I don't think this is going the way she or her friend's parents thought it would....
It is all over social media and I haven't seen anyone siding with the 18 year old. Everyone seems pro parent
I seriously wonder why the friend's dad (aka lawyer) actually thought it would go that way and why he didn't first just go to the parents and try to mediate before racking up $12k in services that he's going to try to get the parents to pay for. Is that even ethical for a professional to have your client live with you and try to represent them against their own parents?
I'm just flabbergasted that a judge can't just say, "Not hearing this! You're 18, be an adult."
"Hi mom just to let you know you're a real f**king winner aren't you you think you're so cool and you think you caught me throwing up in the bathroom after eating an egg frittatta, yeah sorry that you have problems now and you need to harp on mine because i didn't and i actually took a s*** which i really just wanna s*** all over your face right now because it looks like that anyway, anyway i f***ing hate you and um I've written you off so don't talk to me, don't do anything I'm blocking you from just about everything, have a nice life, bye mom'"
Yeah, I'm standing by my borderline arm chair diagnosis
Oh man. That's. Um. That's something.
And here's a picture from some article - her little attitude is right there on her face, isn't it?
I don't think this is going the way she or her friend's parents thought it would....
It is all over social media and I haven't seen anyone siding with the 18 year old. Everyone seems pro parent
I seriously wonder why the friend's dad (aka lawyer) actually thought it would go that way and why he didn't first just go to the parents and try to mediate before racking up $12k in services that he's going to try to get the parents to pay for. Is that even ethical for a professional to have your client live with you and try to represent them against their own parents?
I'm just flabbergasted that a judge can't just say, "Not hearing this! You're 18, be an adult."
I think the friend's father hired outside counsel. I don't think he is representing her... but still in this day and age of social media....
I don't think this is going the way she or her friend's parents thought it would....
It is all over social media and I haven't seen anyone siding with the 18 year old. Everyone seems pro parent
I seriously wonder why the friend's dad (aka lawyer) actually thought it would go that way and why he didn't first just go to the parents and try to mediate before racking up $12k in services that he's going to try to get the parents to pay for. Is that even ethical for a professional to have your client live with you and try to represent them against their own parents?
I'm just flabbergasted that a judge can't just say, "Not hearing this! You're 18, be an adult."
so, maybe the lawyers can help me work this out here...
I imagine, as someone said earlier, it would be unethical to do this on contingency. I think we can reasonably ASSume that the girl is not/cannot pay the lawyer fees. So, I mean, the choices on a fee agreement would be flat (which is unlikely - even though I can't believe she'd be able to pay for that anyway), retainer/hourly (again, she would be unable to pay) or pro bono. So, if the judge rules that the parents are not responsible for the lawyer fees, he's have to be out the money, no? Since it can't be contingent and he didn't get money from his client up front (too bad, so sad), yes?
ETA: I see that someone said it wasn't the friend's father who is representing her. Still, though, can HE recover from her if he is the one who entered the fee agreement with the lawyer? CAN he even enter a fee agreement if he's not being represented? (ok, I guess he can when I think about how many people pay for lawyers for other people..however, those people are not the attorney's client.. I guess I'm wondering if the person paying the lawyer can even get his money back)
"Not gonna lie; I kind of keep expecting you to post one day that you threw down on someone who clearly had no idea that today was NOT THEIR DAY." ~dontcallmeshirley
I seriously wonder why the friend's dad (aka lawyer) actually thought it would go that way and why he didn't first just go to the parents and try to mediate before racking up $12k in services that he's going to try to get the parents to pay for. Is that even ethical for a professional to have your client live with you and try to represent them against their own parents?
I'm just flabbergasted that a judge can't just say, "Not hearing this! You're 18, be an adult."
so, maybe the lawyers can help me work this out here...
I imagine, as someone said earlier, it would be unethical to do this on contingency. I think we can reasonably ASSume that the girl is not/cannot pay the lawyer fees. So, I mean, the choices on a fee agreement would be flat (which is unlikely - even though I can't believe she'd be able to pay for that anyway), retainer/hourly (again, she would be unable to pay) or pro bono. So, if the judge rules that the parents are not responsible for the lawyer fees, he's have to be out the money, no? Since it can't be contingent and he didn't get money from his client up front (too bad, so sad), yes?
ETA: I see that someone said it wasn't the friend's father who is representing her. Still, though, can HE recover from her if he is the one who entered the fee agreement with the lawyer? CAN he even enter a fee agreement if he's not being represented?
so, maybe the lawyers can help me work this out here...
I imagine, as someone said earlier, it would be unethical to do this on contingency. I think we can reasonably ASSume that the girl is not/cannot pay the lawyer fees. So, I mean, the choices on a fee agreement would be flat (which is unlikely - even though I can't believe she'd be able to pay for that anyway), retainer/hourly (again, she would be unable to pay) or pro bono. So, if the judge rules that the parents are not responsible for the lawyer fees, he's have to be out the money, no? Since it can't be contingent and he didn't get money from his client up front (too bad, so sad), yes?
ETA: I see that someone said it wasn't the friend's father who is representing her. Still, though, can HE recover from her if he is the one who entered the fee agreement with the lawyer? CAN he even enter a fee agreement if he's not being represented?
"Not gonna lie; I kind of keep expecting you to post one day that you threw down on someone who clearly had no idea that today was NOT THEIR DAY." ~dontcallmeshirley
assuming they entered an agreement with her? I mean, I realize everything is an "it depends" type thing...but what if everything just steamrolled ahead without these parents covering their asses with an agreement with the girl?
"Not gonna lie; I kind of keep expecting you to post one day that you threw down on someone who clearly had no idea that today was NOT THEIR DAY." ~dontcallmeshirley
assuming they entered an agreement with her? I mean, I realize everything is an "it depends" type thing...but what if everything just steamrolled ahead without these parents covering their asses with an agreement with the girl?
hmmm if she is old enough to enter into a legally binding agreement with him, should she really be receiving child support from her parents?
assuming they entered an agreement with her? I mean, I realize everything is an "it depends" type thing...but what if everything just steamrolled ahead without these parents covering their asses with an agreement with the girl?
hmmm if she is old enough to enter into a legally binding agreement with him, should she really be receiving child support from her parents?
right. But, she's 18, yes? So... she can legally enter a contract, yes? (assuming BPD is off the table, which is unknown)
"Not gonna lie; I kind of keep expecting you to post one day that you threw down on someone who clearly had no idea that today was NOT THEIR DAY." ~dontcallmeshirley
so, maybe the lawyers can help me work this out here...
I imagine, as someone said earlier, it would be unethical to do this on contingency. I think we can reasonably ASSume that the girl is not/cannot pay the lawyer fees. So, I mean, the choices on a fee agreement would be flat (which is unlikely - even though I can't believe she'd be able to pay for that anyway), retainer/hourly (again, she would be unable to pay) or pro bono. So, if the judge rules that the parents are not responsible for the lawyer fees, he's have to be out the money, no? Since it can't be contingent and he didn't get money from his client up front (too bad, so sad), yes?
ETA: I see that someone said it wasn't the friend's father who is representing her. Still, though, can HE recover from her if he is the one who entered the fee agreement with the lawyer? CAN he even enter a fee agreement if he's not being represented?
Her BFF's parents are bankrolling this.
Ah, NPR said that also. I knew I heard that the friend's dad was a lawyer, but he's bankrolling, not representing, like you said.
"A judge held an unusual hearing in New Jersey on Tuesday: a lawsuit brought by an 18-year-old who says her parents kicked her out of their house. Rachel Canning is seeking to force her parents to give her financial support and money for college, in addition to pay for tuition at her private school.
Superior Court Family Division Judge Peter Bogaard, who heard the case in Morristown, N.J., on Tuesday afternoon, denied Canning's requests in what's seen as the first round of hearings in the case.
"All requests by plaintiff for emergent relief at this point are denied," tweeted Michael Izzo of the Daily Record, which was apparently the first news outlet to report the news of the lawsuit.
The judge set a date of April 22 for a hearing to consider other issues in the case, such as Canning's legal status, the Daily Record reports.
In discussing the case after nearly two hours of testimony, the judge cited an email from Canning to her parents in which she said, "I'm my biggest enemy ... And do realize that a change has to be made," Izzo says.
Bogaard also "noted that Rachel Canning's behavior over the past year has been in question," reports CBS 2 TV: "one or two school suspensions, drinking, losing her captaincy on the cheerleading squad and being kicked out of the campus ministry."
The news station says the judge also told the Cannings that they should have tried to get help for their daughter instead of cutting her off.
Bogaard said the question of public policy must be considered, Izzo reported, as the case might set a precedent in which children can flout their parents' rules and then demand money from them.
Court documents filed by Rachel Canning alleged that her parents abandoned her. But her lawsuit stopped short of seeking full emancipation from them – if that connection is removed, her parents would cease to have an obligation toward their daughter.
"We're being sued by our child," Sean Canning told CBS 2's Christine Sloan Monday. "I'm dumbfounded. So is my wife, so are my other daughters."
Rachel Canning, a senior at Morris Catholic High School, is on the honor roll and the cheerleading squad; she plays lacrosse and has a $20,000 scholarship, according to multiple reports. She has been accepted at several colleges and reportedly hopes to attend the University of Vermont.
Since leaving her parents' home, Canning has been living with a friend whose father helped her sue, as The Asbury Park Press reports:
"Since the alleged "abandonment" by her parents, Rachel has been living in Rockaway Township with the family of her best friend and fellow student Jaime Inglesino, whose father is attorney and former Morris County Freeholder John Inglesino. Inglesino is funding the lawsuit and hired attorney Helfand, who included in the lawsuit a request that the parents pay their daughter's legal fees that so far total $12,597."
In late December, Canning's parents' attorney wrote a letter stating that the parents would continue to pay for Rachel's health insurance and saying she is entitled to money from a college fund they created, reports the The Star-Ledger.
"I know Rachel is a) a good kid, b) an incredibly rebellious teen, and she's getting some terrible information," Sean Canning told CBS 2.
He told the TV station that his daughter left home in November. The Canning household isn't a strict one, he said, noting that curfew is often after 11 p.m. Several local media outlets have reported that the Cannings did not approve of their daughter's boyfriend, whom the Daily Record has identified as a fellow senior at Morris Catholic.
Tuesday afternoon, Sean and Elizabeth Canning and their daughter came to court to discuss her lawsuit against them. They sat "at opposite ends" of the same table, Fox News' Rick Leventhal tweets. "All look miserable."
For today's hearing, the parents were "required to produce information about their incomes, including their 2011 and 2012 tax returns and their last three pay stubs," reports the The Star-Ledger."
But HECK NO on the judge's comment on trying to "get her help rather than cutting her off." Um, so parents who have rules that a kid breaks are possibly going to have to prove that they tried to get a kid help rather than just cut them off of funds for extra activtities and private school? I'm not down with that. If a parent decides that a consequence for not following the rules is not getting financial support at a private school or for activities, then they should get to decide that. If the kid is an acutal adult, 18 yrs+, and the parent says, "shape up or you can't live off our housing/food/etc." and then follows through with that consequence without getting her counseling or financial planning classes or their first month's rent or a job interview or something first. That still seems ok to me. Maybe I'd think different if it comes up that she has a diagnosed mental health issue or concern or a learning disability, but right now telling her to shape up or ship out, seems totally legal and I hope it stays that way.
If this all went down after she was 18, it could be pretty hard to get her help. They can't force her into a psych ward even if they could find her a bed at one.
If this all went down after she was 18, it could be pretty hard to get her help. They can't force her into a psych ward even if they could find her a bed at one.
Plus, the same can be said for someone who has a chemical dependency issue. You can keep trying to get them help and if they are 17 or younger you can force them into programs, but honestly, until they want to be different, they'll just keep doing as they please. Sometimes the best thing is not letting them depend on you.
You know, my brother did things like this when we were teens. He would convince people that my parents were abusive, would tell stories about how they beat him, threw bricks at his head, etc. This would be after going on rages, cutting up all of the cords in our house, putting holes in the wall, refusing to go to school, etc. And amazingly, he could always find a family to take him in. More than once someone would show up on our doorstep, trying to be the mediator because they'd offered him a place on their couch following yet another tale of made up bullshit.
He has borderline personality disorder.
This is eerily similar to the situation we had with my brother. (I should add my brother was diagnosed with bipolar disorder, but stopped going to therapy and taking meds because he "could cure himself." Right). He would throw the worst temper tantrums, break stuff, punch holes in the wall, try to get physical with my parents, and when they would defend themselves, he would call the cops on them. We had cops at our house frequently, and I remember as a senior in HS I was pulled out of gym class by a policeman who needed to talk to me about the allegations my brother made against my parents. That was special. I felt sorry for that cop-he got an earful from me about my brother.
My brother was (is, I guess) extremely manipulative, and after my parents threw him out of the house, he was always able to find a family to stay with who took pity on him after hearing his stories. That is, until he wasn't able to hide his true colors and the family would eventually show him the door.
There may very well be more to this story that we don't know about, but based on the experience we had with my brother during my middle, high school and college years, it's VERY hard for me to be objective when I hear stories like this on the news.
The boyfriend's mom is taking the girl's side, saying she heard a conversation between the dad and his daughter, "“My recollection was he said ‘Congratulations. You are turning 18 and there are two things you have yet to do: get pregnant or do drugs to the best of my knowledge. You will not be able to see the scumbag or the scumbag’s family anymore.’’’
I'm still on team parent, but the fact that so many people are taking the girl's side makes me wonder. Either there's more to the story or she's very, very good at manipulating people. Either one is possible.
The boyfriend's mom is taking the girl's side, saying she heard a conversation between the dad and his daughter, "“My recollection was he said ‘Congratulations. You are turning 18 and there are two things you have yet to do: get pregnant or do drugs to the best of my knowledge. You will not be able to see the scumbag or the scumbag’s family anymore.’’’
I'm still on team parent, but the fact that so many people are taking the girl's side makes me wonder. Either there's more to the story or she's very, very good at manipulating people. Either one is possible.
I think the problem is these well meaning people only hear one side of the story. By itself, that shit sounds awful but after years and years of having the cops on your doorstep, holes in the wall, listening to your sibling tell your parents they hate them, never loved them, are trying to ruin their life simply for asking the kid to do the same things they've asked of you, omg, the things that come out of your mouth.
Then you get people who don't know all of this, certainly haven't lived there weighing in with advice your parents tried years ago to no avail.
All that aside, I'm not surprised boyfriend's mom is taking the girl's side. All things being equal, who wants to agree that your son is a terrible influence?
I will allow that it's all very possible these parents ARE assholes. I'm still sitting on the projection couch lol.
Ditto, but 18-yr olds range from slight assholes to complete and utter assholes. They all really do have some range in there. I think back on myself at 18 and I was good kid, but honestly, I too was selfish and who's first (and sometimes only consideration) was myself or my stuff (aka friends, activities, etc.).
I'd love for someone to raise their hand if they weren't somewhat of an asshole at 18 years old.
Ditto, but 18-yr olds range from slight assholes to complete and utter assholes. They all really do have some range in there. I think back on myself at 18 and I was good kid, but honestly, I too was selfish and who's first (and sometimes only consideration) was myself or my stuff (aka friends, activities, etc.).
I'd love for someone to raise their hand if they weren't somewhat of an asshole at 18 years old.
At minimum, I don't believe these parents are such huge grade A assholes that this broad (thanks for that) can't deal for one last year like every other teenager on the planet who thinks they are so much smarter than the people who raised her.
I will allow that it's all very possible these parents ARE assholes. I'm still sitting on the projection couch lol.
Ditto, but 18-yr olds range from slight assholes to complete and utter assholes. They all really do have some range in there. I think back on myself at 18 and I was good kid, but honestly, I too was selfish and who's first (and sometimes only consideration) was myself or my stuff (aka friends, activities, etc.).
I'd love for someone to raise their hand if they weren't somewhat of an asshole at 18 years old.
I was not an asshole at 18. I've learned to be one since then, though.
The boyfriend's mom is taking the girl's side, saying she heard a conversation between the dad and his daughter, "“My recollection was he said ‘Congratulations. You are turning 18 and there are two things you have yet to do: get pregnant or do drugs to the best of my knowledge. You will not be able to see the scumbag or the scumbag’s family anymore.’’’
I'm still on team parent, but the fact that so many people are taking the girl's side makes me wonder. Either there's more to the story or she's very, very good at manipulating people. Either one is possible.
I'm not clicking through to the link but I can imagine not feeling so generous toward parents who called me and my family scumbags. So, this doesn't sway me to thinking more charitably toward the daughter.
Also, I don't think what is excerpted that the dad said is all that bad. But, remember, I was raised down South experiencing nos. 7, 16 and 17 on that list.
I'm not suggesting this means the girl is in the right. The school is also on the girl's side, based on what they've been told and what they've observed. If I had to come to a conclusion, I might conclude that the girl is a master manipulator.
And maybe, because I was raised in an environment where everybody could and would check you AND you could get popped in the mouth for popping off at the mouth, I can't get my head around a child saying shit like she said to her parents and expecting to still get up every day and keep on livin' in the lap of luxury. My mother always told me that in her house, there was no democracy.
I believe you because I see them on TV calling their mamas bitches and yelling "I HATE YOU!" stomping off and slamming doors and I think, "them chaps ain't go no home training." LOL My grandma popped me in the mouth (lightly, it was more a tap but I got the point) a couple of years ago because I told her her to hush for a minute. I'M GROWN.
So based on the information available to me now, if this were ME, unless and until my child wanted to do what I asked her to do in the home I provided for her, she could stay her ass with them folks and they would be dead to me too, because you are undermining my parenting*.
*I have no children
if G even THINKS of talking to me the way this kid talked to her parents i will snatch the weave from her head. which will hurt quite a bit considering i doubt she'll have one.
I do not want to judge the girl or her parents. Apparently they separated and then got back together - god only knows what was said and done that that girl had to witness. She had an eating disorder which, even if the parents are *helpful* they can still cause issues for her by being their normal selves personality-wise.
It does seems like she's being manipulated in a bad way. I can't imagine telling a teenager to sue their parents. That's like the biggest rift of all. Take her in, help her switch to a public school her senior year, help her get a scholarship - fine. I'm all about helping someone get away from a bad environment and bad energy and helping them to do their own thing (even if they were part of that bad energy). Hell, maybe if the parents saw she was doing good and living her life they could still be civil on the phone and they'd even still give her college tuition $$. I can only hope that if my daughter found a healthier environment outside of my home that I'd still support her as a parent should. But this sounds like she has a group of adults around her that are trying to *get* these parents and using her as the way to get to them.
And maybe, because I was raised in an environment where everybody could and would check you AND you could get popped in the mouth for popping off at the mouth, I can't get my head around a child saying shit like she said to her parents and expecting to still get up every day and keep on livin' in the lap of luxury. My mother always told me that in her house, there was no democracy.
"This is no democracy. This is a dictatorship. I am the law." (I couldn't find a gif that had the quote!)
"Not gonna lie; I kind of keep expecting you to post one day that you threw down on someone who clearly had no idea that today was NOT THEIR DAY." ~dontcallmeshirley
And maybe, because I was raised in an environment where everybody could and would check you AND you could get popped in the mouth for popping off at the mouth, I can't get my head around a child saying shit like she said to her parents and expecting to still get up every day and keep on livin' in the lap of luxury. My mother always told me that in her house, there was no democracy.
My kids tried that democracy line and voted to have ice cream. I informed them that yes the United States of America is a democracy but in the Sunterp household we have a dictatorship. I am the Dictator and their father is the General. At this point in time the General is not going to help the peasants stage a revolution. Sorry no ice cream.