I've said that I'm still wearing a mask indoors in public because I don't want people to think I'm a anti-masker/vaxxer/Trumper. For me it's not so much because I'm worried random strangers won't like me, wildrice, as a person - more that I don't want strangers to see me coming and feel uncomfortable or avoid interacting with me because they don't know if I'm vaccinated so they don't know if I'm a risk to them or their family. Frankly, I don't like making people feel bad or uncomfortable and I don't really see that as a personality flaw on my part. If it was something that harmed me or required a great deal of effort, maybe it would be an issue for me to keep bending over backwards to make everyone comfortable. But a mask? I'm already used to wearing it so it's barely extra effort to do it.
I am drawing the line at masking outdoors, though, because it's hot and I hate being hot.
I've said that I'm still wearing a mask indoors in public because I don't want people to think I'm a anti-masker/vaxxer/Trumper. For me it's not so much because I'm worried random strangers won't like me, wildrice, as a person - more that I don't want strangers to see me coming and feel uncomfortable or avoid interacting with me because they don't know if I'm vaccinated so they don't know if I'm a risk to them or their family. Frankly, I don't like making people feel bad or uncomfortable and I don't really see that as a personality flaw on my part. If it was something that harmed me or required a great deal of effort, maybe it would be an issue for me to keep bending over backwards to make everyone comfortable. But a mask? I'm already used to wearing it so it's barely extra effort to do it.
I am drawing the line at masking outdoors, though, because it's hot and I hate being hot.
"I don't want to make others feel uncomfortable. I am a good person. I am signaling to them that I am safe." Which is virtue signaling, it's textbook.
Now I know I'm going to get a lot of ::hair flip:: but that doesn't make me a bad person! LOL! It doesn't, but it's interesting that masking has become such a strong "moral" norm. Can we just go back to people wearing crosses, BLM t-shirts, and rainbows in June? /end circle
I do worry about our immune systems. Like, if we keep wearing masks and hand sanitizing after every store/interaction with another human, then will it lower our immunity to other things? We rarely got sick pre-covid and I would never have considered us germaphobes.
I've been wondering about this too. My husband and I have both mostly ever worked in germ factories. I promise we are clean, always washed our hands, but neither of us was really ever obsessive about using Clorox wipes to wipe down surfaces when we've been sick or using hand sanitizer every time we touch something in a public place. We've done that more now, but still not really obsessive about it. I remember the studies showing that too much sanitization could backfire by creating supermutant germs or something, so I'm curious about what will happen in the future.
I've said that I'm still wearing a mask indoors in public because I don't want people to think I'm a anti-masker/vaxxer/Trumper. For me it's not so much because I'm worried random strangers won't like me, wildrice, as a person - more that I don't want strangers to see me coming and feel uncomfortable or avoid interacting with me because they don't know if I'm vaccinated so they don't know if I'm a risk to them or their family. Frankly, I don't like making people feel bad or uncomfortable and I don't really see that as a personality flaw on my part. If it was something that harmed me or required a great deal of effort, maybe it would be an issue for me to keep bending over backwards to make everyone comfortable. But a mask? I'm already used to wearing it so it's barely extra effort to do it.
I am drawing the line at masking outdoors, though, because it's hot and I hate being hot.
"I don't want to make others feel uncomfortable. I am a good person. I am signaling to them that I am safe." Which is virtue signaling, it's textbook.
Now I know I'm going to get a lot of ::hair flip:: but that doesn't make me a bad person! LOL! It doesn't, but it's interesting that masking has become such a strong "moral" norm. Can we just go back to people wearing crosses, BLM t-shirts, and rainbows in June? /end circle
I fail to see how that's a bad thing, though. Is it fun to make people uncomfortable? If someone is breathing air near me and is feeling anxious that I'm going to infect them, that doesn't make me happy. Again, it's not because I'm particularly worried about how they feel ABOUT me, but how they feel about being in a space that they have to share with others. If that's virtue signaling, so be it. I think it's just being a person who cares about others' feelings. I have anxiety, it sucks. If I can lessen anxiety for others, it's not a hardship to do so.
ETA: I don't want that to read like I think people who don't wear masks like I do don't care about others. I am sure many of them do, as I am sure you all do too. I am just saying for myself, it's worth the extra step. If it's not worth it to you, that's totally your prerogative.
I do worry about our immune systems. Like, if we keep wearing masks and hand sanitizing after every store/interaction with another human, then will it lower our immunity to other things? We rarely got sick pre-covid and I would never have considered us germaphobes.
I've been wondering about this too. My husband and I have both mostly ever worked in germ factories. I promise we are clean, always washed our hands, but neither of us was really ever obsessive about using Clorox wipes to wipe down surfaces when we've been sick or using hand sanitizer every time we touch something in a public place. We've done that more now, but still not really obsessive about it. I remember the studies showing that too much sanitization could backfire by creating supermutant germs or something, so I'm curious about what will happen in the future.
The over-sanitation/mutant germs applied to antibacterial products. Sanitizer with alcohol was considered ok. That being said, I don't know what most people have been using.
I've been wondering about this too. My husband and I have both mostly ever worked in germ factories. I promise we are clean, always washed our hands, but neither of us was really ever obsessive about using Clorox wipes to wipe down surfaces when we've been sick or using hand sanitizer every time we touch something in a public place. We've done that more now, but still not really obsessive about it. I remember the studies showing that too much sanitization could backfire by creating supermutant germs or something, so I'm curious about what will happen in the future.
The over-sanitation/mutant germs applied to antibacterial products. Sanitizer with alcohol was considered ok. That being said, I don't know what most people have been using.
"I don't want to make others feel uncomfortable. I am a good person. I am signaling to them that I am safe." Which is virtue signaling, it's textbook.
Now I know I'm going to get a lot of ::hair flip:: but that doesn't make me a bad person! LOL! It doesn't, but it's interesting that masking has become such a strong "moral" norm. Can we just go back to people wearing crosses, BLM t-shirts, and rainbows in June? /end circle
I fail to see how that's a bad thing, though. Is it fun to make people uncomfortable? If someone is breathing air near me and is feeling anxious that I'm going to infect them, that doesn't make me happy. Again, it's not because I'm particularly worried about how they feel ABOUT me, but how they feel about being in a space that they have to share with others. If that's virtue signaling, so be it. I think it's just being a person who cares about others' feelings. I have anxiety, it sucks. If I can lessen anxiety for others, it's not a hardship to do so.
ETA: I don't want that to read like I think people who don't wear masks like I do don't care about others. I am sure many of them do, as I am sure you all do too. I am just saying for myself, it's worth the extra step. If it's not worth it to you, that's totally your prerogative.
It'll be interesting when mask perception flips back to if you see someone wearing a mask, you assume that they're sick and/or unvaccinated.
Post by chilerellanos on May 25, 2021 8:51:39 GMT -5
I’m pretty sure I’ve seen some studies saying even alcohol based products are contributing. I don’t have time to search right now. But I do think that’s a concern, as well.
Post by fortnightlily on May 25, 2021 8:57:02 GMT -5
Just found out that the many of us who got vaccinated at a FEMA-run site in Maryland aren't eligible for the vaccine lottery, which is some kind of horses**t considering we booked our appointments through the same state-run system as everyone else.
It’s funny that you keep talking about ‘white women’
White women are exactly the people most likely to be taking their masks off around here and going on and on about how now we are all safe (ignoring the fact that they don’t actually know the vaccination status or health situation of the people around them - but hey if you are wealthy, white and one of their friends then you can’t be someone who is sick or at risk. Health complications are for other people).
It’s BIPoC who are consistently keeping on keeping on, wearing masks, and horror of horrors - using them to signal that they are doing the right thing, keeping themselves and others safe.
But sure, keep ignoring them and making this about race.
It’s funny that you keep talking about ‘white women’
White women are exactly the people most likely to be taking their masks off around here and going on and on about how now we are all safe (ignoring the fact that they don’t actually know the vaccination status or health situation of the people around them - but hey if you are wealthy, white and one of their friends then you can’t be someone who is sick or at risk. Health complications are for other people).
It’s the BIPoC who are keeping on, wearing masks, and horror of horrors - using them to signal that they are doing the right thing, keeping themselves and others safe. But sure, keep insulting them and dismissing them and making this about race.
LOL! Which is why I keep saying white women. I completely understand where the BIPOC community is coming from in all this. That being said, I watched an interesting takedown on FB from a friend who reposted a white woman who, very seriously, said to keep masking within a BIPOC community in her town. Members of said community started posting on the post and said to not speak for them. So... ::shrug::
ETA: As for your other comment, everyone has been abundantly clear in that if you have a reason to mask, keep masking. Assigning morality to it, however, is shitty, especially since we've done our part. Most of this conversation is to get people to really look at the reasons why they continue to mask. If it's to make yourself look like a nice, approachable, moral person, then I suggest really examining your motives.
It’s funny that you keep talking about ‘white women’
White women are exactly the people most likely to be taking their masks off around here and going on and on about how now we are all safe (ignoring the fact that they don’t actually know the vaccination status or health situation of the people around them - but hey if you are wealthy, white and one of their friends then you can’t be someone who is sick or at risk. Health complications are for other people).
It’s the BIPoC who are keeping on, wearing masks, and horror of horrors - using them to signal that they are doing the right thing, keeping themselves and others safe. But sure, keep insulting them and dismissing them and making this about race.
LOL! Which is why I keep saying white women. I completely understand where the BIPOC community is coming from in all this. That being said, I watched an interesting takedown on FB from a friend who reposted a white woman who, very seriously, said to keep masking within a BIPOC community in her town. Members of said community started posting on the post and said to not speak for them. So... ::shrug::
so she’s an asshole. And in the same ‘this is something that happens to other people’ vein.
LOL! Which is why I keep saying white women. I completely understand where the BIPOC community is coming from in all this. That being said, I watched an interesting takedown on FB from a friend who reposted a white woman who, very seriously, said to keep masking within a BIPOC community in her town. Members of said community started posting on the post and said to not speak for them. So... ::shrug::
so she’s an asshole
No, I think she came from a good place, she overstepped. It's another facet to this entire conversation that we've been having the last two days. We (general) want so very hard to do the right thing, and now that it's not so cut and dry we're (white women) floundering. Which is why I wanted to have this conversation on a board of general do-gooders.
Post by goldengirlz on May 25, 2021 9:29:45 GMT -5
The way I see it, masks have become political and the blame rests squarely on the former asshole-in-chief (had his cronies) who politicized then.
I’ve said this before but given a choice between living in a place where people are virtue signaling by continuing to wear masks vs. spending the past 14 months living in a place surrounded by people calling masks “face diapers” — I’d choose the former all day, everyday. Perhaps there are areas of this country where most people are rational and science-guided and whatnot, but if I had to choose between the extremes, the choice would be easy.
Like, yeah, I totally agree it sucks to be on the receiving end of judgment for not wearing a mask outdoors (and I totally have been!!) but I’m also not losing sleep over it. Instead I’m just relieved that vaccination rates are among the highest in the country here, case counts among the lowest and my family made it through without getting sick. (Not to mention that I never have to worry about taking my unvaccinated family members to indoor public places.)
Velar Fricative, penguingrrl, I don't believe the CNN article teased out what age ranges it is talking about, but yes I assume its 18+ since the other demographics are too soon to be fully vaxxed. I agree though that I wished there was a little more time to get more of the people eligible vaxxed, but I have to say that I am impressed overall with NJ.
The way I see it, masks have become political andthe blame rests squarely on the former asshole-in-chief (had his cronies) who politicized then.
I’ve said this before but given a choice between living in a place where people are virtue signaling by continuing to wear masks vs. spending the past 14 months living in a place surrounded by people calling masks “face diapers” — I’d choose the former all day, everyday. Perhaps there are areas of this country where most people are rational and science-guided and whatnot, but if I had to choose between the extremes, the choice would be easy.
Like, yeah, I totally agree it sucks to be on the receiving end of judgment for not wearing a mask outdoors (and I totally have been!!) but I’m also not losing sleep over it. Instead I’m just relieved that vaccination rates are among the highest in the country here, case counts among the lowest and my family made it through without getting sick.
I don't agree with this anymore, honestly, even if I would have a year ago.
Yes, "Trump started it." Yes, he put the entire fucking shitshow in motion. Doesn't mean the rest of us have to continue to politicize something that shouldn't have been politicized in the first place. Trump's been out of office for over 4 months now and we can't blame everything on him forever.
Wait, I will continue to blame Trump forever. Just like I have feelings about Dubya Bush. LOL!
That being said, I do think we're going to have to let go of the feelings around masks. I want them to become medical tools to use when necessary, not assigned to a political party.
Velar Fricative , penguingrrl , I don't believe the CNN article teased out what age ranges it is talking about, but yes I assume its 18+ since the other demographics are too soon to be fully vaxxed. I agree though that I wished there was a little more time to get more of the people eligible vaxxed, but I have to say that I am impressed overall with NJ.
Yes, it kind of has to be 18+. I have been very happy with Murphy’s handling of the entire pandemic until yesterday. The abrupt nature of removing basically all restrictions with few exceptions is the first time I felt like he was running for reelection instead of following the science.
I have yet to encounter a location where I could go maskless inside so I'm just here observing.
I am visiting another state this weekend where I believe it is allowed. I will be with elderly (vaccinated) family members though so I am not sure how things will go. I will likely follow their lead.
My area had high mask compliance (that I could tell in my limited going out and shopping experience). Since the state mask mandate went away and it's up to individual businesses, I'm having a hard time figuring out where I need to wear a mask or not. So I usually mask up when I go inside. In general I think most businesses still have a mask requirement, but again I don't know if it's just residual signage hanging out on doors since it's all now defunct government mask signage.
The way I see it, masks have become political andthe blame rests squarely on the former asshole-in-chief (had his cronies) who politicized then.
I’ve said this before but given a choice between living in a place where people are virtue signaling by continuing to wear masks vs. spending the past 14 months living in a place surrounded by people calling masks “face diapers” — I’d choose the former all day, everyday. Perhaps there are areas of this country where most people are rational and science-guided and whatnot, but if I had to choose between the extremes, the choice would be easy.
Like, yeah, I totally agree it sucks to be on the receiving end of judgment for not wearing a mask outdoors (and I totally have been!!) but I’m also not losing sleep over it. Instead I’m just relieved that vaccination rates are among the highest in the country here, case counts among the lowest and my family made it through without getting sick.
I don't agree with this anymore, honestly, even if I would have a year ago.
Yes, "Trump started it." Yes, he put the entire fucking shitshow in motion. Doesn't mean the rest of us have to continue to politicize something that shouldn't have been politicized in the first place. Trump's been out of office for over 4 months now and we can't blame everything on him forever.
I absolutely will blame him forever. This is similar to how you only have one chance at a first impression - we had one chance to get this right in the beginning when introducing something that for the most part was completely foreign to the US (mask-wearing as a norm) and he fucked up, unsurprisingly. Yes, the rest of us can stop politicizing it, I agree with that. But it's really difficult, if not impossible, to overcome the initial politicization of masks. We don't reflect the rest of America.
I think the majority of people are just burned out from decision making and are mentally exhausted. There has also been so much change and uncertainty and no one really knows what/who to trust. It’s funny. Our state hasn’t had a mask mandate in months and with the latest CDC guidance I thought I would see less masks but I don’t. Except at restaurants. It’s 2019 there. Otherwise everyone is still wearing one and businesses aren’t in a hurry to drop the requirements. It’s like no one wants to be the first and then find out it was a mistake. I’m looking forward to getting back to normal but it’s going to take time.
I've said that I'm still wearing a mask indoors in public because I don't want people to think I'm a anti-masker/vaxxer/Trumper. For me it's not so much because I'm worried random strangers won't like me, wildrice, as a person - more that I don't want strangers to see me coming and feel uncomfortable or avoid interacting with me because they don't know if I'm vaccinated so they don't know if I'm a risk to them or their family. Frankly, I don't like making people feel bad or uncomfortable and I don't really see that as a personality flaw on my part. If it was something that harmed me or required a great deal of effort, maybe it would be an issue for me to keep bending over backwards to make everyone comfortable. But a mask? I'm already used to wearing it so it's barely extra effort to do it.
I am drawing the line at masking outdoors, though, because it's hot and I hate being hot.
This is where I end up too. If at the end of the day I'm judged for virtue signaling, but I've also managed to make someone with anxiety like me more comfortable I'm ok with that trade-off, and others can judge away. What someone in the store thinks about me is largely irrelevant, but if I have a chance to make someone feel a little less anxious and it costs me so very little, I'm gonna do my best to do that.
I find there's also a bit of humor in the shirts/pins that tell people you're vaccinated, and it helps remind me to let go of some of that anxiety. Laughter is a big coping mechanism for me. I dislike the "vaccinated, not a republican" "not an anti-vaxxer" slogans on items though. those feel polarizing and unhelpful. But things like "Got my Fauci Ouchie" or "Vaccinated. Thanks science!", don't bother me at all, and even make me smile when I see them. I also see them as celebrating such an awesome achievement. It's AMAZING to me that we've managed to get a vaccine and get it into so many arms. I'm not running out to buy them, but if you wanna celebrate and buy a pin/shirt/hat to commemorate this time, that's fine by me.
I haven't read the report, but I thought it was interesting that the FDA has reviewed how South Korea handled their covid response for lessons learned:
The FDA recognizes different approaches may work for different countries, and this report does not make recommendations for what approaches could or should be adopted in the United States for emerging infectious diseases.
Topics covered in the report include:
South Korea's Lessons Learned from Prior Public Health Emergencies South Korea's Development of Tests for COVID-19 South Korea's National Strategy
I fail to see how that's a bad thing, though. Is it fun to make people uncomfortable? If someone is breathing air near me and is feeling anxious that I'm going to infect them, that doesn't make me happy. Again, it's not because I'm particularly worried about how they feel ABOUT me, but how they feel about being in a space that they have to share with others. If that's virtue signaling, so be it. I think it's just being a person who cares about others' feelings. I have anxiety, it sucks. If I can lessen anxiety for others, it's not a hardship to do so.
ETA: I don't want that to read like I think people who don't wear masks like I do don't care about others. I am sure many of them do, as I am sure you all do too. I am just saying for myself, it's worth the extra step. If it's not worth it to you, that's totally your prerogative.
It'll be interesting when mask perception flips back to if you see someone wearing a mask, you assume that they're sick and/or unvaccinated.
This is already happening around me. Our friends walked into an indoor event masked and everyone kind of stepped away from them!
Our county (of 295K people) had zero reported cases of COVID today for the first time since October! I’m still a little worried about all the tourists coming in, but last year our cases rate was super low even with packed, maskless beaches.
I can’t decide whether to have our annual 4th of July barbecue or not. Obviously we skipped it last year. I’ve asked a few close friends if they’d be into it, and they’ve said they’d come, but I’d like to have a bigger party (all outdoors). I just don’t want to freak anyone out if there ends up being a lot of people. We are all vaccinated but some of my friends are super cautious, and still wearing masks even outdoors, and would probably leave if we couldn’t distance. I don’t want to just not invite them, though, so I don’t know. Maybe we’ll wait another year.
I'm only up to this point in the thread, so apologies if this has been hashed out already -
My birthday was this past Thursday and I invited about 20 people to come over. I knew that all of the adults in the group have been fully vaccinated. The plan was to be outside, but unfortunately it was raining all day and so I was getting a little worried about needing to move the party indoors, and how people would feel about that. In the end, I sent a text that said something like "We will be following CDC guidelines that since multiple households are gathering together, anyone who is fully vaccinated is welcomed to be mask-free but others will need to wear masks when not eating/drinking." I figured communicating that up front was the best I could do, and then people could decide for themselves if this was acceptable to them or not.
My area had high mask compliance (that I could tell in my limited going out and shopping experience). Since the state mask mandate went away and it's up to individual businesses, I'm having a hard time figuring out where I need to wear a mask or not. So I usually mask up when I go inside. In general I think most businesses still have a mask requirement, but again I don't know if it's just residual signage hanging out on doors since it's all now defunct government mask signage.
This is we’re I’m at now too. I was prepared to run into a couple stores last weekend massless but then I got to the door and they had a sign that it’s required. I don’t know if they just haven’t taken the old sign down or if they still have a policy in place requiring it, so I ended up putting it on.
The whole "white women" thing is confusing me or maybe I'm just being obtuse. When I walk around our small city it's overwhelmingly the white people who aren't wearing masks, everyone else, inside and out is still wearing them despite the state saying you don't have to if you are vaccinated.
I hope that when people are sick they'll mask up in the future, but I am not looking forward to only sick people wearing masks. If someone asks me why I'm wearing a mask and I have to tell them I have fucking cancer, I'm not sure I'll be able to keep it together.