Foster Dog Update

[nomad100]

It is the end of week 2 and things are getting better in some ways and worse in others.

First off our vet told us that Alfalfa is probably about a year old. Not the 2.5 years that the shelter gave as his age. How on earth could they have been that far off? All you needed to do was look at the teeth to see that this was not a 2.5 year old dog.

Here is my OP
pandce.proboards.com/thread/190616/foster-thing-long-advice-needed

The good stuff:
We are keeping them separated 80-90% of the time. Separate times outside, DH will watch one upstairs while I have one downstairs (usually Willow since Falf doesn't understand how stairs work). They do still take one walk together daily and behavior on that is so much better.

We have started doing daily training. Turns out Falf likes chicken and bananas as well as pea pods (of all things). We work with him and Willow at the same time and again separately. It is kind of cute how he looks to her to see if he is doing the right command.

He is very affectionate and is getting better about jumping and licking (by at least a little bit).

I am able to get him to focus on me and can redirect his negative behavior (licking, nipping) with toys. Man, this dog loves to play with, carry around and sleep with toys more than any other dog I have ever met.

Here is the not so good stuff:

willow and Alfalfa are still getting aggressive towards one another at times when they are together and it is coming from both sides. Falf will get ramped up playing with a toy and come barreling for Willow when DH comes out of the office. Or Willow will decide that Falf just needs to be jumped on when she comes upstairs. (on the positive side of this - they both now know the word "enough" and will stop dead in their tracks when I say the word in a firm voice - that is progress, right?)

Falf just started peeing/mark in the house after not doing so the first week. He isn't doing it in the same spots every time or doing it every day and, yes, we have used enzymatic cleaner stuff on the spots. He goes out regularly - never more than 5-6 hours between visits to the backyard or walks. He just had a clean bill of health at the vet so now we need to see what may be the root of the peeing. Interestingly, he seems to pee more by DH's stuff (though not on it) - in front of his dresser, on the rug by his office chair, on the floor by his recliner). 

Falf has started to bark in the backyard, alot. He has discovered the wildlife (birds, squirrels, tree frogs, bugs) and will try to chase, eat, bark at or some combination of these activities, at all of them. He barked at a dragonfly yesterday. He rarely barks inside. I am sure of neighbors love that. (we do bring him inside if he barks more than a minute or so since I don't want to be that neighbor).

DH is getting to the end of his rope with Falf's crazy behavior and actually said that he wants to send Falf back. Apparently this puppy is supposed to just know, or know after being told a couple to times, that a behavior is unacceptable. Flaf is a giant PITA but I do see progress, even if it is slow. I am totally giving DH the side-eye since Willow was a spaz when we got her and he is just having selective memory. So now I am ending up doing most of the work with the dogs. He does walk Falf but can be a little huffy about it.

One thing I am concerned about is that Willow is still getting stressed more than I like. We can be sitting on the couch downstairs and she will hear Falf's collar jingle from upstairs and she starts panting. She hasn't been finishing all her food at meals at least a couple of times a week (and this is a totally food motivated dog). So not sure what else we can do to keep her stress levels down since our house is not designed/set up for total separation of two dogs.

So that's where we are this week.

I actually was able to take some pics of the nutball dog on my actual camera and will try to get them uploaded tonight so I can post.

[Jalapeñomel]

I´m sorry this sounds super stressful. But it should get better in time.

How much are you using the crate?

[nomad100]

Jun 27, 2013 10:33:42 GMT -5 Jalapeñomel said:

I´m sorry this sounds super stressful. But it should get better in time.

How much are you using the crate?

Falf is in his crate, in our bedroom, while we are at work and at night when we are all sleeping.  So he is in the crate from
about 8 to noon
from 12:45 to about 5 or 6
from 10:30 pm to about 6 am

He is then closed up with DH in his office anywhere from 1-2 hours in the evening as well, to help keep the "kids" separated. 

Willow is closed up in our family room on the other side of the house from the bedroom while we are at work and usually sleeps in the bed with us at night.

[Jalapeñomel]

Jun 27, 2013 10:38:30 GMT -5 nomad100 said:

Jun 27, 2013 10:33:42 GMT -5 Jalapeñomel said:

I´m sorry this sounds super stressful. But it should get better in time.

How much are you using the crate?

Falf is in his crate, in our bedroom, while we are at work and at night when we are all sleeping.  So he is in the crate from
about 8 to noon
from 12:45 to about 5 or 6
from 10:30 pm to about 6 am

He is then closed up with DH in his office anywhere from 1-2 hours in the evening as well, to help keep the "kids" separated. 

Willow is closed up in our family room on the other side of the house from the bedroom while we are at work and usually sleeps in the bed with us at night.

You can utilize the crate more, or at least we do.  If Camote is spazzing out or bothering one of the other dogs, we put her in the crate with a bone and some peanut butter or cheese.  It helps calm her and the other dogs down.  And now she associates her crate with her own space.  

[nomad100]

Jun 27, 2013 10:45:29 GMT -5 Jalapeñomel said:

Jun 27, 2013 10:38:30 GMT -5 nomad100 said:

Falf is in his crate, in our bedroom, while we are at work and at night when we are all sleeping.  So he is in the crate from
about 8 to noon
from 12:45 to about 5 or 6
from 10:30 pm to about 6 am

He is then closed up with DH in his office anywhere from 1-2 hours in the evening as well, to help keep the "kids" separated. 

Willow is closed up in our family room on the other side of the house from the bedroom while we are at work and usually sleeps in the bed with us at night.

You can utilize the crate more, or at least we do.  If Camote is spazzing out or bothering one of the other dogs, we put her in the crate with a bone and some peanut butter or cheese.  It helps calm her and the other dogs down.  And now she associates her crate with her own space.  

Between the crate and being in DH's office he is closed off/contained  about 18-19 hours a day.  Do you have your dog in a crate for more than that?

Falf isn't yet totally keen on going into the crate, even with his favorite toy, a nylabone and a PB filled kong in there. We think he has been crated as punishment because if you use anything but a soft voice and fluid gentle body motions when you are near the crate, he sort of freaks out and tries to run away.  

This morning was the first time he went in without any fuss for me.  I just about cried since it usually takes me some time to get him calm enough so he goes in without being forced since I want him to associate good stuff with the crate. 

[Jalapeñomel]

Jun 27, 2013 10:56:34 GMT -5 nomad100 said:

Jun 27, 2013 10:45:29 GMT -5 Jalapeñomel said:

You can utilize the crate more, or at least we do.  If Camote is spazzing out or bothering one of the other dogs, we put her in the crate with a bone and some peanut butter or cheese.  It helps calm her and the other dogs down.  And now she associates her crate with her own space.  

Between the crate and being in DH's office he is closed off/contained  about 18-19 hours a day.  Do you have your dog in a crate for more than that?

Falf isn't yet totally keen on going into the crate, even with his favorite toy, a nylabone and a PB filled kong in there. We think he has been crated as punishment because if you use anything but a soft voice and fluid gentle body motions when you are near the crate, he sort of freaks out and tries to run away.  

This morning was the first time he went in without any fuss for me.  I just about cried since it usually takes me some time to get him calm enough so he goes in without being forced since I want him to associate good stuff with the crate. 

When we first got her, yes, she was crated a lot.  She isn´t as much anymore, but the issues she had with the other dogs have died down. 

I always feel so bad for these poor neglected dogs.  They have so many issues, and all they deserve is love. 

[darkling_glory]

Get a belly band to stop the marking asap. You are doing a great job! I wish you could get more walks with the two of them in.

One thing I'm not sure if you're doing from the OP is allowing them time together in the same room, but leashed. Then, if one makes a move you can shut it down right away and try to figure out the triggers. I know it might seem like there aren't any, but there should be some signals that allow you to diffuse before one of them lunges. That is the key.

Lastly, this is silly, but are you sure you're seeing outright aggression and not play? If you've ever seen two bulldog wrestle, it looks like a fight, but is just normal dog play. It's a stretch, but just checking.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using proboards

[mala]

Progress is progress! It doesn't have to happen fast to be a good thing. This behavior sounds much more normal from a one year old than a 2.5 year old. As far as the marking goes, is your H doing the training with him or are you? If he's marking by your H's things it could be that he is trying to say he is above your H in the pack. Training with H might fix that. Your H needs to remember that at 1 your dog is a toddler/small child. He is going to be rambunctious and not listen. It's your job as his doggie foster parents to train him to not be, and that isn't going to happen overnight.

[mala]

Jun 27, 2013 11:11:19 GMT -5 darkling_glory said:

Get a belly band to stop the marking asap. You are doing a great job! I wish you could get more walks with the two of them in.

One thing I'm not sure if you're doing from the OP is allowing them time together in the same room, but leashed. Then, if one makes a move you can shut it down right away and try to figure out the triggers. I know it might seem like there aren't any, but there should be some signals that allow you to diffuse before one of them lunges. That is the key.

Lastly, this is silly, but are you sure you're seeing outright aggression and not play? If you've ever seen two bulldog wrestle, it looks like a fight, but is just normal dog play. It's a stretch, but just checking. :)

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using proboards

This is a good point. Most people don't know how to distinguish aggression from normal play behavior.

[nomad100]

mala darkling_glory

It starts as play but very quickly escalates. They can be playing with a rope or a toy or just laying on the floor and then, Willow will looks af Falfa a certain way and boom, Falfa will have a hold of Willow's face, which sets her off and then it is on (like Donkey Kong).  Or Falf will do something (like try to hump Willow or bite her feet) and, boom, Willow will have him on his back and will have his neck in her mouth.  So we have been working with very short times of play and are trying to never let it get to the escalated part.   Luckily, Falfa is pretty easily redirected with a toy. Willow is harder to redirect since she is so single minded.

It is easier to tell when Willow is playing and when she is truly angry because we know her vocalizations/postures better.  When she isn't playing she has a certain yipping sound she does and her face contorts in a certain way (not sure if that makes sense).  We have been hearing/seeing that alot more this week than last.  She is usually very gentle with young dogs and tries to "teach" them without actually hurting them, even when they bite/nip at her. This has how she has been with Falf from the beginning but he isn't taking the hint so now she is getting more and more physical with him.

Yeah, it would be nice to walk them together twice a day but Willow is not interested and I don't want to stress her out more than she already is by messing with her daily routine (we jokingly call her our OCD dog since if you mess with the order of certain things she is very unhappy).  She is usually still sleeping when I take Falf for his walk in the morning. 

[mala]

nomad100 Sounds like you're doing everything right. Have you talked to your vet or to a trainer to see if there's anything else you can do?

[nomad100]

mala

They say we are doing things right but I am going to try to get more info from the trainer since they have been working under the premise that Falf is 2.5 not 1. And I know the age thing is a HUGE part of it too. He is a toddler and, as I have seen on this board, toddlers are assholes. Apparently this is true in the animal world too.

TBH, right now I am less frustrated with Falf and more frustrated at DH. He just seems to have unrealistic expectations and is pissed because Falf turned out to be more work than he thought. He has gotten used to our lazy, all day sleeping, totally people pleasing, snuggle bug of a dog that after living with us for 3 years is so easy peasy.

[mala]

nomad100 Get your H to see the trainer with you. Maybe the trainer can make him see how it is.

Anna was 6 months old when we got her (and already 60 pounds) and had almost no training. She could sit, and lay down and that was it. No leash training, no stay, nothing. She was wild. She is still wild at 2, but the difference between then and now is dramatic. Her biggest problem now is focus when we are on walks and that she jumps up on visitors. My point being that age and training make a huge difference. You'll get there! He just needs the time to mature and learn. Hit your H over the head with a frying pan until he gets it. (but not really because that is assault and is wrong)