DH and I just talked about this last night. I asked him "did you believe in Santa when you were little?" and he said "no, not really." Since I didn't either, he asked if we could skip telling our kids about Santa.
I think we will still do some of the fun things- filling stockings over night, leaving out cookies/milk, maybe writing letters to Santa- but not directly tell our kids or continue to assert that he is a real man that flies and all that jazz. I just don't like the idea of kids figuring it out, asking us, and continuing to lie to them directly. We will play along until it doesn't make sense anymore. None of this has to do with religion for us.
DH and I just talked about this last night. I asked him "did you believe in Santa when you were little?" and he said "no, not really." Since I didn't either, he asked if we could skip telling our kids about Santa.
I think we will still do some of the fun things- filling stockings over night, leaving out cookies/milk, maybe writing letters to Santa- but not directly tell our kids or continue to assert that he is a real man that flies and all that jazz. I just don't like the idea of kids figuring it out, asking us, and continuing to lie to them directly. We will play along until it doesn't make sense anymore. None of this has to do with religion for us.
Christmas will still be magical!
This is basically what we did. We still did all the Santa stuff, just always knew it wasn't real. It was still fun and magical.
I really hate when people say "well make sure your kids don't ruin it for others" so all parents of people who don't celebrate Christmas have to caution their kids not to upset the Christian kids?
Team MrsMayhem--we don't do Santa. I guess people think I am a grinch. I don't believe in lying to my kid (especially not when I am also trying to teach her that lying is wrong), so I will accept the grinch label if people want to slap it on me. It doesn't bother me. Christmas is a magical time with or without Santa, and as far as I know my kid and the kids of my friends who don't do Santa are no less happy on Christmas morning when they receive gifts from Mom and Dad instead of a fictional character.
I will explain to my DD that some kids do believe Santa is real and it's not nice to spoil their game, but when you are making a choice to tell a lie to your child, you are taking the risk that they will figure out the truth from someone, somewhere, and potentially in an upsetting way. That is not my problem, nor is it my kid's. I found out the truth about Santa from Judy Blume in the book Superfudge. Should my parents have called her with angry threats about how she ruined my Christmas? Come on.
"Hey you lost a tooth! Now throw it in the trash." "I bought all these presents at Walmart with my hard earned money." "I don't know why the neighborhood kids have eggs all over their yard that are filled with candy. Get away from the window."
Post by vanillacourage on Dec 3, 2012 11:43:53 GMT -5
If you are having conversations and throwing in things like "good for you - well, we made a different choice" or "we're choosing to celebrate the REAL reason for Christmas" - then yeah, the conversation's not going to go well.
Hey, it's your choice. But whatever you do, please make sure that your kids don't ruin it for other kids. Because that would suck.
Thank you, this 1000%.
Also, is this a new phenomenon, the whole anti-Santa thing? Because I feel like it is trendy to not 'do' Santa. Santa is fun. I don't care if my kids know who paid for the presents.
Do you really think this is the reason people don't do Santa? To claim credit for paying for the presents?
Also, is this a new phenomenon, the whole anti-Santa thing? Because I feel like it is trendy to not 'do' Santa. Santa is fun. I don't care if my kids know who paid for the presents.
Do you really think this is the reason people don't do Santa? To claim credit for paying for the presents?
I have seen this multiple times, in multiples posts, on different sites, where people say they want their kids to know that their hard earned money paid for the gifts, so yes, I do believe some people feel this way. I know some people, like previous posters, don't want to lie to their kids, which is fine if that is how they feel but I hope they never ever lie to their kids about anything ever, or that reason is hypocritical.
Some of you seriously don't lie to your kids? What? LOL.
I lie to Lucy all the time. "We can't go to the zoo right now. All the animals are sleeping." Etc. Makes life considerably easier.
I'll answer your question more seriously than it was probably meant. No, I try really, really hard not to lie to my son.
Early on in childhood I realized that I couldn't trust my mom. Not to tell me the truth, not to keep a secret, nothing. Even when I already knew something (e.g., that our dog had died) she would lie about it. Maybe she thought she was protecting my feelings, but she really wasn't. I would rather know that my dog was dead than that I can't trust what my mom says.
And so, I'm not making any elaborate attempts to "fool" DH on any topic. Our dog died, and when he asks where she is and if she's coming back I tell him honestly that she died and is not coming back, and although we miss her, but we think of all the good times we had with her and how much we love her and it makes us happy. I don't tell him she's on a farm somewhere, I don't tell him she's in doggie heaven, even if that would be easier for me. He doesn't really fully understand yet, but when he does it won't be a shock, it'll be along the lines of something he knew all along.
And if we couldn't go to the zoo, I would say, "Sorry, we can't go to the zoo today because we have plans to do y and z, but maybe we can go on x date."
I know some people, like previous posters, don't want to lie to their kids, which is fine if that is how they feel but I hope they never ever lie to their kids about anything ever, or that reason is hypocritical.
And another
Yes, I try not to lie to my son about big important things, or pull elaborate hoaxes on him. It doesn't mean I don't tell him his scribbled drawing is beautiful, etc. The, "Well, if you're not going to lie about Santa don't ever lie about anything" is just stupid.
I'm totally with you and I'm trying to bring DH around to this line of thinking. If anything, I'm not going to be a big Santa pusher.
I would just not to bring it up. If someone brings up Santa, then just smile, nod and change the subject. If someone specifically asks you "What are you doing to make your kids believe in Santa?", then just kindly explain that Santa doesn't make a stop at your house.
Avoid, avoid, avoid. I think that is your best strategy otherwise you will get lots of people saying you are a grinch like in this thread.
I really don't understand why this always turns into a heated discussion. Some people do Santa, some don't. I'm a pentecostal Christian that didn't grow up doing santa. Not because we're Christians, but in my country, people just don't do santa the way it is done here. We do have santa and visit him at the mall/parks/etc and take pictures with him, but he was always seen as a fictional character, not someone real. It wasn't mentioned to us or anything, It just was. That's the background my family and friends who have since immigrated to the US have and I really don't know anyone of us that does santa, just because we didn't grow up with it. I think it is fun and all. I just don't see it as such a big deal.
Do you really think this is the reason people don't do Santa? To claim credit for paying for the presents?
I have seen this multiple times, in multiples posts, on different sites, where people say they want their kids to know that their hard earned money paid for the gifts, so yes, I do believe some people feel this way. I know some people, like previous posters, don't want to lie to their kids, which is fine if that is how they feel but I hope they never ever lie to their kids about anything ever, or that reason is hypocritical.
I hope you know that when I say my mom wanted all the credit for presents I am saying it TIC.
I have seen this multiple times, in multiples posts, on different sites, where people say they want their kids to know that their hard earned money paid for the gifts, so yes, I do believe some people feel this way. I know some people, like previous posters, don't want to lie to their kids, which is fine if that is how they feel but I hope they never ever lie to their kids about anything ever, or that reason is hypocritical.
I hope you know that when I say my mom wanted all the credit for presents I am saying it TIC.
I didn't even see you say that, so it wasn't aimed at you. I have seen this posted, genuinely, by women on other boards and in blogs.
Serious question, since they're all getting lumped together right now. What is so freaking exciting about the Easter Bunny and does it make me a fun sucker to not "do" the Easter Bunny?
It honestly never occurred to me. We didn't "do" the Easter Bunny growing up. We had easter egg hunts and dyed eggs and had baskets of candy, but there was no anthropomorphic bunny. I don't think DD even knows who he is, despite being well aware of Santa, the Tooth Fairy/Tooth Mouse (depending on what country you are in) and the Three Kings.
I don't think I ever realized that this was such a big "mommy wars" issue until this year. People celebrate different traditions due to their religion, upbringing, culture, and personal beliefs. One would be flamed to high heaven if they criticized someone for not doing santa because they are Jewish, Muslim, or Hindu, yet when someone chooses not to do santa for other reasons they are suddenly a "fun sucking parent". Be tolerant and teach your kids tolerance, that means in large part not judging people that are different than you.
I know some people, like previous posters, don't want to lie to their kids, which is fine if that is how they feel but I hope they never ever lie to their kids about anything ever, or that reason is hypocritical.
And another
Yes, I try not to lie to my son about big important things, or pull elaborate hoaxes on him. It doesn't mean I don't tell him his scribbled drawing is beautiful, etc. The, "Well, if you're not going to lie about Santa don't ever lie about anything" is just stupid.
No, I really, really don't lie to my kid and I don't plan to. Ever. If we can't go to the zoo, I tell her the actual reason why we can't go to the zoo. If she asks an awkward question like "Where do babies come from" I will give her an age-appropriate but truthful answer ("Babies grow in mommies' bellies."). I cannot think of a situation where I would have to lie to deter, distract, or pacify my kid and some simplified, age-appropriate version of the truth would not suffice. I am sure someone will respond that I will need to lie as my child grows older but I have several friends whose kids are much older than mine who abide by the same standard and have made it 10+ years without needing to lie to their kids.
I also wouldn't call it lying to call a child's scribbles beautiful, it's just a way to acknowledge their effort. It's beautiful in the context of their ability. Nobody expects a three-year-old to churn out a Picasso in crayon.
BTW mrsmayhem, to answer your OP, I don't volunteer to anyone that we don't do Santa. If I am asked or it comes up in conversation, I just tell them that we tell DD that Santa is a pretend game but we don't play into it in a traditional way. I have never gotten a side eye for it anywhere but this board but again I don't volunteer it and most of my friends don't do Santa either so it's not a big deal in my circle.
Post by nonsenseabound on Dec 3, 2012 16:31:24 GMT -5
Wait a minute, I cannot get on board with ppl saying "if you lie to your kids, then it is your problem if my kid tells Johnny or Suzy it is a lie." No way, I would look at this as a teaching moment. There are so many different things in life where someone may believe something that you disagree with, such as politics or religion. Take it as a moment to teach your kids that people celebrate in different ways. There is no need to tell that child that the other kids is wrong for believing in Santa or the tooth fairy, etc.
I can respect your decision not to do Santa. And I am okay explaining to my kid that some families don't do Santa. But don't feel it is okay for your kid to tell my kid that Santa is a fake. Let the magic continue for those who choose to partake.
Wait a minute, I cannot get on board with ppl saying "if you lie to your kids, then it is your problem if my kid tells Johnny or Suzy it is a lie." No way, I would look at this as a teaching moment. There are so many different things in life where someone may believe something that you disagree with, such as politics or religion. Take it as a moment to teach your kids that people celebrate in different ways. There is no need to tell that child that the other kids is wrong for believing in Santa or the tooth fairy, etc.
I can respect your decision not to do Santa. And I am okay explaining to my kid that some families don't do Santa. But don't feel it is okay for your kid to tell my kid that Santa is a fake. Let the magic continue for those who choose to partake.
I think I was the one who initially said this. I would agree with you if it were possible to control everything that comes out of a child's mouth.
As I said, we'll explain to DD that we don't do Santa, but some people do and that it's not nice to spoil other kids' fun. We will ask her to respect other peoples' holiday celebrations and keep her information to herself. But I can't actually stop the words from coming out of her mouth if she decides the secret is too good not to spill at school or something--kids are not so great at impulse control. And I am certainly not going to punish her for telling the truth, or feel guilty about it as a parent.
Again, it is a risk you take when you choose to tell your child a lie. The truth is out there and odds are that someone will share it with your kid eventually. I don't think it is appropriate for a parent to be mad at another parent over this unless the non-believing parent actively encourages their kid to go around spilling the beans on Santa, and I don't know what parent would do that. Not any of the posters on this board from what I have read in this thread.
Again, it is a risk you take when you choose to tell your child a lie. The truth is out there and odds are that someone will share it with your kid eventually. I don't think it is appropriate for a parent to be mad at another parent over this unless the non-believing parent actively encourages their kid to go around spilling the beans on Santa, and I don't know what parent would do that. Not any of the posters on this board from what I have read in this thread.
I am not a parent, but I totally agree with this.
When I was 9, I told one of my best friends that her parents were pregnant when they got married. I was too young to know that was not acceptable. She told me they were having their 10 year anniversary, I did the math, and then said on the bus "Oh, so they were pregnant with you when they got married." She had never considered this or figured it out.
I know her parents were furious, but I was a CHILD, and honestly didn't know better. It sure as hell wasn't my parents' fault.
Post by ESquared423 on Dec 3, 2012 16:53:37 GMT -5
I work with kids and have seen one too many little ones declare to their friends that "My mommy/daddy told me Santa isn't real!" and the look on the other kids faces is heartbreaking! More often than not the "believers" will defend Santa and seem to refuse to accept that he might be fake, they'll ask the counselors/teachers/adults around them if Santa is real or fake, it gets very heated!
I mean, I can accept that some don't want to do the Santa bit, but I don't know...kids grow up fast enough as it is, it's nice when there is this worldwide fantasy that a lot of young ones partake in and get excited about. Plenty of us grew up being "lied to" about Santa, we're not all fucked up from it. I think it's special while it lasts.
Again, it is a risk you take when you choose to tell your child a lie. The truth is out there and odds are that someone will share it with your kid eventually. I don't think it is appropriate for a parent to be mad at another parent over this unless the non-believing parent actively encourages their kid to go around spilling the beans on Santa, and I don't know what parent would do that. Not any of the posters on this board from what I have read in this thread.
I am not a parent, but I totally agree with this.
When I was 9, I told one of my best friends that her parents were pregnant when they got married. I was too young to know that was not acceptable. She told me they were having their 10 year anniversary, I did the math, and then said on the bus "Oh, so they were pregnant with you when they got married." She had never considered this or figured it out.
I know her parents were furious, but I was a CHILD, and honestly didn't know better. It sure as hell wasn't my parents' fault.
this is hilarious Sara, it's not your fault she couldn't do math, lol. She was going to figure it out eventually!
the truth is, it is just weird for me to raise my children with beliefs that are so different from the way I was raised. It's already a change to celebrate the holidays at all - one that I willingly and happily agreed to. I am glad my kids will grow up with these traditions. I just can't really picture telling my kids about Santa Claus or the Easter bunny when these were never part of my childhood. It just wouldn't be authentic or natural for me to tell my kids about Santa Claus. We will find other fun traditions that feel right for our family.
I think you answered your own question here. Just explain this, if someone pushes you on it.