Boss's boss basically told you they don't value you and that you should quit. Even if they didn't realize that's what they said.
Even at my toxic prior company, when my boss resigned, the very next day I had a retention bonus in writing to keep me there for the next six months. They may have been a shitty place to work, but they knew how to ensure that they I was willing to stick around and run my team while they figured out what their next steps were.
Post by tarzanswife on Aug 23, 2023 16:34:54 GMT -5
TAKE THE NEW JOB! Commute for a bit to make sure it is a fit and if it works, then move. I went from a 3 mile / 10 minute commute to a 18 mile / 45 minute commute and I have zero regrets. My job is soo much better, even with the additional commute. DO IT!
Post by RoxMonster on Aug 23, 2023 16:56:54 GMT -5
I would take the new job and commute for a bit. I commuted 50 minutes one-way for 14 years. It did get old, but you wouldn't have to do it forever (if job works out, you could move) and I also had to go in five days a week. If you could do hybrid and even stay home a couple days a week, I think that would really help.
Also what kind of commute is it? I commute 30 minutes to a rural community, and it’s an easy drive. I wouldn’t ever move to it. So I say try the job out before deciding to move.
Post by 1confused1 on Aug 23, 2023 17:00:10 GMT -5
The fact that boss’ boss asked you to do exactly what you hated about your boss (work late and not be paid for it) is enough to tell me they don’t value you or your time. Also, don’t work for free (ie late at home, after your work day) for them because of their failure to manage their employees.
Post by litskispeciality on Aug 23, 2023 17:01:45 GMT -5
The way this post was written I thought OP was in Higher Ed, trying to leave. With that being said OP please try not to go in to HE, for a big pay cut, as you'll most likely have a similar situation, and most likely no chance of WFH.
I vote take the new job, but don't move. Do you physically have to live so close to the job to take it? If not a 45 min commute each way really sucks, but don't move until you know you really like this job, new town and so on.
You owe NOTHING, let me repeat NOTHING more than 2 weeks notice to your current job. The way they're screwing you around saying you have to work late, you have to do more work for no extra pay, and no opportunity to even apply for said job is straight up disrespect. A man would get paid for the extra work, and still leave on time.
I also think the old boss was horrible, but I'm starting to think current employer is toxic and disfunctional, not just the manager. Run as fast as you can OP
Post by litskispeciality on Aug 23, 2023 17:11:03 GMT -5
Also if the new job claims to be so flexible I think it's worth OP asking about WFH even one day a week. If they haven't taken the offer yet it could be a good bargaining point, "Im really tempted to take your offer, but am looking for a job that allows X amount of WFH" or something maybe better worded so they don't rescind the offer. My friend just got half WFH days at my old employer when literally none of us could, so it's worth an ask
OMG I don't know how you managed to not straight-up laugh in your boss's face. After begging you not to leave, saying "Please wait til Tuesday," and THIS is what he gives you? That's some nerve. Take the new job, DO NOT FEEL GUILTY. When he asks why you're leaving, I'd be upfront - "You knew I was looking around, and I got an offer I can't refuse." Don't move quite yet, see how the commute is.
This! I had high hopes when they did actually fire your boss but this seems like a terrible deal. Unless you really don’t want to move, I’d take the new job. And don’t feel guilty! You tried to quit twice, it is pretty obvious you were looking. It’s really dumb of them that the best they could offer to keep you is more work and longer hours for the same salary.
As countless others have said run away from this toxic situation.
If you think the HE offer might come fast enough to consider both, I would consider it too. Not all HE jobs are terrible, some even offer hybrid schedules.
Take the new job and commute. Don’t make any big decisions about moving until you know you want to stay there long term.
Zero loyalty to your current job. They have been awful to you in big and little ways. Asking you to do the work of a manger without the pay - absolutely not. You deserve better!
I will be the lone dissenter here. It sounds like your boss’s boss did take action based on your concerns, and I think it’s fairly normal to take on extra responsibilities while the company looks for a replacement. Did you tell him you’re interested in taking on the old boss’s role? Since you’re still pretty new he might not realize you want to advance already (though he should have at least asked!) Also moving is a huge expensive pain so if you aren’t wanting to do that I would lean towards seeing how things play out at your current employer.
I will be the lone dissenter here. It sounds like your boss’s boss did take action based on your concerns, and I think it’s fairly normal to take on extra responsibilities while the company looks for a replacement. Did you tell him you’re interested in taking on the old boss’s role? Since you’re still pretty new he might not realize you want to advance already (though he should have at least asked!) Also moving is a huge expensive pain so if you aren’t wanting to do that I would lean towards seeing how things play out at your current employer.
Yes it might be normal to help out when roles change but do you really just put someone in a higher position, tell them they have to work late till replacement comes and leave it at that.
We had an operations manager leave and a coordinator did take over some of her responsibilities. But that coordinator did then receive a raise and higher title based on the new responsibilities she took on. That is how it should be done.
I will be the lone dissenter here. It sounds like your boss’s boss did take action based on your concerns, and I think it’s fairly normal to take on extra responsibilities while the company looks for a replacement. Did you tell him you’re interested in taking on the old boss’s role? Since you’re still pretty new he might not realize you want to advance already (though he should have at least asked!) Also moving is a huge expensive pain so if you aren’t wanting to do that I would lean towards seeing how things play out at your current employer.
Yes it might be normal to help out when roles change but do you really just put someone in a higher position, tell them they have to work late till replacement comes and leave it at that.
We had an operations manager leave and a coordinator did take over some of her responsibilities. But that coordinator did then receive a raise and higher title based on the new responsibilities she took on. That is how it should be done.
OP congrats on the new job!
The whole "work late" thing is just incredibly bizarre. I agree it's normal to sit down with the grandboss and discuss temporarily taking on some tasks (and what won't get done if you take them on), and that's a great time to say you want to apply. But just "stay late and do her work"..... No. Grandboss is part of the problem.
Yes it might be normal to help out when roles change but do you really just put someone in a higher position, tell them they have to work late till replacement comes and leave it at that.
We had an operations manager leave and a coordinator did take over some of her responsibilities. But that coordinator did then receive a raise and higher title based on the new responsibilities she took on. That is how it should be done.
OP congrats on the new job!
The whole "work late" thing is just incredibly bizarre. I agree it's normal to sit down with the grandboss and discuss temporarily taking on some tasks (and what won't get done if you take them on), and that's a great time to say you want to apply. But just "stay late and do her work"..... No. Grandboss is part of the problem.
Yes I find the working late weird too. Sounds like OP is in finance and I wonder if it’s a carryover from the big 4 “butt in chair” shit where everyone is a martyr and works till 7 even though they show up at like 10. Fuck that. I actively encourage my staff to be heading for the elevator by 5:00. Work balance is important not butt in chair for X time.
Post by starburst604 on Aug 23, 2023 21:25:51 GMT -5
The work late thing seems to be part of the culture at OP’s job. A completely archaic way to attract and keep talent, in any field. Getting rid of the boss who always wanted her to work late and through lunch and then asking her to work late is not solving the problem. I don’t allow our staff to work through lunch unless cleared by me for a particular reason, and unless it’s a crisis we are all out the door at 5. People have lives.
The whole "work late" thing is just incredibly bizarre. I agree it's normal to sit down with the grandboss and discuss temporarily taking on some tasks (and what won't get done if you take them on), and that's a great time to say you want to apply. But just "stay late and do her work"..... No. Grandboss is part of the problem.
Yes I find the working late weird too. Sounds like OP is in finance and I wonder if it’s a carryover from the big 4 “butt in chair” shit where everyone is a martyr and works till 7 even though they show up at like 10. Fuck that. I actively encourage my staff to be heading for the elevator by 5:00. Work balance is important not butt in chair for X time.
I actually work in Big 4 (non client facing) which might be influencing my thoughts here, lol. I am normally totally with you on the work life balance stuff, and was ready to find a new job last year myself if my hours and stress didn’t decrease, but this sounds like a temporary situation and like grand boss didn’t push back on OP’s (very reasonable!) response that she would be leaving at 5pm. If I’m remembering correctly, OP has had a series of short stays at jobs recently, which also makes me nervous about telling her to take another new job.
Oh my goodness, why would you feel guilty? This job has not been good enough to you to make you feel guilty. Do what is right for you and your family! Congratulations on the job offer!
Post by litskispeciality on Aug 24, 2023 8:55:20 GMT -5
While I agree OP would benefit from staying at one job for a while for benefits, PTO, just general consistency, this place is toxic. This would be a great use of a good union that actually supports their members. The union would say "sorry big boss, employee's contract says they work until 5 PM, and their contract doesn't include X (whatever responsibilities they'd cover in lieu of new boss), pay employee more for the time they work longer hours and take on more work, or find someone else to do it. Xoxo", but alas, I don't think OP has this option. This also sets a really bad tone for OP to agree to working late more than one offs with advanced, agreed upon notice, and taking on more work for no bonus, as the employer will continue that if and when a replacement is hired. Without going in to OP's business, I believe there were potential ADA violations with breaks at this job too, so again too many negatives to ride it out.
Also, a lot of companies have rules of when you can apply for a promotion. I believe OP hasn't been at this job all that long, so they might not be eligible to apply for the supervisor position if and when that's posted. The big boss appears to also have decided OP isn't eligible based on the thread.
OP, thinking about it further, ask the job where you have an offer about WFH possibilities, and/or hours that work better for the commute if that's possible. Could you even get 4 10 hr days etc? Something to cut down on the drive time? Find out when you have to give them a final decision, to see if that gives you time to hear back from the HE interview. Probably good to check with in the HE job if you haven't as well. A lot of schools take forever to hire, especially in Aug when it's super busy.
Make a pros and cons list for both of them. Is there anything you like at your current job? With the new job offer, you can negotiate. You say flexible schedule, but what does that mean? A 45 minute commute 2-3 days a week isn't much. Ha when I go into the office I have to commute 1+ hours each way.
How big is this new company? If it's a smaller company you are more likely to have the same issues you are having now. Typically bigger, or more established companies, have policies and such in place that would have benefitted you with your current role. Who have you spoken to at the new company? If it's not a mix of people, ask to speak to someone else on the team for an informal chat. This way you can ask questions about the team and get a better feeling.
Post by sofamonkey on Aug 24, 2023 16:34:20 GMT -5
I’d reach out to the higher Ed job and see if they have an estimate on deciding about that job.
I also have the feeling your old boss mismanaged her time by a lot. I wouldn’t stay where you are by any means. However, I’m not sure which direction I’d move. I would not immediately actually move though. That’s a gigantic pain in the ass. Wait to see how things are.