Student Loan Bullshit

[underwaterrhymes]

Nov 8, 2013 11:01:04 GMT -5 overture said:

I don't understand why more people don't put off college until they are independent for financial aid purposes. CC is easily affordable by a working student (at least in CA), and if you are single, low income, and transfer at 24, you will probably (like me) qualify for maximum federal and state grants.

Is graduating 4 years later really too big of a price to pay to not take on tens of thousands of dollars of debt that would otherwise be free money? Not for me, certainly.

Well.

Aren't you delightful?

[pixelpassion]

Nov 8, 2013 16:43:37 GMT -5 Lucy Honeychurch said:

I can't figure out if I'm being a smug asshole or not, so I'm just leaving this post. lol.

FTR, I don't think you are at all. 

[pedanticwench]

Nov 8, 2013 16:43:37 GMT -5 Lucy Honeychurch said:

I can't figure out if I'm being a smug asshole or not, so I'm just leaving this post. lol.

Definitely not you. In this thread, at least.

[Deleted]

Nov 8, 2013 16:20:18 GMT -5 elle said:

Nov 8, 2013 16:13:49 GMT -5 @scottydeux said:

So there is no snobbery w/r/t coming from a CC if you want to go to say, Princeton?  They'll still consider you as equally as they would a a person right out of h.s.?  This makes me happy, as I didn't realize that.

Don't think so. I think it ends up sounding that way because most people who can get in to top tier schools go directly from high school, without a CC detour. But CC isn't going to make a kid with 99th percentile SAT's, and straight A's since forever, less viable of a candidate.

I do think there's a risk that a top school just won't have the space to take someone half way through. Not that one person makes or breaks class size at, say, Princeton, but those schools tend to build a class profile at the outset and have less attrition so I think you have to be special enough to catch their eye.



I don't know or care if it's snobby or not, but the 4 year college experience was important to me. Call me a loser, but being steeped in the college world for the whole time mattered a ton to me and I think was vital in shaping who I am. Not that I'd for sure be an emotionally stunted fool, but in retrospect I see how valuable that was. For a nerdy, naive girl like I was.

[Deleted]

All I know is that the dudes I banged in college were worth the price of admission.

[joshlyman]

There are a lot of downsides to doing college later too. That is the path I took, but there are a lot of times I wish I had a real college experience. I also worked full time through undergrad and will through grad school as well.

My sister, who is 20, is living on campus at UCLA and not working. She did 2 years of CC first, but she gets to have that experience and a shitload less on her plate. At 26 or whatever was suggested, that is not possible for most people. I had supported myself for 8 years at that point.

[TC]

Nov 8, 2013 18:06:22 GMT -5 nuggetbrain said:

I was not even remotely ready for regular college at 18. I would have ended up a herpes ridden drunkard by the time I was 20.

I like the intensity of honesty all these college posts are bringing out LOL 
Some of us just know our limits, guys!

[fryjack2]

95% of the reason I chose my college (a good school in the Midwest) was because they recruited me to play soccer. The other 5% was because it had a stellar science program. I thought I could be a doctor by playing soccer and drinking and hanging out until 4am. Not so much.

My mom had to sign a release allowing me to compete in the first half of the season's soccer games. I wasn't even legally an adult my first semester.

Basically, I'm damn lucky that I was a good soccer player because I sure as hell didn't have the maturity or forethought to think about paying off loans when I entered college at 17.

[isabel]

Nov 8, 2013 13:11:38 GMT -5 ste said:

Nov 8, 2013 13:02:20 GMT -5 Lucy Honeychurch said:

I'll be an asshole and say that I don't think the local community college would have even remotely satisfied what I was looking for in terms of academics.

I agree. It's a shitty fine line to walk - making that call just to save a non-insignificant amount of money.

I got in a knockdown dragout fight with a friend/coworker about paying for school for kids. I said that our ability to do so will directly impact the size of our family (which sucks, bc I'd like to have a biggish family). He (a physician) was adamant that they will not be paying a dime towards any of his - 5 - kids educations. Bc that makes for irresponsible, lazy adults. (huh)

Yikes. Good luck following in daddy's med school footsteps, kiddos. Bootstraps!

[Gato]

Nov 8, 2013 23:35:17 GMT -5 isabel said:

Nov 8, 2013 13:11:38 GMT -5 ste said:

I got in a knockdown dragout fight with a friend/coworker about paying for school for kids. I said that our ability to do so will directly impact the size of our family (which sucks, bc I'd like to have a biggish family). He (a physician) was adamant that they will not be paying a dime towards any of his - 5 - kids educations. Bc that makes for irresponsible, lazy adults. (huh)

How old was the physician?  My mom's dad wouldn't pay for her college, but she still got her degree by saving all her money working summers in a factory.  Back in 1963, this was totally possible.  A college degree also meant a secure future (for men, less so for women unless they were married to a college grad).  So I can see an older guy thinking bootstraps are all you need.

But the reality is that it's a lot more complicated for our generation.  I think what unites most people in this thread is that, when we were 18, we had no clue how to make college decisions other than what we thought would make us happy.  We thought a degree would equal success.  So get that degree, and the loans will sort themselves out. 

This was what the adults told us, and this is what was true FOR THEM.  Pre-1980.  There are no guarantees anymore and people don't even agree what college is even for: is it vocational?  a chance to grow and discover yourself? a place to cheer in a football stadium with your closest 20 drunken friends?  a place to learn things?

There are no right answers.  Kids make decisions based on immature ideas of what will make them happy 10, 20, and 30 years down the line.  Some people manage to finesse it and come out in the place they want to be, but it's no shame if you don't get it just right.  The system as it stands today is crazy, and I say this having been employed by three different universities, my husband now at a fourth, and having access to the highest echelons at one.  Even university presidents are scrambling to figure it out.

[joshlyman]

Nov 8, 2013 16:11:41 GMT -5 elle said:

Nov 8, 2013 15:47:49 GMT -5 sonrisa said:

Let's be honest: your husband is the exception. Stanford takes very few CC transfer students. His extraordinary circumstances, plus the fact he had been accepted out of high school, plus family name and money probably helped keep that door open for him.

UCs and Cal State schools are another matter. They hold slots for CC transfer students. 

Sure, those things helped him get into Stanford. And a kid who couldn't get into Stanford out of high school probably isn't going to magically transform into a Stanford candidate in community college. But what is possible is for a student who gets into a top school, but cannot afford it without hefty loans, is to go to community college and then transfer in two years. If you do well at CC the top tier college will likely still be there two years later.

It also depends on the community college. The one I went to had a very high rate of transfers to very good schools and is highly regarded as far as community colleges go. My sister also went there and did a semester abroad at Oxford and then transferred to UCLA. Yes, she worked her tail off, but it wasn't impossible.

I also realize that we were extraordinarily lucky to live in an area with an awesome CC. There are many many people who don't have access to that in their backyard, and I recognize that is privilege in and of itself.

[Jalapeñomel]

To be fair, community colleges in California are exceptionally good.

[chickenlittle]

I was curious about how much my UG tuition would be now. I paid $26,935 my freshman year in 2001. It's now $49,780. Tuition has almost doubled in a decade. How the fuck does that even make sense???

[joshlyman]

Nov 9, 2013 11:23:36 GMT -5 Jalapeñomel said:

To be fair, community colleges in California are exceptionally good.

Exactly.

Although I have heard they are having a lot more issues because of all the massive budget cuts

But that is what I mean - people say to just go to CC, that it worked for them. But the issue is that not all community colleges are created equally, and not all students that go to them are going to be afforded the same opportunities. I think CC can be great, but they are not an answer to this problem right now.

Also, to the person that said acedemics are not rigorous enough at the CC level - that is a complete over generalization and pretty offensive to those of is that chose to go that direction. Both my sister and I did the honors track in CC and many of those classes were actually harder than the upper level classes I took after transfer. I had multiple Drs. As professors as well. I feel like it was a very good education - not Harvard or anything - but certainly not HS+.