wondering if she is hungry/reverse cycling since she is not doing all that great with bottle feeding. Maybe DW nursing earlier than 2:00 would make for a longer stretch?
Also I know this is not the world's greatest solution (and I wouldn't blame you if you didn't want to try it at all) but both my kids napped ON me for...a long time. Yes I know, it wasn't the greatest but it was better for me to watch Golden Girls and have a kid who was better rested than one who catnapped for 20m off and on.
I bottle feed pumped milk during my "shift". She used to take one 3.5 oz feed during that time, but lately she's been taking 2 2.5-3 oz feeds during that time. ETA: she does much better with bottle feeding at night.
I think I should try wearing her for naps again. It used to work great, but I haven't tried it in a while.
Post by awkwardpenguin on Sept 23, 2015 14:46:16 GMT -5
To elaborate, @mrswindycity, she seems to actually do better with bottle feeding at night than nursing. She'll take larger feeds and stays down longer after a bottle than after nursing.
We've considered the reverse cycling thing, but she's taking about 12.5 oz total over a workday, which seems pretty average.
Post by pinotgrig on Sept 23, 2015 14:49:06 GMT -5
PB ate my long reply. Ugh.
The short version was - Try gas drops Try letting her sleep on you ala MWC Try a baby carrier Consider having her ears checked Listen to your instincts. You're not going to cause irreparable harm with the sleep issues you're having right now. She'll learn eventually.
It will get better; hang in there. I did buy a copy of Ferber and while I never read it all (too long!), G loved it (pdq pic). I promise you she will sleep well one day.
Post by awkwardpenguin on Sept 23, 2015 14:49:45 GMT -5
Inconsistent baby just napped 20 minutes, woke up and drank 4.5 oz of breastmilk (a record!), and seems happier. I'm going to play with her for a while now.
Post by sparkythelawyer on Sept 23, 2015 14:54:56 GMT -5
Sparkybaby pretty much would only sleep on me for first few months. She might nap other places, but overnight sleep? Mommy only. Thank goodness for my reclining couch. It does get better though!
I might suggest that if you can get one or two good naps in her, you may be able to start resume some semblance of a routine. Does she nap ok in the car? Can you go for a real long drive? Or in the stroller for a walk?
Also, happiest baby on the block is great for this also.
Sounds like you are swaddling her quite a bit at night. My kid stopped loving the swaddle pretty early on, and by four months generally wanted to sleep stretched out with her hands up. Maybe try putting her in the crib/rnp without the swaddle?
I don't know what whitenoise you are using, but the WhiteNoise Baby App saved our butts numerous times. We just use one of our cell phones and put it on the corner of the crib at night.
I might suggest that if you can get one or two good naps in her, you may be able to start resume some semblance of a routine. Does she nap ok in the car? Can you go for a real long drive? Or in the stroller for a walk?
We joke that we should just drive to Milwaukee whenever she's having trouble sleeping, because she slept the entire 2 hour drive there when she was 8 weeks old.
She'll sleep pretty well in the stroller as long as we're moving. I just need some longer routes to take.
I might suggest that if you can get one or two good naps in her, you may be able to start resume some semblance of a routine. Does she nap ok in the car? Can you go for a real long drive? Or in the stroller for a walk?
We joke that we should just drive to Milwaukee whenever she's having trouble sleeping, because she slept the entire 2 hour drive there when she was 8 weeks old.
She'll sleep pretty well in the stroller as long as we're moving. I just need some longer routes to take.
You in the Chicago area? (Your drive time re: Milwaukee makes me think we're local).
We joke that we should just drive to Milwaukee whenever she's having trouble sleeping, because she slept the entire 2 hour drive there when she was 8 weeks old.
She'll sleep pretty well in the stroller as long as we're moving. I just need some longer routes to take.
You in the Chicago area? (Your drive time re: Milwaukee makes me think we're local).
Load her up and head to the forest preserve!
We are! I don't have the car during the day, but at least some of the forest preserves are public transit accessible. Great idea.
Post by starburst on Sept 23, 2015 15:03:40 GMT -5
My sympathies. DS is a crap napper too, and totally inconsistent and unpredictable. I'm going to order a magic sleep suit and hope that it is truly magical.
You in the Chicago area? (Your drive time re: Milwaukee makes me think we're local).
Load her up and head to the forest preserve!
We are! I don't have the car during the day, but at least some of the forest preserves are public transit accessible. Great idea.
The Facebook Mama Tribe Chicago may be able to point you in the direction of some good public-transit accessible walking paths as well. Fresh air for both of you may help both of your spirits!
Baby sleep sucks. I once drove all the way to Aurora and through downtown Aurora in the middle of the night just so that she would sleep. This was not my smartest moment in hindsight :-)
Have you felt her gums to see if it's teeth starting to come in? That's what it sounds like to me, since her eating is also getting messed up. Have you tried giving tylenol?
Gas drops are miracle workers. When we gave them to DS, he went from fussy to the world's happiest baby.
Also, he only slept while we were on the go for awhile, around your DD's age. He would take 15-minute catnaps at home or sleep for two hours while I waked the mall or sat at Panera reading a book.
I so feel your pain! LO is about 18 weeks and our sleep troubles started about 3 weeks ago and sound very similar to yours. Baby naps were getting shorter and shorter, she was tired almost immediately after waking up and we had many MOTN wake ups. It got to the point that I was physically ill from sleep deprivation. What seems to have helped was having her sleep on her tummy. I know it's not recommended but we were so desperate we were willing to do almost anything (we were also comfortable considering her neck strength and other SIDS risks were low). She had one good nights sleep and spent almost two days just eating and sleeping and we got our happy baby back. We also let her CIO a little for naps, finding that she usually put herself to sleep in less than 5 minutes. Things aren't perfect but at least we are coping.
Post by toutsuite on Sept 23, 2015 16:31:13 GMT -5
Could be reflux. If she's not fussy at all after eating then look into silent reflux. Poor sleeping and fussiness are general symptoms, though that can also describe most babies. She may not be spitty but reflux could still be bothering her. One we figured out this was the problem with ds and we got it under control with Prilosec, it was a game changer for his sleep.
Also ditto the recommendation for a magic Merlin....that thing worked wonders!