When I saw you quoted me, I thought if this post says anything other than "I stand corrected," then she's out of order. Why are you talking to me about who saw what and who copied whom? I gave you those links to help you with your clear and apparent confusion about where braids originated (I was not confused). Now that you have been provided with the information, you're talking about how no one copied and how we're all African and how there are only certain ways to style hair. I asked you none of that or anything else. I gave you information so that you wouldn't keep walking around loud and wrong talking about how cornrows originated in Rome and Greece. You're welcome .
Well I didn't ask you for your links either.
I didn't say they originated in Rome or Greece. I said they have existed in cultures since the beginning of time and that we all came from the same place so that makes sense. You're delusional if you don't think every human being has been braiding their hair in some form since the beginning of time. It's the only practical way to keep long hair out of the way without a million pins and ties. I have hair to my calves, as many women did in ancient times. Braiding it is one of the only ways to keep it out of the way without my hundred bobby pins and an updo. It's that simple now and it was that simple thousands of years ago.
You didn't have to ask. We're on a message board, which includes the exchange of (hopefully correct) information. You were wrong, so I gave you the information to help your sad cause of explaining why African people did not create braids/cornrows. I wasn't wrong about anything, so your incorrect theories were unnecessary and not helpful additions to the exchange. You pointed out that braids didn't originate in Africa. You are wrong about that. I don't know why you felt that piece of misinformation was relevant to this thread (except I could wager what I think is likely an amazing guess lol), but it was not and it was wrong. If you need more links--since it was so crucial to you to explain that braids did not originate in Africa--let me know.
I just thought it was an interesting to discuss how white people used to wear this style and why it fell out of fashion and then sort of became an exclusively Agrican style. It's interesting to me. I didn't say anything about how white people should wear them because ancient peoples did. I really don't understand why people are all upset about pointing out how braiding used to be a sort of universal style.
(girl I try to get you most of the time but not this time)...
I am white with very very very thick long hair. I liken it to the texture of a... shetland sheepdog. It's soft, straightens easily, curls easily, but when left to its own devices, it is unruly.
During the summers it is often in a braid. I associate two french braids with little girls but do still wear them around the house instead of one because if I wore one braid every day all summer I would get (have gotten) scalp folliculitis. My hair takes a LONG time to dry. I can blow dry it for an hour and my scalp will still be damp during the humid summer months. Then add any sort of getting my heart rate up and my head will sweat. The dampness under the braid down the center of my head can't evaporate because the hair is so thick and dense - so it stays damp for days. Braiding in smaller braids helps dry it out, even if only for a day and I have little girl hair.
So I can see how some corn rows can be desirable for some white women. We don't all have straight glossy hair. It's just further expanding on the multiple braids concept to let the scalp get some air when the thick hair keeps it damp.
At the same time, I wouldn't think corn rows for me would be professional. I am trying to think of professional Black women who wear corn rows at my office and cannot say that I have seen it. I have only seen service employees in corn rows at work. More and more Black women are going natural and that is completely acceptable. And then there are the majority who either flat iron, straighten or wear wigs. But I haven't seen the corn rows and it would be interesting to see whether it would be questioned or not, and how my peers would want to handle it. Note - our organization is 67% non-white and 75% female.
So now it's being inferred that I'm racist for wanting to discuss the history of cornrows across cultures in a thread titled "Does Anyone Own Cornrows?" Mmmkay. Got it. I'll just check my privilege or something like that.
I just thought it was an interesting to discuss how white people used to wear this style and why it fell out of fashion and then sort of became an exclusively Agrican style. It's interesting to me. I didn't say anything about how white people should wear them because ancient peoples did. I really don't understand why people are all upset about pointing out how braiding used to be a sort of universal style.
You're missing the point. No one here cares whether white people wear cornrows or not. You could have said, "Well, white people also used to wear braids all the time, so they should wear them, too," and I would have thought for probably the 978th time, "Bless AW's heart." Where you took this whole conversation out of order was when you felt some type of way about the idea that anyone question the ownership of cornrows, so you thought you would tell us how Africans didn't originate cornrows anyway. That's where it all went left. And then when that was challenged, suddenly, where cornrows were originated was a non-factor. Everyone invented them! You are very transparent, please stop. Too much fremdschamen.
So now it's being inferred that I'm racist for wanting to discuss the history of cornrows across cultures in a thread titled "Does Anyone Own Cornrows?" Mmmkay. Got it. I'll just check my privilege or something like that.
So now it's being inferred that I'm racist for wanting to discuss the history of cornrows across cultures in a thread titled "Does Anyone Own Cornrows?" Mmmkay. Got it. I'll just check my privilege or something like that.
They are trying to educate you about the history of braiding. You offered an interpretation that was incorrect based on facts. You were offered the correct facts.
See, in government schools, we memorize facts because historical data is (usually) unchanging.
]At the same time, I wouldn't think corn rows for me would be professional. I am trying to think of professional Black women who wear corn rows at my office and cannot say that I have seen it. I have only seen service employees in corn rows at work. More and more Black women are going natural and that is completely acceptable. And then there are the majority who either flat iron, straighten or wear wigs. But I haven't seen the corn rows and it would be interesting to see whether it would be questioned or not, and how my peers would want to handle it. Note - our organization is 67% non-white and 75% female.
But the point that you don't see them being worn outside of the "service employees" really goes to the point that NitaX made earlier in the thread. It may be worth considering not just that the look is considered unprofessional, but why? What is inherently unprofessional about neatly braided hair? Why is a bun or a ponytail acceptable but not cornrows?
Girl 3 hours in & I'm jerking out my ponytail. I could never wear a banana clip all day.
I'm sorry you've endured torture.
It was the price of cute. And I was VERY cute.
i bet you looked adorable.
i will never cease to be amazed at the patience of black women getting their hair done. any more than 61 minutes and i'm like "ZOMFG THIS IS TAKING FOREVERRRRR!"
Post by decemberwedding07 on Nov 4, 2015 16:59:15 GMT -5
I think most white people have hair that is too thin and too limp for cornrows to look good. Look at that model in the front at the top of the OP. It looks like there's practically an inch of scalp showing between rows. Basically without even taking into consideration cultural appropriation, most white people just shouldn't be trying it because it doesn't look good on them.
i will never cease to be amazed at the patience of black women getting their hair done. any more than 61 minutes and i'm like "ZOMFG THIS IS TAKING FOREVERRRRR!"
Real talk - this is why I'm natural. I got tired of it taking 3 hours for me to get my hair done. I don't wear braids because I can't sit for 9-10 hours to get that ish done.
The last time I had braids, I did cornrows because it took less time. See pic:
Going to SFY's comments above - that's exactly my point. If I came to the office with braids all the time, that might be a problem. Although I am natural, I don't wear a giant Angela Davis type fro everyday. I usually do a twist out and if it's getting MegaFro-ish, I pin it to a frohawak so that it looks more polished.
It's not to say that we aren't getting better about what's acceptable, but we're still not there yet.
So now it's being inferred that I'm racist for wanting to discuss the history of cornrows across cultures in a thread titled "Does Anyone Own Cornrows?" Mmmkay. Got it. I'll just check my privilege or something like that.
So now it's being inferred that I'm racist for wanting to discuss the history of cornrows across cultures in a thread titled "Does Anyone Own Cornrows?" Mmmkay. Got it. I'll just check my privilege or something like that.
They are trying to educate you about the history of braiding. You offered an interpretation that was incorrect based on facts. You were offered the correct facts.
See, in government schools, we memorize facts because historical data is (usually) unchanging.
Do the government schools use wiki entries and random websites as irrefutable fact/historical data, like was done in this thread? Explains a lot...
See, in homeschool, we don't accept those as convincing or scholarly sources.
They are trying to educate you about the history of braiding. You offered an interpretation that was incorrect based on facts. You were offered the correct facts.
See, in government schools, we memorize facts because historical data is (usually) unchanging.
Do the government schools use wiki entries and random websites as irrefutable fact/historical data, like was done in this thread? Explains a lot...
See, in homeschool, we don't accept those as convincing or scholarly sources.
Yeah, because if she cited a book I'm sure you'd run right out to the library to educate yourself.
Post by eponinepontmercy on Nov 4, 2015 17:44:18 GMT -5
Also, I wouldn't be quick to label ancient Greeks/ Romans/ any one who lived in the region where the bible takes place as "white," as far as the purposes of this conversation go.
It was Paul that put the new testament kibosh on braiding, wasn't it. Funsucker.
LOLOL! No one put money on me. I think my GBCN response rate record to the same poster can't be more than five or six posts and my responses always get shorter and shorter. By the end, I'm usually just like, "K." Plus, I'm still trying to figure out where is the best place to get data on the history of cornrows that would be accepted at your average homeschool. I don't even know.
i will never cease to be amazed at the patience of black women getting their hair done. any more than 61 minutes and i'm like "ZOMFG THIS IS TAKING FOREVERRRRR!"
I once spent two days getting my hair done in mirco braids. I looked fly when it was done though. FLY! And they stayed nice for two months because you'd better believe I took good care of those. I didn't waste two days for nothing!
So now it's being inferred that I'm racist for wanting to discuss the history of cornrows across cultures in a thread titled "Does Anyone Own Cornrows?" Mmmkay. Got it. I'll just check my privilege or something like that.
One, your last line is a very assey thing to say. You phrase it in a mocking way as if the black women on this thread throw that phrase around lightly or without a damn care. It matters when we say that. So your callous disregard of what checking privilege actually entails is so far missed in this thread conversation.
Please feel free to understand the colonialism behind what you're referencing in this questionable historical reference you're making about biblical ties to white women ceasing to braid their hair. White people in mainstream aka colonial based societies (Europe) have been seen as savage or ungodly. They didn't care about scripture, but what it meant not to be associated with the church. Refined white women couldn't fathom the idea of being wild or primotive like African or non Christian people. Save me the high and mighty righteousness of women of the time.
It's an "assey" thing to throw around the word racist so casually, too.
And as far as Biblical references go, there was a command in 1 Timothy not to braid the hair. The style in Rome at the time was extremely intricate braiding, often adorned with jewels. Paul was telling Christian women it was immodest to spend that much time, energy, and money on hair (hair that he obviously felt needed to be covered anyways). Are you arguing this wasn't in the Bible or didn't play a role in braiding falling out of practice in Europe? There are still Christian denominations today that forbid any braiding, even a single braid, because they take a literal interpretation.It had/has little to do with racism and more to do with religion. Why? They didn't associate braiding with Africans because it was a part of their own culture.
ETA - you may be right about colonial America, as by that time the practice was seen as African. But I think you're wrong about there not being a religious component to it as well. And it's irrelevant to the original argument about ancient cultures. Modern cultures are a different thing altogether and I already mentioned I wasn't talking about that.
Post by lurkingdobalina on Nov 4, 2015 17:58:55 GMT -5
People, AW is proud. Proud of her hair. It's her Achilles heel. It's the source of her power, like Samson.
Her logic is circular, and she feels vastly superior to you, therefore nothing you say, fact based or otherwise will change her opinion. But pride goeth before the fall and whatnot.
Also, I wouldn't be quick to label ancient Greeks/ Romans/ any one who lived in the region where the bible takes place as "white," as far as the purposes of this conversation go.
It was Paul that put the new testament kibosh on braiding, wasn't it. Funsucker.
WAIT WHAT? YOU MEAN THE WEREN'T NORDIC WHITE LOOKING PEOPLE?
One, your last line is a very assey thing to say. You phrase it in a mocking way as if the black women on this thread throw that phrase around lightly or without a damn care. It matters when we say that. So your callous disregard of what checking privilege actually entails is so far missed in this thread conversation.
Please feel free to understand the colonialism behind what you're referencing in this questionable historical reference you're making about biblical ties to white women ceasing to braid their hair. White people in mainstream aka colonial based societies (Europe) have been seen as savage or ungodly. They didn't care about scripture, but what it meant not to be associated with the church. Refined white women couldn't fathom the idea of being wild or primotive like African or non Christian people. Save me the high and mighty righteousness of women of the time.
It's an "assey" thing to throw around the word racist so casually, too.
And as far as Biblical references go, there was a command in 1 Timothy not to braid the hair. The style in Rome at the time was extremely intricate braiding, often adorned with jewels. Paul was telling Christian women it was immodest to spend that much time, energy, and money on hair (hair that he obviously felt needed to be covered anyways). Are you arguing this wasn't in the Bible or didn't play a role in braiding falling out of practice in Europe? There are still Christian denominations today that forbid any braiding, even a single braid, because they take a literal interpretation.It had/has little to do with racism and more to do with religion. Why? They didn't associate braiding with Africans because it was a part of their own culture.