Flameful Pet Question

[wawa]

zipping up the flame suit...

On a scale of 1 to Hitler - how bad of a person would I be if I sent my cats to live on my sister's horse farm? They'd be indoor/outdoor with 24/7 access to a nice warm tack room in the barn and probably regular visits to the actual house. I know, outdoor cats are generally frowned upon, but barns have cats. We've always had indoor/outdoor cats that primarily live in the barn. Something has to take out the vermin. They're both fixed, and have their claws.

I've had them for 5 years - adopted as 1ish year olds from the county shelter when I first moved here. I love them, but MH is just not a cat person and they annoy the shit out of him with the clawing of the upholstered items and the hair everywhere. And the meowing. And the tendency to hang out in the kitchen bay window when we're at work.

I'm generally a forgetful and irresponsible cat owner and do things like leave their litter box dirty until the smell travels to the living room. I also always forget to trim their claws, and they never get brushed. I occasionally go on spurts of trying to remember not to suck - but then I start to suck again. I feel guilty, but that doesn't stop me from forgetting to do anything other than give them food and water and snuggles. And now that MH is in charge of the litter box for the next 5ish months it's getting scooped even less frequently because he's a whiney baby and it's just not on his usual chore radar. Also...technically I am allergic to them. I just take a daily claritin and sneeze often. It'd be nice to stop sneezing 30 times a day, but that alone certainly wouldn't make me want to give up my cats.

So...with the caveat, that yes, we suck now and may suck more, how badly would we suck if we went ahead with project Barn Cats?

The cats are going to stay with her for a week regardless when we get the floors refinished (we're also leaving the house, but the cats are not welcome where we're staying), so they'll get a trial period there and I'd just tell MH to set a phone reminder for the litter and stop bitching about the claw picks in the couch and the cat hair on everything if they seem miserable.

[katietornado]

I would've flamed you for this a few weeks ago but I now have two indoor/outdoor (only in our fenced yard) cats. We've had them for six years and not only do I now hate them, they have serious medical and behavioral issues that lead them to both urinate prolifically in the house. One goes outside sometimes because it makes him happy and that makes him not pee in the house. The other ones outside because he will pee on anything and we can't trust him in the house anymore.

So anyway, if you keep up with their vet care, I think they could be happy as barn cats. No flaming here.

[wrathofkuus]

Can't you let someone who will keep them as indoor pets adopt them?

[karinothing]

I don't have that much of an issue with barn cats, but if your cats aren't used to being barn cats (which are usually feral according to my understanding) than I am not sure they would be very happy or comfortable living that life.

[soozy87]

It sounds like they will be fine outside.

[mominatrix]

I think if the trial period goes well, no flaming. I know this is probably unpopular to say, but I think cats do really well with outdoor access, the problem is cars and predators, and as barn cats it seems like they'd have the best of both worlds in that regard.

If the trial period doesn't go well (they're upset / cranky about it) you may have to reassess.

[wawa]

Sept 17, 2012 11:47:30 GMT -5 wrathofkuus said:

Can't you let someone who will keep them as indoor pets adopt them?

Sure, wanna find me somebody?

I'm not giving my cats away to a stranger, and I don't know anybody who wants them besides my sister. I've asked.

[pixy0stix]

You're going to cut their life expectancy to about half. Barn cats generally don't live too long, especially if they're not used to dealing with other animals, vehicles, etc.

Your care of them is average and not neglectful. Also, you can scoop the litter if you need to. Just don't nom on the poop.

[wawa]

Sept 17, 2012 11:50:48 GMT -5 karinothing said:

I don't have that much of an issue with barn cats, but if your cats aren't used to being barn cats (which are usually feral according to my understanding) than I am not sure they would be very happy or comfortable living that life.

I've never met a feral barn cat. Of course i'm used to horse barns, not like actual working farms with cows and such. Real farms may be more likely to have feral cats wandering around, I wouldn't know, but our barn cats were always friendly and had names and regular vet care and cushy beds in the tack room.

[wrathofkuus]

I find it to be weird as hell that you think throwing them in a barn is preferable to giving them to a stranger who might absolutely cherish them.

[laurenpetro]

ditto momin on this one.

FWIW, i had indoor/outdoor cats my whole life. if their lives were cut in half then we would have had some seriously old cats.

[pixy0stix]

*I* find it weird as hell that you're falling into the, "I'm pregnant must get rid of all my animals!" Wawa. I never pegged you for someone like that.

[Deleted]

Sept 17, 2012 11:56:20 GMT -5 wawa said:

Sept 17, 2012 11:50:48 GMT -5 karinothing said:

I don't have that much of an issue with barn cats, but if your cats aren't used to being barn cats (which are usually feral according to my understanding) than I am not sure they would be very happy or comfortable living that life.

I've never met a feral barn cat. Of course i'm used to horse barns, not like actual working farms with cows and such. Real farms may be more likely to have feral cats wandering around, I wouldn't know, but our barn cats were always friendly and had names and regular vet care and cushy beds in the tack room.

My parents have a working farm as does other members of my family. The cats aren't feral on our farms. There are a lot of kids in the family though so whenever there is a new litter the kids go crazy.

[robin]

Sept 17, 2012 11:57:17 GMT -5 laurenpetro said:

ditto momin on this one.

FWIW, i had indoor/outdoor cats my whole life. if their lives were cut in half then we would have had some seriously old cats.

Ditto. I have 2 now, and my last one to die was 18 when he was eventually run over by my father

[pixy0stix]

Sept 17, 2012 11:57:17 GMT -5 laurenpetro said:

ditto momin on this one.

FWIW, i had indoor/outdoor cats my whole life. if their lives were cut in half then we would have had some seriously old cats.

Statistically, outdoor cats have half the life expectancy of indoor ones due to disease, falling prey to other animals, cars, etc. But y'know, anecdotes ftw?

Barn cats lead a hard life, no matter if they have beds in the tack room. Especially if you're throwing animals that have lived indoors all their life outside.

Granted, I grew up where the barn cats tended to only stick around for 2-3 years before they ended up as coyote food, road kill, or wandered away. We gave them vet care while they were there, and food, but that was about it. I remember one kitten that the rats killed by puncturing her throat.

[wawa]

Sept 17, 2012 11:54:01 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

You're going to cut their life expectancy to about half. Barn cats generally don't live too long, especially if they're not used to dealing with other animals, vehicles, etc.

Your care of them is average and not neglectful. Also, you can scoop the litter if you need to. Just don't nom on the poop.

Yeah, that's what I thought, but my midwife was pretty adamant about MH doing all the pooperscooping. I don't know if she has a real reason, or is just overly strict on that one, but I'm disinclined to buck her instructions since she's pretty laid back about a lot of other things.

Ugh. This sucks. I've waffled back and forth on this idea ever since my sister mentioned that she needed barn cats. Which was like 6 months ago. MH is pushing hard for at least the trial period. And I go from being totally ok with it (she'll take good care of them, I'll still get to see them, she's a much more attentive pet owner than I am, etc) to bursting into tears at the thought. I'd never freakin' forgive myself if one of them got stepped on by a horse or run over by the tractor or something. Maybe I can't do this.

[laurenpetro]

Sept 17, 2012 11:56:41 GMT -5 wrathofkuus said:

I find it to be weird as hell that you think throwing them in a barn is preferable to giving them to a stranger who might absolutely cherish them.

pardon my presumption but it sounds like you've never tried to rehome multiple adult cats. it's nearly impossible.

[downtoearth]

I don't like cats or litter boxes and think barn cats would be better than indoor cats b/c I just don't really see how cats are great pets other than utilitarian vermin killers, but I also think it's funny that you want them gone b/c you're pregnant. It's pretty flameful.

That being said, instead of posting, I would have just given them to your sister and let your conscience be free of the judgements that come with people who are uber cat people on here.

[lilmgirl]

Warning: Anecdote - I live in suburbia hell and for some reason, there are a lot of indoor/outdoor cats around here. Lots of them go missing. I'm not sure what to expect on a farm, but don't surprised when they aren't found. :/

[laurenpetro]

Sept 17, 2012 12:02:14 GMT -5 wawa said:

Sept 17, 2012 11:54:01 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

You're going to cut their life expectancy to about half. Barn cats generally don't live too long, especially if they're not used to dealing with other animals, vehicles, etc.

Your care of them is average and not neglectful. Also, you can scoop the litter if you need to. Just don't nom on the poop.

Yeah, that's what I thought, but my midwife was pretty adamant about MH doing all the pooperscooping. I don't know if she has a real reason, or is just overly strict on that one, but I'm disinclined to buck her instructions since she's pretty laid back about a lot of other things.

Ugh. This sucks. I've waffled back and forth on this idea ever since my sister mentioned that she needed barn cats. Which was like 6 months ago. MH is pushing hard for at least the trial period. And I go from being totally ok with it (she'll take good care of them, I'll still get to see them, she's a much more attentive pet owner than I am, etc) to bursting into tears at the thought. I'd never freakin' forgive myself if one of them got stepped on by a horse or run over by the tractor or something. Maybe I can't do this.

if you're really worried you can just scoop with dish washing gloves on.

[pixy0stix]

Sept 17, 2012 12:02:14 GMT -5 wawa said:

Yeah, that's what I thought, but my midwife was pretty adamant about MH doing all the pooperscooping. I don't know if she has a real reason, or is just overly strict on that one, but I'm disinclined to buck her instructions since she's pretty laid back about a lot of other things.

Trust, pooperscoopering is totally fine when you're pregnant. Just wash your hands immediately afterward. You have to ingest the particles to be able to get toxoplasmosis. If your cats are indoor cats, there's a very small chance that they have it (they get it by ingesting small animals).

Frankly, if you get your food from a CSA and don't wash your veggies very well, that's more of a concern than your kitty poop. It's in the dirt.

[Deleted]

As someone who has re-homed 3 stray cats in 3 years (they just show up on our door) and already has 2 indoor-only cats, I totally get what you are trying to do, and I realize how difficult it is to find a good responsible cat owner to take them indoors. We've had strays in our garage for weeks when we couldn't leave them inside with our existing cats (trust me, we tried. It ended in bloodshed).

I grew up on a farm, and I think it really depends on the type of farm as to wether its cruel or not. I have seen outdoor/indoor situations work, and I've seen them fail miserably. It really depends on their access to warmth, shelter, food, etc and also how wild they already are.

One of my cats would do just fine going to a barn, the other wouldn't last a day. I guess you just have to know your own cats AND the situation they would be going to. I think you will have to see what happens in the trial period.

[karinothing]

I think your H is kind of being dickish. Did he marry you before or after the cats? If he married you after the cats I would tell him to suck it up and deal since they were part of the package.

[ttt]

If you have had cats for a long time in your life (not necessarily these cats), you likely already have toxoplasmosis and don't need to worry about (it's only dangerous to a fetus upon initial infection). But if your cats are indoor only cats, it's unlikely that they have it anyway. You can scoop with gloves on and wash like crazy after changing litter boxes (that's what I did).

That said, I'm not going to flame you because I know how difficult it can be to live with animals you don't really want or to live with someone who doesn't want to live with your pets. H is not crazy about our cats and given some of their issues, the thought has seriously crossed my mind to rehome them. But, I don't know anyone who would want to take them and I'm hardly going to give them to a shelter, so they're not going anywhere. I don't know enough about farm/barn life for cats to say anything more on the topic, but I'm not going to flame you.

[wawa]

Sept 17, 2012 11:58:42 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

*I* find it weird as hell that you're falling into the, "I'm pregnant must get rid of all my animals!" Wawa. I never pegged you for someone like that.

Oh jeez, NO! I get where'd you think that's what I'm saying, but this is an idea that MH has been pushing for since before I got KU'd. It's just that he's been more vocal about it now that he's actively involved in the cat's care. It has always seemed kinda unfair that he is forced to live with animals he doesn't really care for, but he's never given me any sort of ultimatum. Just always pushing the idea that the cats could happily live elsewhere.

I've always felt like a shitty cat owner and thought that they'd probably be happier somewhere else whenever I noticed the litter box was particularly bad, or that BlackCat was getting her claws stuck in the couch because they were too long and I coudln't even find the claw clippers. And then I'd wake up with her snuggled up against my ribs and change my mind again.

Or read stats about outdoor cats and then REALLY change my mind.

[wawa]

blah...Ok, so I'm still right where I was. I was kinda hoping y'all would come down firmly on one side or the other and either flame my pants off for even considering it, or tell me it'd all be ok so I could just make up my damn mind.

I guess I'll see how they do during their "escape from varnish fumes" visit and go from there.

[pixy0stix]

Indoor vs. Outdoor cat statistics:

12-15 years vs. 2-5 years: animal.discovery.com/healthy-pets/cat-health-101/how-long-do-cats-live.html

[pixy0stix]

Environmental impact of outdoor cats: www.cwf-fcf.org/en/what-we-do/habitat/gardening-for-wildlife/animals/problem-wildlife/keeping-cats-indoors-is-for.html

[wawa]

Sept 17, 2012 12:12:58 GMT -5 toledo said:

Sept 17, 2012 12:07:33 GMT -5 karinothing said:

I think your H is kind of being dickish. Did he marry you before or after the cats? If he married you after the cats I would tell him to suck it up and deal since they were part of the package.

Yup, no argument on that one. He is totally a dick about the cats at times and he knew that we were a package deal from the start. (I adopted them when I was living alone. though he did come with me to pick them out. And helped me name them.)

I'm considering it because he has asked me to over and over and over again...but he has never, and will never, demand that we get rid of them. That's a line he knows not to cross.

[pixy0stix]

LOL! Wawa, I can flame you if you want.

Really, the only creature that wins in the "have the kitties go live in the barn" scenario is your husband. The cats will suffer, and you will suffer.

Your care of your cats is not neglectful in any way, shape, or form. They're not going to get any better care anywhere else. Your H is just going to have to suck it up and be a man. It's your duty to protect those that are helpless, ie the cats. Your H can fend for himself.

I say this as someone who has battled her H over the cats over inappropriate peeing and pooping (of the cats, not my H). There were times I even wanted to give them up, but we, all of us, pushed through.