I still want to understand why we're taking their word for it that sex work is on their own terms, not dangerous, and some kind of fulfilling career path.
Did you hear Rihanna's latest interview? She says Chris Brown is a good man, a kind person, and she loves him and supports him.
I'm not interested in destigmatizing prostitution, sex work, or trafficking. As a society I think we should focus on why men feel the need to pay for sex, not on the rights of women to prostitute themselves so men can have sex. Actually I think destigmatizing or legalizing prostitution runs counter to feminist thought. It allows men to continue to treat women like commodities while simultaneously perhaps hindering the male species from becoming more feminist minded and respectful human beings.
Who stands to gain the most from legalized prostitution? Is it women as a whole? No. It's men.
I'm not interested in destigmatizing prostitution, sex work, or trafficking. As a society I think we should focus on why men feel the need to pay for sex, not on the rights of women to prostitute themselves so men can have sex. Actually I think destigmatizing or legalizing prostitution runs counter to feminist thought. It allows men to continue to treat women like commodities while simultaneously perhaps hindering the male species from becoming more feminist minded and respectful human beings.
Who stands to gain the most from legalized prostitution? Is it women as a whole? No. It's men.
I think this is a very good point and it really verbalizes what I've been thinking about prostitution and what I don't like about it.
Because I don't think people who engage in any sex work are sluts, or morally bankrupt, at all. I don't judge them for it. But I don't think it's a good quality profession, or is healthy/safe/etc. Plus, it has so many issues, and I think in most instances it's very degrading to women. I know without a doubt, I wouldn't want my daughter, or any young girl to think it's a good career choice. And it's not because I think it would make them a bad person, or a slut.
ETA: and I don't think legalizing changes any of that. I think it could make the situation worse.
No flames from me. I'm still blown away that anyone who makes it their job to champion the rights of women is so vocally and aggressively denying that the great harm that runs through the vast majority of sex work.
And I'll offer what the Catholic Church has to say on the topic (cuz that's my job here):
"[W]hen we look at one of the most sensitive aspects of the situation of women in the world, how can we not mention the long and degrading history, albeit often an "underground" history, of violence against women in the area of sexuality? At the threshold of the Third Millennium we cannot remain indifferent and resigned before this phenomenon. The time has come to condemn vigorously the types of sexual violence which frequently have women for their object and to pass laws which effectively defend them from such violence. Nor can we fail, in the name of the respect due to the human person, to condemn the widespread hedonistic and commercial culture which encourages the systematic exploitation of sexuality and corrupts even very young girls into letting their bodies be used for profit." - Pope John Paul II
I really have a hard time being lectured about women's rights and female dignity from the Catholic Church.
I mean...In a small way...the old Pope is kinda arguing the same thing Arbor is: That it's time to really start looking at the cultural influences that drive people to make the CHOICES to go into sex work...and then condemn them...
I really have a hard time being lectured about women's rights and female dignity from the Catholic Church.
I mean...In a small way...the old Pope is kinda arguing the same thing Arbor is: That it's time to really start looking at the cultural influences that drive people to make the CHOICES to go into sex work...and then condemn them...
Huh. I thought the comments were more in line with hey jude's thoughts.
I really have a hard time being lectured about women's rights and female dignity from the Catholic Church.
You have a right to feel that way. Feel free to ignore it. I'll still post the Catholic Church's POV for those who would like to read it.
If I wanted to hear the church's opinion, I'd go to mass. I want to hear *your* opinion. Obviously, it's informed by the church, but is it always exactly the same? Do you have anything to add beyond what I can find with a catechism search?
You have a right to feel that way. Feel free to ignore it. I'll still post the Catholic Church's POV for those who would like to read it.
If I wanted to hear the church's opinion, I'd go to mass. I want to hear *your* opinion. Obviously, it's informed by the church, but is it always exactly the same? Do you have anything to add beyond what I can find with a catechism search?
As a Catholic, I look towards Church teaching in forming my conscience. When it comes to sex trafficking and any of these other related topics and regardless of whether we're dealing with children or not, I really don't work in the greys that are swirling around in here. It's wrong. Period.
So, I guess when it comes to this, yeah my opinion = Church.
ETA: And honestly sibil? Lately, I'm sure due to my sensitivity, I'm not feeling like my opinion really matters in here.
I don't put porn in the same category as prostitution.
Why?
I think there is a greater gender power imbalance in prostitution where a woman turns her body over to a man for payment. In porn, generally, both men and women are equally turning their bodies over for payment.
It doesn't even have to be as stark of a choice as starving or prostitution. There are plenty of other coercive and life intersecting ways one can get into prostitution that negate the ability to choose.
There seems to be a sense of familial community among some types of prostitutes. The feeling that someone is looking out for you, cares what happens to you, notices you, that you have some value to someone. Now we all know that value is the money you bring into the house but to these girls who know little else, it feels just as real and warm as our relationships with our families do so it's difficult to simply take their word for it when they say it's a choice. Some simply do not or do not want to recognize that they are being victimized and have been devalued.
Really well put. (yes I finally read the whole thing myself).
Honestly, I'm finding it hard to fathom how someone who sees an u/s before an abortion as coercive, or doesn't believe someone can be willingly dick-slapped doesn't see the blatant coercion going on in this industry.
I think if women and men do porn/exotic dancing that's great and their choice. As long as it is their choice. I would imagine there to be emotional trauma involved, eventually, for most who choose this path. I guess I just have a hard time seeing my body, in such an intimate way, as a product. I think that is sad.
Sometimes, I do get concerned with the objectification aspect of it. I often wonder if everything starts tying into itself because of the objectification, you know? While most people who go to a strip club or watch porn are normal..there are some sick individuals out there. Individuals who always need that next rush...after porn, exotic dancers and prostitutes what's the next step for these people? Buying a young girl or boy in Thailand? Does it all feed into one another?